Bullying Remainers

Ireland, if there is no deal there will have to be a border between north and south, the only comment I have heard about that is that NI will ignore it and leave to to the south to police it as they wish.

I'm not sure how that will work does any one else have any information on that.

Luckylegs I’m not sure if you don’t understand who is doing the bullying or you don’t know who is a Remainer and who is a Brexiteer.
It’s rather unfair to label Remainers as bullies, when it’s clear that Theresa May is being “bullied” by Jacob Rees-Mogg, Steve Baker, James Brokenshire etc who are hard right Brexiteer members of the ERG (European Research Group) members, who are asking for a vote of no confidence in the Prime Minister. The Brexiteers really don’t like the Brexit deal she has negotiated.
As Jura says, it’s impossible to get a Brexit deal as good as the one we already have as an EU member.

But if a Government doesn't live up to its promises we can have another vote for a different Government. Why not the same for the referendum?

We would never have anyone in Government if we could do that Nonnie ?

Smileless please explain your reasoning because it is beyond me.

If I bought something which promised lots of wonderful features and then discovered it didn't live up to its promises I would have a right to take it back. Surely the same applies if I vote for something which doesn't live up to the promises made?

Why are leavers so worried about another vote? If the people decided and are still happy with their decision then the vote will go the same way.

And your answers to the questions above, perhaps?

The referendum result was to leave the EU so IMO if there were to be another vote (why it's referred too as 'The Peoples' Vote' is beyond me as 'the people' voted first time around) it should be to vote on the proposed deal or to leave with no deal and not to get the initial decision to leave, reversed.

Lucky- agreed - but the title of your thread is just wrong.

It is the Leavers, ERJ, who are doing the bullying.

Not sure about that perfect deal though - a middle way that will allow the UK to have all the rights, but none of the constraints, cost or responsibilities, à la 'cake and eat it' has never been, and never will be, on the table.

So at the moment, the choice is either 'Mrs May's deal' and it is very flawed, NO DEAL which would be disastrous in a million of ways- or Remain, which is the best deal ever.

And the people should have the right to choose- now they know. A People's Vote would be a huge risk, I agree-.

Someone today wrote on FB- if 48% want a sweet deal, and 52% a savoury one - serving bacon trifle may not satisfy anyone.

What about Ireland- backstop shorterm, and then??? Scotland, that voted massively remain- cannot accept a deal that will give serious advantages to Ireland and Northern Ireland. I have always been strongly in favour of keeping the Union intact- but if this happens, there is a real risk the SNP would win this time.

This article in the New Statesman is spot on, Nonnie. George Eaton points to the crux of the matter-

"The problem is not that May has failed to deliver on the Leave campaign’s promises – the problem is that no prime minister could have done so. In 2016, the Brexiteers vowed to end free movement, retain the economics benefits of EU membership, withdraw the UK from the customs union and avoid a hard Irish border – aims that were inherently irreconcilable."

I don't think David Cameron had much of a choice but to hold the referendum after he failed to renegotiate our agreement with the EU. Surely that failure should have made everyone see that it would never be possible to get a 'good deal' with the EU? It was always blindingly obvious. See: www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2018/11/brexiteers-only-have-themselves-blame-uk-s-disastrous-fate?fbclid=IwAR2DRv3pc0i7uT3BBbG16RwQAZF68_SNgmAayb6p8gltHFt5OSL4eU9HVk0

Yes Germany had its first reversal in growth since 2015, mostly accounted for by a slow down in sales to China who are facing tariffs from US, but that doesn’t make them “broke” as the OP says, they are still a much stronger economy than the U.K.
U.K. productivity is the lowest out of the G7. Google it . May would have done better to make her compromises right from the start and tell people they won’t get everything they want, the vote was a close one so we’ll exit but keep as close a relationship as possible with the EU, we won’t cut all ties as it will damage the U.K. economy, then she might have sold it to us. It’s a bit late now.

Luckylegs working together can’t work because the country was basically cut in half by a question that never needed to be asked and was asked with no correct information being given to the general public The EU was/ is far from perfect but it’s always better to be within to changed things than outside alone We did good within the ‘club’ and we ve had 70 years of peace but now not only the general public are split but the conservative government is cut in half the Labour Party is cut in half
One of the main culprits along with Cameron was the dreadful lying beer swilling hypocrite called Farage who whipped up all the wobblers with his ‘fake’ information then swanned off fag in hand

We are in the midst of a non combative civil war, if we were a more outwardly passionate country we would be fighting each other on the streets
This will take decades to sort out it is a ruined country to pass to our children and grandchildren

What is hard to understand is this. If we are a Democracy and a majority outcome decides to leave, why cannot everyone work together to get a good deal for us? Both sides are scoring points, stabbing colleagues in the back, Europe needs us so will not agree to anything, in fact, making it so difficult, we will cave in. What sort of relationship would we have with them if,we went back for another referendum, it is such a ridiculous scenario it doesn't bare considering. Vote after vote trying to get another out one suiting everyone. I sincerely hope Theresa doesn't cave in to this bullying, she is keeping her word her word to the country even though that wouldn't have been her choice. Isn't that what decent people do? Keeping your word, showing determination in the face of adversity and working to the
common good, this will show just who has integrity and we can trust if nothing else. I am disgusted by those in the Tory party throwing their rattles out of the pram. Good riddance,
If they cannot support their leader and come up with anything else they have shown what stuff they are made of. David Cameron was a disgrace instigating all this and walking away, he didn't fall on his sword like a real hero, he ran because he didn't know how to handle what he started, Weak doesn't cover it. Where are the decent, nice people who gave integrity and don't fight in the gutter?

Varian has there a perfect example of rudeness

The whole sorry saga would never have happened had Cameron not been trying to see off the swivel-eyed bulling Tory ultra-brexiters.

I don't understand how the OP says "bullying remainers". It's the hardline Brexiter's in May's own party who are bullying her. For ordinary people, it is the Brexiters who have been rude to Remainers saying things like "you lost, tough luck, shut up now".

UK GDP ranks 18th out of 28 EU countries

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita

UK is performing above EU on growth and Youth employment

Not just Putin, the instigator of brexit, but the whole world, is laughing at us.

crystaltipps?? Where did you get your info?

German GDP growth figures have yesterday been released for the third quarter this year. Official numbers now show that the German economy actually contracted by 0.2% in the third quarter, 0.6% below what was forecast. Meanwhile, Italy is completely stagnant. This latest release comfortably puts the UK at the top of the EU ‘big four’ growth league…

Which EU countires have higher growth and productivity than UK?

Don't all these back stabbers realise that the horrifying outcome of all this could be Corbyn getting into no. 10?

That of course would be infinitely worse than a bad deal, no deal or even no Brexit

English is a funny language- as you can read the title completely differently.

She is not being bullied by Remainers, but by her own Cabinet, extreme Leavers. No?!?

Isn't it Jacob Rees Mogg, a prominent leaver, who has issued a letter of no confidence in Theresa May and discussed which people would be a better PM- totally stabbing her in the back.