Peers wanting to remove pensioners' benefits

There are more ways to raise money for the NHS than taxing the sick.

I'm another that has to wait till I'm 66 for my bus pass I have to use buses as I live in Yorkshire lots of hills and I walk with a stick I am only 62 so I have awhile to wait. My hubby has only just got his bus pass we should have the bus passes when we are retired. So we can enjoy going out it's a huge expense just getting there.

But if you retire below SPA why should you get a BP? Thst not logical at all.

Think of it as a contribution by those of us who are in a financial position to do so and don't mind paying £6 (or less) for a drug that would cost many times that in another country or over the counter Mary.

But it’s still a redistribution from the sick to the sick whilst taxation is a redistribution from the well and the sick to the sick. Much fairer..

Depends on the drug your’re on as well - some prescription only drugs in genetic form are much cheaper than the prescription fee so it could be argued that’s another unfairness - those on cheaper drugs subsidising those on more expensive ones

Fairer for who? The rich getting benefits of this sort doesn't sound like a progressive tax system to me. Don't forget that up until recently our household (on a very good income) could get free prescriptions for things like diarrhoea, athletes’ foot, sore throats, coughs, colds, warts and ulcers - things I could buy for a few quid over the counter but which cost the NHS many millions. I'm sure that if they looked at it again they could shave off a few more things we could buy directly - or they could charge us for prescriptions of course.

Several points - I’m all for restricting what GPs can prescribe eg cough medicine when there’s no evidence base for it. But your general argument does beg the question about why free health care anyway? I’m fine about my free prescriptions because I’m on a very good income and so paying plenty in in various forms of taxation which seems the right way round to me - pay in through taxation and take out free according to medical need.

Sirchengin it cost more to administer prescriptions than giving everyone them free .It costs more in the long run for peopel to pay for eye and dental checks too,they wont go when moneys tight and then the problem escalates and costs the NHS more in the end .I live in an area of high deprivation ,lots of unemployment (factories closed nothing taking their place) single parent families ,elderly with basisc pensions .Many who do work on minimum wage or enough above to stop them getting help so the "free" and we all know NOTHING is free services are very welcome.Surely in a civilised country we help the poor ,the sick and the vulnerable .We believe we're civilised here in Scotland ,we're certainly not tories who only look after their own .

The GP list is revised every now and again in E.

This is a typical exercise to stir up discontent between age groups and going by what I have read so far, it has succeeded. Not only has this bloody government divided society through the Brexit fiasco, they throw in stupid and contentious issues like this. Sadly, many on here have fallen for it and are moaning on about how long you have worked compared to the current generation; well, the current generation, ie our children and grandchildren cannot be blamed for how our lives were when we were starting out, and we have no way at all of knowing how long this current working generation will have to work before, or even if, they get a state retirement pension. So, let's leave off moaning about 'today's generation' and instead turn our anger and disgust to those who have floated this idea in the first place. If you are concerned, bombard your MP with emails demanding an answer, I am pretty sure with upcoming elections locally, European and possible General, we should all be getting a reply.

GillT57 well said.

No, my general argument doesn't really beg that question - my argument is simply about making a contribution to the cost of the drug I'm prescribed as opposed to taking more out of the NHS than I absolutely need to. I'm not in favour of universal benefits - in my opinion they should be targeted at those with the greatest need.

Paddy - I'm not sure I understand. Those on the kind of wages you're talking about or who aren't working at all qualify for benefits which excluded them for paying for prescriptions a few years ago when we paid for them. I'm not talking about people who need access to free prescriptions - I'm talking about higher rate tax payers who can quite easily afford the equivalent of the cost of a meal deal from M&S every so often.

Well I think health care should always be a universal,benefit and prescriptions are part of health care.

And targeting always works really well doesn’t it? Come on you know there’s always an issue with that.

Targeting what?

If benefits/ services aren’t universal, you have to target them on those that you have decided who should benefit and that is nearly always problematic in some way eg in E there is a list of conditions which if you have you get free prescriptions. The list is riddled with unfairnesses - all those unfairnesses would disappear at a stroke if all prescriptions were free

Or it could actually be simple - provide free prescriptions to those who qualify financially for other benefits and charge those who don't (just as we used to do here in S).

You must have had the exemption list though?

I don't see why better off pensioners shouldn't pay for prescriptions. They could have an annual,cap for anyone who needs a lot, like they do in Sweden (popularly supposed to be a socialist Utopia) where everyone pays, so a Swedish friend tells me - albeit a small amount. They also pay for GP/A&E.visits and for the 'hotel' element of hospital stays.

A friend of ours, who left over £1m cash and 2 houses paid for, was getting free prescriptions for many years, including things that cost pennies in supermarkets, like paracetamol. And I gather that the admin cost to the NHS for even the cheapest prescription item, is around £7.

He would stockpile umpteen prescription items and more than once the whole,lot - I once counted over 60 items - were thrown out by a visiting friend who was a nurse.

He was very mean with money and I swear that if he'd had to pay even £2-3 per item, he'd never have taken so many that he didn't need.
Such a criminal waste - it made me so mad.
And I'd bet anything that he's far from the only one.

Witz I hardly think policy should be made on the back of such an atypical example. Also do you think the better off ( whatever that means) should pay for other aspects of health care?

It is wrong to talk about anything that pensioners get as 'benefits'.

But that's what they are NanaSuzy. If you have a private pension what you get from that is a benefit of the scheme too.

I will, yet again, ignore the "and we lived in hole in the road, stuff" because it is very apparent that those who say such things are implying that those who don't have what they have got are undeserving because they didn't, what was it, oh yes, work hard and scrimp. The truth of the matter is that many of those who end up poor have worked hard - possibly harder and in less appealing jobs than those who declare their virtue and probably scrimped more but may just have received a lot less for it all their lives.

Perhaps it's because papers, politicians and some of the general public have turned the word "benefit" into a stick to beat the poor with that the very people who see it that way want another word when they are involved.

Mary it’s perfectly possible to want different things from different parts of the health service - it doesn’t have to be an all or nothing approach. Dental, optical and social care already operate in that way here and many people already use a combination of private and NHS services. There’s nothing to stop the provision of prescriptions to operate in a similar flexible way with people who can pay doing so.

I can't find the post on this thread where someone said that refugees in England receive £25k whereas recent retirees receive £8.7k (+ change) max state pension.
Having Googled the above in a question every which way, I cannot find anything to back up that statement.
Does anyone know where to find it? Thanks. ?
Anyone know why earlier retirees only get the basic pension (£129.20pw) and recent retirees get £168+ change pw?