Remainers must vote tactically

A GE is about lots of different issues- not about Brexit. The mix is not helpful, at all- It is simple to see.

Johnson will surely do better than T May as he is much more popular, and anyway, he certainly couldn’t do any worse!

How do you work that one out Jura2 ?
No, a GE is just fine.

so lemon- you should agree that a Referendum on the current situation would serve the purpose much much better. We will probably end up with hung Parliament.

Tow the line to where??

Every single person will decide what this election is for them and no stubborn determination to instruct them will make any difference.

I don't see it as all about Brexit so what does anyone think the Brexit Bullies should? Beat me up behind the bike shed and insist I tow the line?

Of course this GE is all about Brexit, you would have had to have been living under a rock to think otherwise.Why does anyone think tactical voting( as advised by the obsessed Gina Miller) is going to be done....just for fun?

Yes- brave to change your mind as you find out the facts, the consequences and become aware of how it was achieved (yes fraud- in so many forms. Parts of Johnson is sitting on now, on proven Russian interference- refusing to publish the findings of the commission). Any decent person would do that.

Heidi Allen.

Who during the 2017 election campaign, couldn’t have been clearer, telling a hustings: ‘I was a Remainer, but the minute we start ignoring the democratic will of the people in this country, we are slipping very quickly towards the kind of banana republic I don’t want to live in… So we have to accept the result.’

She stood on a manifesto (and elected) to deliver Brexit. They blatantly tell their voters one thing and do precisely the opposite!

And to be elected wearing one rosette and then casually swap it for another. This is political fraud. And we shouldn’t let them forget it.

Urmstongran Heidi Allen isn't standing down because she doesn't represent her constituency on Brexit. Her constituency voted over 60% to remain and she would have stood a fighting chance of retaining her seat, even as a LibDem because she's quite well respected in her constituency.

Her problems are with the Conservative Party, which she sees as a thoroughly "nasty party". She's a successful businesswoman in her own right and (maybe naively) thought that going into politics would enable her to make a difference to people's lives. She's never been a typical Conservative, but doesn't fit the Labour Party mould either. Coming from a small business background, she also believes that Brexit will be damaging.

She's had some problems with a very small section of Leave-supporting right wingers, some of whom published her address. She's genuinely frightened about the safety of her family. She's also had some vile comments on social media from the same group of people.

Nevertheless, the reason she's standing down is because she doesn't see that she fits into the current system and thinks that the system is so broken that she wouldn't be able to bring about the changes she wanted. I've no doubt she will carry on working in a different capacity to try and fulfil her ambitions, but she's disillusioned with national politics.

I don't know her, but I do live a couple of miles from the border of her constituency and I know plenty of people who wanted to vote for her in the upcoming election. To claim that the "British public" has forced her to resign is grossly misleading.

Pantglas2 - I know quite a few. Brilliant people, totally dedicated to their job and their community- and who could get much better paid jobs elsewhere. Yes, really.

pantglas2 they all lie to get elected, then they continue to lie to keep their jobs and nice expense account!

And since when do ANY politicians tell the truth?

Who is Gina Miller? No honestly, I really don't know.
Would have though that most of the (over sixties? ) or so on here had enough life experience to make their own minds up...

I'm voting Corbyn

x

And since when do Tory politicians tell the truth Granny?

And most politicians voted to trigger Article 50.

Sirchenjin We all know that the referendum was "advisory" but the government of that time stated verbally and in the leaflets sent to all households that the result of the referendum would be upheld

growstuff
these politicians have implied that the British public are bullies

If you hadn't realised that by now I am astonished.

It's normal for a number of politicians to stand down at a GE but this time so many have cited bullying, death threats and other threats of violence against them and even their families, as the reason.

It must be very difficult for a politician who is either a committed remainer or leaver if their constituency voted differently to their views but bullying is not the answer, the answer lies with the ballot box.

Ken Clarke does deserve his retirement at 79 - or perhaps will carry on contributing his wisdom in the H of L.

" being targeted" implies a cunning plan.......fingers hovering over keyboards waiting for their victim. Maybe they have a tick list...
Leave voter ..tick
Millar fan ...cross
Corbyn fan ....cross.

let the targeting begin.

I agree Not. This election will not put the B question to bed - it always was an advisory vote (although it appears that some didn’t realise that), which means that we should have had the opportunity to vote on the terms. Brexit is not a single entity - and that was reflected in the numerous Parliamentary votes. The sensible, reasonable solution would have been a cross party approach with a few options put to the public vote.

I’m with Urmstongran in that this election is all about the EU. I don’t want the same outcome but I honestly would hold my nose and put up with virtually any party for a few years who would stop us leaving. But with an election my vote is actually useless in a big pro-leave area.

The thing is, I think we should have had a confirmation of the leave vote (or otherwise) instead, and then I think even those of us who are staunchly pro-remain would have accepted it. We wouldn’t have liked it but I think it would have drawn a line under the hatred, name-calling (on both sides) and despair. Most people are not as mean spirited as they seem online and would like to feel that although the sands have shifted somewhat over the last three years we could honestly say we still want to leave (or not).

As it is, the politicians are out campaigning and many of us aren’t listening. Leaving/not leaving has such enormous consequences that even the things I really care about pale into insignificance. This leave/remain thing is for generations, not just a few years.

As regards tactical voting, I read an article two days ago that was explaining how a particular website was giving “false” suggestions. It was not deliberately misleading- just not nuanced enough to be useful and could damage your intentions. If I can find the article again I’ll send a link.

If they’re offensive or bullying then that’s extremely serious Granny. If you’re not prepared to take a stand against such bullies then I’m sure others will and GN will remove the posts immediately as per their guidelines.

you sound absolutely obsessed with Brexit to the detriment of everything else
hysterical
SirChenjin you could have said that to any number of posters on GN, both Leavers and Remainers!

Astonishing that you are only targeting one poster who always sounds quite reasonable to me even if I don't necessarily agree with her views.

I always thought that you were quite reasonable too.

I am despondent at what is happening in Parliament and across the country - normal, nice people at each others' throats.

As someone else pointed out, no wonder so many have drifted away from the political threads.

grapefruitpip I am not in the habit of reporting posts, especially if they are offensive, bullying or any such like.
In my humble opinion it is best to leave them on a thread for all to see.

Funny how these threads descend into name calling. It’s a shame really imo. Surely it would be more interesting to exchange iewpoints?

Play the ball, not the (wo)man?