Boris Johnson's Latest 'Gaff'

There is outcry because Boris Johnson likened the look to a pillar box. Long ago on 'Live at the Apollo' (I think) a stand up comedian said he used to crouch down and speak to his Muslim neighbours through their letter box as that was how they preferred to communicate.

This was left wing BBC stuff and it raised laughs. Perhaps Boris saw the programme too? (Must have been on repeat because it was mentioned years ago.)

She shared a tweet which said that "those abused girls in Rotherham and elsewhere just need to shut their mouths for the sake of diversity" She later said she shared it by accident. I don't remember anything like the outcry about that as there has been about the remarks by Boris Johnson.

Wow TerriBull that is far more shocking than anything buffoon Boris ever said!

She sounds a real charmer!

Whilst the furore surrounding BJ's remarks continue, some wanting an apology. I'm just contemplating how this tweet by a female MP Naz Shah slipped under the radar and hardly seem to raise an eyebrow at the time "white girls need to shut their mouths in the interests of diversity" aimed at the abused young women of Rotherham. Boris comments show an insensitivity but that tweet demonstrated an uncaring callousness in the extreme.

It must be deliberate, surely?
Not his legs: his lack of diplomacy?

Oh I think Boris leaves himself wide open to criticism, every time he opens his mouth Jalima!

He's turned it into an art form! As for his white legs, they probably bear more scrutiny than mine, unfortunately!

It's amazing that this discussion has turned on white and middle class people, most of whom cannot help being white and middle class.
Am I allowed to say that I didn't think much of Boris's white hairless legs in that photo posted on the thread? They looked very, um, well, white. Not to mention what he was wearing?

Please tell me I'm allowed and won't get into trouble.

The point about racism, which some seem to have failed to comprehend, is it is about the more dominant & powerful group, in this country white British, threatening, denigrating or undermining a minority group

But is there a threat? I see thr threat as the one we face by having people walking in our midst in a disguise which means we haven't a clue who is under the robes. Is a group 'undermined' when it's mentioned they follow a practice which is alien to the western world?

I'd certainly agree that BJ could have worded his comment better, so yes, denigration applies, but if people feel threatened by a practice which flies in the face of everything they hold dear - ie: communicating face to face as has been the western way for thousands of years - should we not comment?

Does multiculturism mean that the native culture, which has now happily become much more accepting and tolerant of the ways of others, doesn't count for anything?

It's amazing that this discussion has turned on white and middle class people, most of whom cannot help being white and middle class. Have they become the most vilified section of British society? Shall we do away with them and keep the face veil?

Never mind the face cover-up, let's get that white bloke because he objects to it.

Hmm

JenniferEccles
They call their name so recognise their voice

PECS
I would contest that no one hates the Burka'd woman.
Having lived in the Middle East where this garb originates. I have had to refuse to interview veiled women who were not prepared to remove their veil in the workplace.

The majority of girls who wear the face cover in the UK do so exactly as a provocative statement. True followers of Islam know that only modest dress is called for. It is a uniform, just as Goths wear their black clothes and the Steam Punkers wear theirs. We should not allow the veil, but if they want to wear the Abaya and Shaila then that would be their choice.

Someone earlier asked a very important question along the lines of how do the children recognise their own mother at the school gates??!!! So, just how do they?

I certainly don't hate Muslim women.
Why would I?
They've done nothing to me.

I live in a multicultural area. When out shopping, I usually see 1 or 2 young women wearing the veil.

But every time a public figure talks about the veil, the numbers I see out and about increase. It is as if they want to show solidarity with each other.

Looks like if we want women to stop wearing it, we are best just ignoring the subject, and maybe the custom will die out.

The point about racism, which some seem to have failed to comprehend, is it is about the more dominant & powerful group, in this country white British, threatening, denigrating or undermining a minority group. What a very few Muslim women choose to wear in this country is of minor importance when we look at the context of the political mess we are in as a country 're Brexit and the increase in fascism and right wing extremes. Johnson chose very carefully when he made that comment. He wants the support of the right wing/ UKIPPERS to get him into power. He is no fool. Most people who get indignant have probably never spoken to a Muslim woman wearing a veil but they hate her nevertheless.

Maybe you're not offended 'lyndiloo' because you're a white middle class Daily Mail reader!

You see, I think attitudes like this (above)are also a problem. People are demonised because they are middle class and white! Try slagging off other areas of society and watch the outcry!

We are terrified to be white middle, class and to agree that criticism of some groups IS valid!

It's so very right-on not to be offended and if you are, well don't voice those opinions whatever you do, because - OMG, you'll be criticised for being white, middle class and literate! (Reading the Daily Mail is a very tired and over used slur.)

I am extremely uncomfortable when confronted by women with their faces covered with their eyes the only part of them visible.

It is not appropriate in a liberal western society that women should be faceless. Religious, patriarchal intolerance that demands women do not show themselves to men has no place in a forward-looking western society that values equality of the sexes. We use our faces to denote empathy, understanding, grief - the whole gamut of emotions. How do we communicate fully with a woman covered from head to toe in cloth?

We quite rightly abhor those who wear balaclavas for nefarious purposes - try walking around covered up like that if you are a white, middle class female, and as for going into a bank or government office - forget it!

Johnson has started a discussion which needs to be had. As unusual he employs his 'red rag to a bull tactics' but when you sweep issues that concern the public under the carpet, resentment festers.

Has anyone mentioned how difficult it is for us hard of hearing people to understand unless we can see the lips moving? I think it is very inconsiderate of anyone to cover their face if they wish to have a conversation. Wear what you like, but think first whether it will inconvenience others.

Precisely.
I'm only missadventure.
He is Boris Johnson.

MissAdventure you say you think it was atrocious of Johnson to make that remark? (Today 16.50)
But according to you
They just do look like letter boxes (16.35)

And if anybody thinks that Johnson made a gaffe or a throwaway silly comment they clearly know nothing about writing a weekly column or indeed about its highly educated writer. No approbation intended by that description.
It is all carefully calculated.

I think its atrocious that Boris has said these things, in whatever context.
There again, I also thought the trump blimp was foul too.
They're like a bunch of unruly children.

Sorry icanhandthemback but he did

I would go further and say that it is absolutely ridiculous that people should choose to go around looking like letter boxes .....
If a female student turned up at school or at a university lecture looking like a bank robber then ditto
The rights and wrongs of veil/burka/niqab wearing are not the issue, it is Johnson’s deliberately insulting and inflammatory language which is.
The many posts objecting to veil/niqab/burka wearing on this thread alone prove my point.

Plenty of Muslim women who do not, and would not, wear the Niqab. In fact, in this country the majority don’t and wouldn’t.

BRIGGI668 I applaud you and agree with you wholeheartedly ?

Maybe you're not offended 'lyndiloo' because you're a white middle class Daily Mail reader! His comment was racist and designed to further incite islamophobia