Labour Party Conference

lemon Everybody I know ( up and down the UK) has a library service
Well 478 libraries have closed since 2010 and 8000 staff been lost. I suppose the people most affected are those you don't know-you know the poor working class people!
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/dec/15/tories-libraries-social-mobility-conservative
Really the people who swallow this 'necessary austerity' claptrap fascinate me. It's the best sales job I have ever seen. The Conservative party do not believe in public services, they would prefer a smaller state and less intervention. And austerity has given them the opportunity to pursue their belief and sell it to others as justified. The amazing thing is that people bought it!!!

I was in a branch of my bank today. Not my branch of course, as it has shut down. It was quite an unpleasant experience. It was a relatively simple thing, which had been done at my local branch before. " No they couldn't do it. We don't do that here"
Sickening really.

Well Annie I see labour are adding Catholics to their hit list! Andy Kerrs remark to a questioner in the auditorium yesterday has had widespread coverage in the Scottish press.With the religious divide being what it is/was in thes part of the world and Labour traditionally having the catholic vote you could say they've shot themselves in the foot AGAIN.Confirmed by George Galloway who tells that Kerr was appalled when he found out Galloway was in his words "A FENIAN" Labour wont win back their Scottish voters after this .

Sorry Gill but at times you sound very naive indeed.

I'm sorry, lemon but you're the one who is sounding very naive.

You (and I have to say, a lot of other people) have swallowed hook line and sinker the myth that a national economy is like a household economy. On the whole, economists will tell you completely differently.

Here are a whole lot of economists telling you it's not:

duckduckgo.com/?q=is+the+national+economy+like+a+household+economy&atb=v128-7__&ia=web

And here is a Nobel Laureate economist telling you about the 'austerity delusion'

www.theguardian.com/business/ng-interactive/2015/apr/29/the-austerity-delusion

(Forget that it's in the Guardian; the message is important not the media that carries it)

As far as the everyday economy is concerned it doesn't matter if it is the government spending money on public services; the thing that matters is that there is money circulating in the economy. That people are being paid wages which they can spend on goods and services, thus keeping businesses going and which eventually returns to the government by way of tax (because just about every transaction is taxed). Government spending on nationalised industries also benefits the private businesses it deals with directly (because all nationalised industries and public services, such as education, buy from private business) which also means money circulating in the economy and a return by way of the tax take. Money spent by the government is no different from money spent by private companies or individuals. There's no special 'government money' which is somehow inferior to 'private' money.

And this is not some batty leftie idea. It has perfectly respectable origins in Keynesianism (which drove recovery from the 1930s Great Depression)

I could critique tory 'austerity' (and some on here have pointed to its failures) but I won't because economic theory should be neutral. But plenty of economists have done so.

trisher I didn’t say that no library branches have closed,
But in most places there are still open libraries, even if some have closed or slimmed down hours.
Schools, hospitals and the police are still operating, honestly you would think Armageddon had arrived to see what some people write on here.
No, trisher the amazing thing is that after a huge financial crash some seem to think everything should be able to carry on as normal!
OldBatty bank closures have zilch to do with austerity
measures. The rise of Internet banking has contributed to that.Banks are there to make money.

I didn’t hear that Paddyann, why would Kerr be surprised !

Really the people who swallow this 'necessary austerity' claptrap fascinate me. It's the best sales job I have ever seen.

Snap! trisher

I understand that even the IMF is rejecting it....

I suppose I would be South Midlands and I can't say it's exactly booming but we have effectively full employment, if you wanted to employ an unskilled worker you would be paying £10 an hour plus, that is the going rate for cleaners, care workers and hospitality. There are a lot of migrants from a wide range of countries, if they went home it would cause real problems immediately because a lot of them are skilled. They cannot be replaced by locally recruited staff and that applies to welders and truck drivers as much as nurses and chefs.

This must sound like we're in clover but there is a downside, housing costs are very high. There is plenty of part time work so those on benefits in social housing, can easily manage, it is those that cannot work for whatever reason that have problems.

Yes, we're lucky we work hard and pay our taxes, any one is free to move here, please please do.

MaizieD For every economist with one viewpoint you can find another with the opposite one.
No, a country isn’t the same as a household, but that doesn't mean that public spending shouldn’t be curbed for a while.
If it was as easy as you imply then no country would ever be in financial difficulties after a worldwide crash.

banks closing mean a huge section of the population is unable to cope. Communities ruined by greed.

A huge section of the population unable to cope, because a bank has closed?
It has nothing to do with the government, and banks are not charities.It is an inconvenience ( banks closing ) nothing more.

It’s a symptom of ‘the way we live now’ which is also why some stores are closing,

MaizieD For every economist with one viewpoint you can find another with the opposite one.

They're actually pretty unanimous about the 'household' myth. And if you want to dispute what I they're saying I'd be happy to see pages of search results which say the opposite. Until then it's just your word against a whole lot of experts.

Anyone at all want to talk about the Labour Conference? No?

Lemon. I have said time and time again that I do not vote Labour. I do not like or trust corbyn and his cronies. I will ignore your snide remarks about my perhaps knowing someone in prison. Your foolish belief that everything is well in this most perfect of places with this most compassionate and generous of governments does however explain why you cannot wait for Brexit and voted believing all the lies you were told.

Who said it was perfect? But some on here seem to believe that the majority are on Skid Row, when that is far from true.
Your last sentence doesn’t make sense as this government actually didn’t want Brexit and Cameron made a huge mistake by thinking the population didn’t either.
It’s a conceit of Remainers to think all who voted to Leave believed lies.
However, this thread is not about Brexit, but the Labour Conference, and it’s funny that nobody wants to talk about it.

Actually lemon the grown ups were discussing the Labour party conference and our opinions of today and the speakers. It was you who started the silly scare stories of the UK under a Labour government. I may be wrong, it may have been someone else, but I can't be bothered reading your posts again. Anyway I am now watching Newsnight reports on the Labour party conference.

Childish post Gill but what I expected.Yes, somebody should watch it.

I can't decide whether I dislike Len McCluskey more than I dislike Corbyn. Listen to his rant was chilling. They are getting more unelectable by the hour ☹

I'd be very wary of pumping lots more money into the economy based on economic algorithms. I just remember the hyperinflation in the old days of the lire and also the mark resulting in crazy amounts in the thousands for a loaf of bread. People's savings eroded in value, runs on the bank etc etc. There's something about remembering the lessons of history or being doomed to repeat them.
A far more canny line needs to be followed.

We desperately do need to pump more money into our public services.

What do you think quantitative easing was, Jane?

Tax is a control for inflation.

That said, I'd be happy to hear a coherent explanation of how taking money out of an economy makes it grow.

Jane10 Polititians never learn the lessons of history they think they are smart and can do better, they're not, they're far too short term .

Old Meg The only way they will get more money for services is taxation that's difficult and unpopular but they really ought to tax multinationals properly. Nationalization of utilities is going to take a lot of investment, we are paying a lot extra to fund renewables and upgrading, this is not going to go away.

They have always been unelectable ( Corbyn, McDonnell )
But at least more people are recognising that now.
McDonnell is a proud Marxist, Corbyn likes to hide the fact that he is too.McCluskey is salivating for a return to the bad old days when unions ran the country.
I don’t think the LP will give the chance of a second vote on
Leaving the EU, just, if pushed will go for people deciding what deal.Since they are not in power though, they can’t actually offer anything.

If the LP follow the deselection line proposed they will be even more unelectable, agree with JC or you're out.
I'm a labour voter but I'm not going to cross the road to vote for a gang of communists, so we're doomed to suffer the Tories but at least some of them will be sensible.
, not slaves to Marxism.