Put it to the people march - are you going?

I never said PH supported TM’s deal! I was replying to jura2 doom and gloom by saying PH was upbeat about the state of our economy.

Annoyingly, it could be both. Or neither.
I just happen to believe Leavers are more optimistic. Maybe we’re deluded. But then we are happier. I know I can’t change anything. So I have to accept it.
Remainers want to battle on.
We shall have to agree to disagree.

You ought to read the whole of Hammond’s statement before you see it as support for May’s deal- and yet you claim all politicians lie- is that all except Hammond?

Why are Leavers on here launching personal attacks on remainers , whilst banging on about remainers criticising leavers’ views ( not personal attacks). And, according to some on here it’s perfectly ok for politicians to lie , it’s perfectly ok for May to keep presenting her unchanged WA to parliament despite it having been defeated by the biggest majority in parliamentary history, bribing opponents to vote for her deal, yet it somehow undemocratic to give the people a second vote. Talk about cognitive dissonance or is it barefaced hypocrisy?

I think I’d rather believe gloomy Mr Hammond than the furious jura2

Brilliant news petra ??
Shall we start up a ‘Brexit good news thread’? There are about 4 Brexit threads already and perhaps we ought to - what do you think? To be honest I’m getting in a muddle posting on all these, hopping from one to another which now have little to do with the OP question! One of them is about the march in London and has morphed.
?

Exactly MaizieD so Remainers need to address their annoyance to those higher up the food chain! As I said earlier, what can us Leaver voters do about any of it? Nada.

Again Jane, what a shame - unpleasant choice of very derogatory words- which I would have never expected from you. A pity.

Where I am currently, or Maizie for that matter - makes little difference to how we are personally affected- and our children, grandchildren, family and friends.

But for me, and I suspect for Maizie - the fact we strongly feel that we are better together (your words about Scotland - although we were a strong partner with a strong influence in the EU, which Scotland does not seem to have in the UK) - it goes far beyond personal matters. I imagine Maizie, and se feel tell me if she does not agree, like me- feels that the world faces so many really important, even vital, issues, be it with terrorism, war, climate change and the environment- that we need to tackle as a strong union. SAme for essential research and inovation- which needs the best brains working together, and the finance behind it- be it to cure disease or to solve the above issues and so many more.

In the meantime, there is a very sinister alt right group, with Bannon and Banks, and Putin, Trump - aided by the likes of Farage and co- working at distablising Europe, and to ultimately destroy it - with the ultimate rise of the Alt Far Right. Please, open your eyes and minds to this true enemy.

In plain speak that means: there's fault on both sides so one cancels out the other.

Leavers even speak a different language.

In Remain 'plain speak' it means that someone high up in the political order has something to hide.

Urmstongran
Some good news ?
Reed Recruitment moved their company back to the uk
last year. The owner said that although he voted to remain he saw wonderful potential here in the uk, post Brexit.

too politically sensitive
In plain speak that means: there's fault on both sides so one cancels out the other.

Are you saying jura2 that our Chancellor of the Exchequer does not have a true grasp of the situation in the country?

Yup, I think that's what she's saying.

I think it's interesting that the OBR forecasts don't actually chime with reality. Forecast in Oct 2018: growth of 1.6%, now downgraded to 1,2%. They've left the others unchanged so as to look good before they are downgraded at the next budget...

It's the growth figures that are the most significant.

The deficit may well be down by a few percentage points, but it's at the expense of shrinking the economy by cuts to public spending. That's why the growth forecast is down, it's because the economy is shrinking.

It's strange that all of you who are so comfortable with the fact that lying is endemic in politics are happy to believe some, but not others. All chancellors talk up the economy; take it with a pinch of salt...

lemongrove that's exactly it. She's obsessed about it all and pontificates on so many threads from her home in Switzerland.

If you are happy with May’s deal and believe everything is going well, you must be in a minority.

jura you are determined to do things down, even when the evidence shows our economy is doing well, and if Parliament accept May’s deal will continue to do well.
Why?
Simply put..because you are angry about Brexit.

Are you saying jura2 that our Chancellor of the Exchequer does not have a true grasp of the situation in the country? That would be a very strange state of affairs when he was preparing his Spring Statement!

Hammond says one thing - reality says another.

How many jobs lost so far, how many businesses moved (mainly from people who voted Leave, like Dyson and co)- how man billions lost?

Instead do 350 million going to the NHS- so far since the vote, the result has cost 500m a week- and probably a lot more.

No anger directed to Leavers here - but explanations as to why many of us feel that a) the tiny majority was won fraudulently and so many ways b) that there are dark powers at work here we should be concerned about c) that the only democratic thing to do now, with both Labour and Tories completely split on how to go ahead- is to take it back to the people- now they know what the alternatives and consequences are.

Politely and calmly - whereas terms as 'the likes of ...' are incredibly rude.

Hammond said the country would be in be in good shape if there was a good deal. urmstongran why criticise others for doing what you are doing yourself? ( criticising other voters) A bit of pot and kettle going on.

I can understand how so many of you are furious at the result of the referendum. But what does taking it out on us Leavers achieve? It’s not our personal fault! We voted. Same as you. Perhaps your anger should be directed to those in power.

I just think that Remainers on here are ‘glass half full’ people. Strange isn’t it that all the quoted dire predictions are at odds with the recent good news from the Eeyore himself, Mr Phil Hammond? Only Thursday he was telling us the country is in great shape!

remain lies you mean, of course.

One of the most worrying aspects of all this - is that it seems now clear, that the Government has prevented Police and the Met from investigating those issues - as they are 'too politically sensitive'.

No comments yet on my last post? I’ll wait.
I’m renowned for my patience.

No comment because it's only a week or so since someone else published a strangely similar list (copied and pasted from a Leavers site? I do wish people would be honest about what they post and differentiate their c & p jobs from their own words) I responded to it at some length. I suppose I should have kept a copy of my response so that I can keep reposting it for people who didn't bother to read it the first time.

I would note that I have also asked for explanations of Leave lies but with absolutely no response, ever...

There are lies- and lies. Some are very deliberate- others, in this case, we predictions of what was likely to happen. Some of them have not happened, because the economy was shored up in the meantime. But many are coming tragically true, one by one- like the loss of 1000s of jobs, the EU staff who are leaving the NHS as well as agriculture and lots of other fields. And the humongous cost of Brexit so far...

But let's leave all that aside. People who do not realise that there has been a very sinister manipulation of the Referendum, very illegally, from outside with help from inside - are being very naïve.

So let's stick to proven foreign interference, and Farage and Banks working with Trump, Putin and alt right groups (well I suppose I could be accused of that, lol) - what about dodgy money, from the same people. What about illegal and hidden targeting of some groups. What about Bank using all his Insurance staff to campaign, undeclared, for months? Very sinister.

Politicians lie. It’s their M.O. We’d be daft to believe otherwise. So, de facto, both sides lied during the referendum campaign. They know it, we all know it.

It’s not going to change anything as they are all in cahoots together over this so we just have to sit on the side with our popcorn and see how this plays out. The only influence Joe Pleb ever gets is at the ballot box.