If you are a remainer

I've voted LibDem by post, have a "B*****S to BREXIT" sticker on the Car. I know very few Leavers so really don't understand where they all come from or the rationale behind their thinking.

The only point I agree with NF on is that the Political system is broken. The final break in the system has been caused by both the main parties drifting to extreme positions which do not work for anyone.

The Centre Ground needs to be filled by politicians who are not afraid to say what they think and will not be swayed but populist gut reactions. NF is capitalizing on the nastier type of gut reactions,

What do you think would happen if Brexit was simply cancelled with no People's Vote to stop it democratically. There would probably be a short period of civil unrest but that would no worse the civil unrest caused by Leaving without a People's Vote when the effects of Brexit have fully taken effect.

MaizieD we must have the same prescription lenses, your post made perfect sense to me - even at this late stage in the proceedings.

Cheers, Charley

I posted my voting papers early evening and it was for Lib Dems. That is a first but it has to be done tactically.

The ones where you see one side as the angels and the other the devils.

What tinted glasses would those be, Mycat?

More info about how to vote

www.remainvoter.com/

MaizieD

You really should take off those tinted glasses.

Remain parties are now ahead of the leave party.

Farage shares a platform with the far right European leaders. He is cut from the same cloth, though making himself out to be a common man, when he’s nothing of the kind. Don’t pretend he’s some benevolent man of the people. He wants to relax gun control and privatise the health service.

MOnica - I agree with you and if 60% isn't reached then we should accept the status quo and give the policiticians time to deal with the other problems facing the country. There is never going to be a consensus as things stand because the views of the population are so disparate.

It is normal when referendums (or in many countries parliamentary votes) take place on major constitutional issues to require a 60% vote in favour to effect any change.

David Cameron (remember him?), a man who has sunk without trace, being the slip slop, PR professional he was, didn't see any necessity to set up the referendum properly, he thought a remain result was a no-brainer so cut corners and made it a simple majority. He is entirely responsible for the mess we are in.

I voted Remain but accepted the Leave result - and still do.
I am fortunate that the party of my alleigance has always been Lib Dem and that is how I will vote. My local council is now under Lib Dem control and a neighbouring constituency has a Lib Dem MP, so I would be foolish to do anything else.

Incompetent liars then.

Facile, Mycat. Facile and thoughtless generalisation.

MazieD

Incompetent liars then.

varian

Fair post.

Lazigirl

I think the rise of the really hard far right is far more worrying than us leaving the EU. And my worry is overturning and frustrating Brexit is facilitating this.

And I don’t mean Farrage I mean the really frightening far right of France and Germany

Because they are all liars jabberwok like I keep saying.

It's not because they're all liars. It's because they didn't know what they were doing.

I suspect that they thought, like most people did, that 'the grownups had a plan'. As it turned out, the Brexiteers who were initially put in charge of the negotiations, had absolutely no plan, no objectives (apart from 'leave the EU) and no idea about how to go about negotiations with a highly experienced negotiating bloc. I also think they believed their own propaganda about deals being really easy, German car manufacturers begging the EU for a quick deal, they export so much to us that they wouldn't want to lose our trade and they're our friends who will be willing to bend over backwards for us. They knew so little about the EU that they didn't even realise that we couldn't sign trade deals with non EU countries until we had actually left the EU. They expected that countries with which we had trade deals through the EU would roll them over for us on the same terms when anyone with a particle of common sense knew that deals with a market of 65 million would not be as attractive for those countries as deals with a market of 500+ million people.

Our MPs are amateurs; it's usual for ministers to take advice from civil servants and experts in their fields when implementing their policies. But both were sidelined. Amateurism and a burning desire to Leave just weren't enough.

I am a Labour voter but will vote Lib Dem in EU election - but I think although I was a remainer I do accept that we have to move on and can't turn back the clock. I am very concerned that so many feel unrepresented by their current politicians and the move to the hard right in many European Countries. Do we want to be a part of such a EU? Unfortunately UK is going the same way! I will vote Labour in a GE because I am concerned about the unraveling of our social, health and education services under the Tories.

I think we would reluctantly have to accept it but it would be a very sad turn of events. We would all have to do our best to mitigate the damage and help our children and grandchildren who would be so disadvantaged compared to our generation.

Some may campaign to rejoin the EU but we would do so in the knowledge that we would never again get the very favourable terms we now enjoy - not in the Euro, nor in Schengen and with the benefit of a rebate.

varian

Out of interest if there was another vote and leave won what then? Would you accept the result? Honestly interested.

Because they are all liars jabberwok like I keep saying.

Brexit mess isn’t the fault of the people it’s the fault of politicians.

Why did they sign article 50 in the first place if its all next door to Armageddon?!!

Some people think that just “getting it over with” and leaving will mean they can forget about it. There are some posters who promised never to post on Brexit threads again, but are still posting - the same will happen if and when and however Brexit happens. The negotiations will only just be starting and will outlive the lot of us.

If our politicians did their duty, which is never to knowingly inflict damage on our country, they would Revoke Article 50.

However I think they may, sadly, be too intimidated by the threats from the brexiters and so another public vote will be needed.

I do not deny that there could be a danger of leave winning because the malign criminal influences which swung the last referendum have not gone away. If there is another vote the Remain side will have to be less complacent and have a much better campaign.

God knows

And how do you actually foresee stopping Brexit bringing the country together? Unless there’s another vote? What if leave win with a bigger margin?

That’s a distinct possibility isn’t it? What then?