Liberal Democrats

So you keep saying, Ug. You're very gleeful abut it. Have you got some sort of personal score to settle with the LibDems?

The Liberal Democrats exist to build and safeguard a fair, free and open society, in which we seek to balance the fundamental values of liberty, equality and community, and in which no one shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity.

In a country where the other two parties offer extreme right and extreme left policies there is more need than ever for the Liberal Democrats.

www.markpack.org.uk/libdem-beliefs/

Not at all MaizieD just counter balancing some of varians pro LD posts. All I’ve said is I think they will (once again = as always) be a wasted vote if a WA is voted for in the HoC.

Actually ... if I think harder about it, yes I could say I had a score to settle with the Lib Dem’s in coalition since it was Cleggie who accelerated the women’s pension entitlement turning me (and many thousands of others) into WASPIs.!!

Ha varian you must be joking "The Liberal Democrats exist to build and safeguard a fair, free and open society, in which we seek to balance the fundamental values of liberty, equality and community, and in which no one shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity" ha

"In a country where the other two parties offer extreme right and extreme left policies there is more need than ever for the Liberal Democrats"

Have you seen Jo Swinson voting record? And the others who have joined LD nothing fair about them! "No one shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity"

And the far left you say of Labour? There polices are seen as mainstream in Nordic countries these countries are doing exceptionally well economically and so would UK be with these fine Labour polices.

Jeremy Corbyn is an atypical leader of the Labour party; one with almost total factional control of Britain’s opposition. To achieve this, the 70-year-old is surrounded by a tight cabal of influencers who shape both his politics and policies and are seen by many as the real people running Labour.

Many operate in the shadows; some hold elected offices, some are in parliament, and some wield power through informal networks. But nearly all of these individuals come from interconnected leftwing factions that were dismissed until Mr Corbyn became leader in 2015. They have campaigned, organised and socialised together from the sidelines for decades, having long ago given up on the idea of power.

ig.ft.com/jeremy-corbyn-labour-inner-circles/

How do you know it was Clegg's policy Urmstongran? BTW the WASPI campaigners should have concentrated on that acceleration rather than trying for compensation back to 60. They lost because they are greedy.

PS. I'm one of the first to be affected too.

If you support Labour and are smearing the LibDems, wake up! You need the LibDems to take Tory seats to win any kind of majority.

The Labour Party don't/didn't want freedom of movement because they know very well one of the main reasons many of their voters want to leave the EU. Labour is caught in pincer movement because places like Labour-voting London and most of the cities do want freedom of movement and that's one of the main reasons they're anti Brexit.

Just been doing a little research. The Conservative government (when in coalition) announced the rise in the state pension age in 2011. The LDs and Labour expressed concern about the short notice and the rise was delayed to give women (and men) a slightly longer notice period.

Where did Clegg fit in to all this?

BTW The LibDems were responsible for insisting that the coalition government implemented Labour's triple lock on pensions, which the Conservatives wanted (and still want) to reduce to a double lock. Apparently, this has already cost the Treasury £8.6 billion. As it's cumulative, it will continue to cost, even if it is abandoned.
PS. I still can't find anything about Clegg having a hand in delaying the state pension age, which was originally a Labour Act.

In a country where the other two parties offer extreme right and extreme left policies there is more need country than ever for the Liberal Democrats

Economically I just can't agree Varian. We don't talk about neo-liberal capitalism for no reason. It is moving towards that which has given us the economics of the modern Tory party and was the reason why, although the social view of the Conservatives and Liberals were different, they were able to work so well together. It is my view that had we still had a truly one-nation Conservative government at the time the two parties could not have worked together as they did. The very fact that the Tories had moved more to the right economically made it possible.

The Liberal Democrats have never been to the right of the Tories, either socially of economically. Even before the merger of the Liberals and SDP, the economic policies of the Liberals were based on a belief in a mixed economy.

Neo-liberalism is a right-wing policy which was never embraced by the Liberals.

I hear what you say Varian but do not agree that they behave in the way you describe. It would have made my life a lot easier when it came to voting if they had. I think, at least for the moment, neither of us will be persuaded.

I agree growstuff they went for the wrong angle. Can’t be bothered to go over it all again about Clegg. (Boring)

Suffice to say MaizieD AGREED with me at the time, months ago! Validation enough.
?

In The Guardian Dec 2013>
“Nick Clegg, the deputy prime minister, defended plans to extend the retirement age, saying the reforms would keep "the principle that a third of your adult life is in retirement that has been the rule of thumb for a long time".

24 June 2010:
“The government is to outline proposals that could push the age people can claim state pensions to as high as 70.

The coalition will also say they want to legislate soon for the state pension age for men to be raised to 66, but it would not rise before 2016.

Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg defended the plans and said the government was "reinvigorating what retirement means".

It was Cleggie. Osbourne was DELIGHTED with Clegg’s proposal of ‘bringing it forward’. Was heard to say it was ‘a licence to print money’.

Bastards.

Urmstongran
Back of the net.?????

Thank you for replying. I must admit they contradict some of what I found, so I'll maybe dig a little further to find out the context.

I'm afraid the WASPI campaign gets up my nose because the people in charge of it wouldn't accept a means-tested compromise. They're all professional, well paid women themselves and don't actually need the extra money and gave up the chance to campaign for those who really need it. (But that's another issue)

I don't have any sympathy for the women who didn't know the SPA had been increased in 1995. If they care so little to find out about something which affects them personally, I really wonder how much they are aware of changes to benefits, etc which don't affect them. The 2011 changes were different. Labour had introduced the idea of an extension in 2007(?) and the coalition brought the extension forward. I must admit I don't remember it's being Clegg's idea, although I do remember him being involved in the delay to the implementation, when it was realised how unfair it would be to a certain small group of men and women.

My big bugbear is that the public generally couldn't have cared less and didn't campaign to overturn all the other changes to the benefit system (such as the minimum number of worked hours needed for Universal Credit), which could have mitigated the hardship for those most affected. The WASPI organisers didn't care because they weren't in the group which needed most help. They were too concerned about trying to get their £thousands lump sum.

BTW I'm not defending Clegg. I was appalled by the LDs in coalition and for the first (and until now only) time in my life voted Labour in 2015. I just don't like people being accused of things, unless I know the background. There's far too much of it in politics.

A good, reasoned post growstuff - thank you back.

In 1995 I had just lost my dad,had my chronically sick mother to care for ,a 6 year old and a teenager and TWO businesses and ahome to run.Quite frankly I didn't have time or energy to see the news or read a paper a That situation continued until my mum died 14 years ago by which time I had added care for a grandchild to my mix because of my daughters PND.I'm sure I'm not the only WASPI woman who was under pressure.Not helped by the fact that the one and only letter I had from the DWP told me my contributions were ontrack for a full pension at 60!! I'm not asking for your or anyone elses sympathy growstuff but realising that some of us had very stressful ,difficult lives might be a decent thing to do

But it's been 23 years!

Sorry, but I was a full-time working mother with a husband I was on the verge of divorcing. I saw it as my responsibility to find out about my future. I didn't always have time to read newspapers carefully and, of course, we didn't have the internet, but it didn't take much to read the budget headlines.

Do you still have the letter from the DWP? I know that a computer has sometimes spewed absolute nonsensical letters and people often misread them. By the time I reach 66, I will have 48 years of full NI contributions in my own name (not in my husband's name or because I was receiving benefits), but I still won't be eligible for a full state pension. I happen to think it's very unfair, but I can't claim that I haven't known about it.

WASPI has been fighting the wrong fight for women (and men) now in their early sixties who desperately need money.

I now have 50 years of contributions ,I will apparently get a payment into my account later this month.I will believe it when I see it.Those contributions aren't in my husbands name or because of benefits either .I have worked and paid NI since 1969 .We started our first business when I was 22 ,I always paid by PAYE ,it seemed sensible at the time so we didn't have large tax bills etc .I'm very pleased you appear to have been more news orientated than me ...I'm not stupid I was just run off my feet .If I had known I would have made other arrangements

Fantastic speech by Jo Swinson in the Queen's Speech debate.

She was not called to speak until 5pm and had to address a sparse House of Commons.

The PM and most Tory MPs rudely walked out when Ian Blackford, leader if the SNP was called to speak around 4pm.

Jo paid tribute to the late Paddy Ashdown who led the Liberal Democrats for 11 years. During that time was subjected week after week to this sort of appallingly disrespectful treatment.

The Conservative party are an utter disgrace.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/live/bbcparliament