Putting Humpty Dumpty together again

People can’t see further than the nose on their face without immigration this small country will flounder and this whole sorry mess can destabilise the whole of the EU
No one has ever told me what is so bad about the EU
I m afraid I don’t have a share in Gonegirls unicorns mine all ran away
I think it is going to take well beyond our generations demise to get back to where we were
It was only an advisory referendum so is breaking all democracy to make almost half the country plus a new generation coming up fast do something so detrimental as to shoot their own heads off

Divisions between haves and gave nots were widening before brexit and not just in UK.
I expect that in the fullness of time we will resolve most things. We recovered from the wars (at much personal cost) so I expect this will be OK (not necessarily great though). One thing will change- parliament has made a mockery of democracy. The internal party splits and differences of opinion on all sides is just a shambles. All around I hear people saying 'FFS just get on with it!'. The next general election will be interesting.
Re reconciliation : referendums with only 50% required inevitably lead to fierce divisions and lasting animosity. The Scottish independence referendum is an example of this. The side that lost constantly wants to rerun it. Will they keep going until they get their way? It's a form of bullying and can only lead to further hostility. No more referendums unless 65% required for major change.

PGA girl. Yes and many people died because they were on the "wrong" side. Not quite an appropriate comparison. The divisions in this country will worsen after Brexit I think as politicians have failed to acknowledge the reasons behind many people's vote to leave. Divisions between the have and have nots will continue to widen.

I wonder if we all realise, that this the second Brexit in which we as a nation have taken part. It took some time to settle last time but eventually we came through it and thrived as a country. Of course I am talking about the Tudor Brexit, when we threw over the rules of the catholic church in Europe and became a self determining country, making our own rules and keeping our own wealth within the country.

But it isn’t just about their intent when they voted and what they knew then but how many have behaved since when they knew more. Look at some of the recent posts on here calling the March and the petition attacks on democracy. I’m never going to be reconciled with people who believe that nor people who would back JRM or BJ for PM

I believe different people had different reasons for wanting out, and a lot of it was immigration. Nothing to do with the good of the country.

Hmmm.

I think a first step might be to recognise that however an individual may have voted they had no intent to cause harm to the country - either by leaving or by remaining in the EU. The politicians may have a lot to answer for, but I believe that individuals on both sides voted for something they thought was right, based on the information they had at the time.

Very interesting paddyanne. Perhaps some of those on GN who think he would make a fine leader would like to comment? But, back to the OP; I think the damage done is going to be very hard to ignore it forgive in my case. Going through economic turmoil for no good purpose can be justified. We have seen some awful behaviour from many of our political representatives and the dismissal of opposing opinion has been frightening. If as I fear, we do crash out, I will find it very hard to forgive those who have done this to me and mine, not so much those who believed the lies they were told, I shall reserve my anger for those who spouted the lies and misinformation and for the press who printed the one sided ptopaganda.

and top of the pile of Brexiteers who have gained is JRM

Jacob Rees-Mogg’s Company Accounts show c£103M profit over last 5 years, but paid ZERO UK corporation tax as ultimate ownership in Cayman Islands. No contribution for schools, hospitals, roads, defence, public services, welfare etc. No wonder he is keen to avoid new EU tax laws.

I share your concern grannyA and I’m struggling to see a way foward. I’d echo your post trisher, sad and difficult times indeed.

* humptydumpty* Awww!

humptydumpty oh no!
I hope you are in no need of being put together again.

I suppose it depends on what you term as "being OK". For most of us oldies life may be a bit more difficult, but it is the younger generation who will suffer most. Human rights act repealed, no access to jobs in the EU, no funding from the EU, lower pay and worse working conditions. I am so sad about that. Add the rise of the right wing who, have no doubt, will see this as a major victory and will begin to be even more extreme and you have a sorry future. Of course at the top end those who have already made provision and safeguarded their money will in fact benefit and make more cash. It is Humpty Dumpty and unless someone intervenes and stops this, once he is off the wall, there will be no putting him together again, at least not in our lifetimes.

humptydumpty
hope you are feeling OK

On a trivial note - am very relieved that this post is not about me!

To be absolutely honest, I think the ones who would be most likely to cause civil unrest are the ones who will be getting their way. So they will have no need. The ones left feeling sore and wounded are the ones with children, and their futures to think about, and foresight, and, dare I say it? - a modicum of commonsense. They will not cause trou ble in our streets. I think they will accept it graciously and try to move forward.

I realise that will bring the wrath of GNrs upon me. Sorry Ga. I know you wouldn't want your thread to go that way. But I think it is a fact.

It'll be fine. Stop worrying. Communities will sort themselves out as much as they ever have done. The haters were there before all this happened and they will still be there after. But normal life will be resumed.

Yes, I watched it all yesterday. Leave 'em to thrash it out. They probably will. No one wants a no deal.

'perfectly good relations with the rest of Europe will ensue'.
I think that is a far more likely scenario because it is in their interests too, than the two 'sides' ever coming together in the UK.

I was thinking more about communities than countries Gonegirl and much as I would like to believe you're right I think the divisions run very deep from what I've seen and heard, and they will not be healed quickly nor easily.

Ginny - we don't have time now, you're right, but by the end of the year we will be in a new situation and it's what happens then that concerns me. I know of families who have fallen out and friends who are barely on speaking terms and I wonder how they will break down the barriers so that good relationships can be restored. I feel very glad that within my own group of friends and relatives we haven't quarreled, but Brexit has exposed some harsh realities. For instance it has revealed a previously unknown (to me) deep seated racism in a family member and although it isn't someone I have direct contact with very much, I am disturbed by the knowledge.

maryeliza said it for me and better. It will take a very very loooong time.

GG we are in a very bad situation. Did you watch events in Parliament last night? Did you read the tweets

'perfectly good relations with the rest of Europe will ensue'. Really?

Sorry Pollyanna, but 'hunky-dory' is a long way away.

Perhaps we are taking it a bit too heavy?

Once we are out - and we have to be out, like it or not - I think things will settle down and everything will be hunky-dory again. Trade deals will be done, perfectly good relations with the rest of Europe will ensue, and people will forget all this.

Call me Pollyanna if you wish, but it's what I truly think.

PS. When we were trying to resolve the NI conflict we used an 'honest broker' in retired US Senator George Mitchell which resulted in the Good Friday agreement being signed. Truth and Reconciliation Commissions have had some success in parts of the world (S. Africa, Canada) but they take time and that's something we don't appear to have.

I may change my response to your post as the day goes on and I've had more time to read what Parliament intends to do next, but right now an apology by the Tory party for placing the nation in this mess in order to resolve internal issues would be a start. The rifts within the two main parties have been laid bare for all to see and it's a sad day for democracy in the UK. So much anger and hatred in tweets last night, it's frightening.

Perhaps all the King's horses and all the King's men can't actually put Humpty together again, and would need a new model of poor old Humpty.