Boris Johnson's Latest 'Gaff'

I'm not sure who has a hateful or low opinion.
I think my grandson is the bees knees.
Tall, muscular, handsome, great sense of humour etc.
He still looks bloody stupid in skinny jeans though!

I'm not sure there is a prescribed British "culture".
As has been seen on Gransnet, the way people view the world and behave within it can be very different, even for people who were born in this country.

We have various religious branches/ethnic/cultural groups within this country, including various "branches" of Christianity, Judaism,Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism, etc etc. We do not all have the same beliefs and values or the same lifestyles and I think Gransnet demonstrates that point quite clearly.

In terms of their official position within society, these women are relatively powerless, although some might feel they are either brave or unwise to stand firm in the face of intimidation. To suggest that they are "up yours" ladies is an unfair and unsupported presumption and says more about your attitude towards them than theirs towards you.

It is, in my view, more likely to become a "growing ideology" if women like this are made to feel hated and like social outcasts. Why on earth would they want to interact with people who have such an extremely low and hateful opinion of them?

They are no more powerless than any other woman today.
Anyone who suspects that covering up is anything other than their own choice is running the risk of being branded a racist.

Eloethan
Insulting descriptions to be directed at a small minority of powerless women

By choosing to wear this garb when it is not a requirement and is an anathema in the country which they choose to live shows that these women are anything but powerless.
These are 'up yours' ladies who obviously enjoy the noteriety their garb brings whilst promoting the meek powerless demeanour. They are promoting a radical ideology which, if not challenged will result in unwilling others being forced by this growing ideology into the same peverse practices. We should be supporting the moderate muslims within our communities from this onslaught.

I agree Eleothan but by the same token should people who want to live in the UK not try to integrate and accept the culture of the country in which they have chosen to live.

I think Jess makes a very good point. It appears it is quite in order for insulting descriptions to be directed at a small minority of powerless women and that, apparently, they should not feel alarmed or upset by this quite blatant verbal attack. And yet we are given to understand that some of the same people who think it is in order to place these women at further actual physical risk from thugs and racists claim to be "frightened" or "intimidated" by these women's choice of clothing.

It was earlier in the thread suggested that it is only women wearing burkas who have been attacked, implying that they are somehow to blame for the aggression directed at them. I find such a notion very disturbing and, in any event, untrue. It is not just women wearing burkas who have been the subject of racially motivated attacks - women have been attacked just because they are wearing a head scarf - even Sikh males have been attacked for wearing a turban.

I don't think that the the thugs who do this sort of thing are "protecting the British way of life" (since several of them, including Tommy Robinson, were formerly known to the police as football hooligans that is rather ironic) or that they are frightened or intimidated by what these women wear. They are just part of the mindless rabble who enjoy hating and, when people like Johnson provide an opportune moment, like to put the boot in, whether metaphorically or literally.

mamacaz
Thank you

A friend met him in a supermarket and took a 'selfie' with him - I must ask her if he tousled his hair for the camera!

but just as he turned his coat over the referendum
Apparently after a lot of agonising and soul-searching MawBroon, so perhaps saying he turned his coat could be rather unfair.
I think he always held the EU in slight contempt as he did ridicule it in his journalistic days.

Lots of people were very indecisive and took a while to make a decision too.

I once saw him tousle his hair just before an interview in the street (Henley.)

Saying “one thing today “....

joelsnan Johnson likes to play the buffoon but he is highly intelligent, highly educated, articulate and writes entertainingly and with great flair.
However, he is playing a game. The tousled shock of hair?
He “tousles” it before the cameras are turned on (I have that from someone who worked with him), he is absolutely ruthless and unforgiving of opponents (same source), totally egocentric and ambitious.
So don’t be fooled.
Agree with him if you want, but just as he turned his coat over the referendum, be prepared to find him saying one today and the opposite tomorrow if he feels it will advance his political career.

... than you intended, that should have said.

Joelsnan

I do not appreciate capital letters especially when it was a genuine question which asked if your opinion was not based upon the media, then how was your opinion formed.

I apologise for the capitals, Joelsnan. I must have read something more to your question than I intended.

Is that because the media says so, or are there other ways of understanding a persons psyche without being told what to believe by the media?

Apart from the capitals, my answer is the same:

Nothing to do with what the media say. In fact, if we blindly accept things as the media present them, we might as stop 'discussing' politics right now!
My views are based on what I like to think is a realistic consideration of BJ's words and actions over the last few years. He is a politician. Some politicians seek nothing more than to represent their constituents. Others are in politics for what it can do for them. You already know which group I think BJ belongs to.

Mamacaz
Is that because the media says so, or are there other ways of understanding a persons psyche without being told what to believe by the media?

I do not appreciate capital letters especially when it was a genuine question which asked if your opinion was not based upon the media, then how was your opinion formed.

I have no absolute opinion on BJ. I understand that he did a good job as London Mayor and was respected. I have seen him in the media described as a bafoon. I know he sometimes speaks inappropriately and did mention in another thread that I wondered if he had Aspergers. All i wanted to understand was how people have such strong feelings about BJ and how these were formed, so please do not use capitals again.

Is it just me that does not see them as a ruling elite?

They are elected by us to carry out our wishes.

I cannot understand why, as so many are fervent remainers, EU citizens, they are not railing against Denmark and other countries where these head coverings are now banned.

Instead, people are saving their verbal onslaughts for a rather daft remark by a journalist cum politician.

I take your point, Day6. Yes, Boris is already a part of the ruling elite. However, I don't think it is an exaggeration to say that it's pretty clear that he is not content to settle for the position that he currently holds within that elite. He has much grander plans. In itself, there's nothing wrong with that, but it does matter how he goes about gaining that position.

Regarding most politicians having privilege, I am not sure. Does the ordinary backbench politician really have a position of privilege? I don't know enough about the workings of our parliamentary system to be sure, but on the face of it I doubt it.

18.40.37 Day6 good post.
Nobody has posted a ‘racist’ remark on here at all and yet one or two are determined to paint most posters as little Englanders who can’t stand immigrants.Wrong! This thread is about Johnson’s comments and should not spill over into
Criticisms of posters.
It’s not a race situation or even a religious one really, since it’s a cultural attitude only.
It’s not a right wing versus left wing thing either, since those on both sides abhor the burka and veil.
We are a very tolerant society in the UK ( much more so than many European countries) and so far have not banned these costumes, whether we should or not is another matter.

^ Being too scared to go to the hospital because one of the doctors might not look and sound exactly like your own family?^
That is not a fair comparison at all.
One can see the doctors' facial expressions.

Burkas are not allowed to be worn by hospital staff - not where I live, anyway. It is against the terms and conditions of employment - there needs to be trust between medical staff and patient, and that cannot be built up if a patient cannot see the face of a doctor or nurse, or any medical practitioner.

I suppose quite simply we expect our politicians to be a bit more circumspect.
Yes, 'Statesmanlike' - seems to have disappeared these days though, Bridgeit

Best not to paint yourself into too small a comfort zone as you get older I think.
^ Where does it end? Staying indoors because you're scared of anyone who is not exactly like you maybe?^
^ Being too scared to go to the hospital because one of the doctors might not look and sound exactly like your own family?^

What a pathetic and insulting analogy JessM

There are people from all walks of life (like Angela Merkel for one ) who find a covered face insulting, strange, disturbing. So she is narrow minded and frightened of anything not familiar to her then?

We are a diverse and multicultural nation and most of us have accepted and welcome diversity. The French famously use "Vive la Difference!" yet in France (and other countries) face covering is now against the law.

Diversity is fine by me and most people. Having to address a robed body and veiled face and head where only the eyes show through slits in the cloth is not.

I suppose quite simply we expect our politicians to be a bit more circumspect.

And yes, Jalima, good point, the electorate give them that power.

"You mock PECS, but do you truly believe that Boris doesn't aspire to that? To me, it is as plain as the nose on my face!"

My point was - he IS part of the ruling elite already. How much more 'elite' can politicians be? He has held cabinet positions.

Most politicians have privilege.. and Boris has already been Mayor of London. He and the rest of them ARE the ruling elite, Corbyn included who has the means to oppose government directly. They ARE the elite whether you like them or not.

(I doubt very much that he'd ever lead the Conservative Party as he is too blunder-prone, but stranger things have happened.)