Mogg

and how would you know if you never bother to read them???

Not at all rude, you find them of interest I do not.

Annie ''I don’t read grandad43’s epistles , read one you have read them all. ''

how incredibly rude. I don't always agree with Grandad, but he is certainly very knowledgeable and experienced in export/export practical issues.

growstuff I don’t read grandad43’s epistles , read one you have read them all.

He is the union voice who said when there was a discussion on Aberfan and I said we wanted Justice , didn’t get justice, Lord Robens wasn’t even sacked though we had called for it, he even had an agreement that he would offer his resignation and the letter refusing it was written before he submitted his resignation. That’s not red tape, the unions wanted to keep him in the job

grandad43

- justice for those children was the improvements in health and safety.

That wasn’t justice

Jennifer, if 5 of your family members had been wiped out would you be quite so forgiving?

common sense.

I went to the trouble of watching and listening to it before commenting. I was beginning to think perhaps I had over reacted.

Then I watched the clip on a bigger screen this morning. I think it was pretty grim what he said and the inference was that people him and Nick Ferrari would have used common .

I don't know why it is so hard for people to grasp it was unacceptable. People lost families, babies. Imagine such an event had occurred in an affluent gated estate lets say.
Sad ,sad times for this country.

I don’t understand why he had to apologise for saying the remark. Whether right or wrong, it’s obviously what he was thinking. If politicians can’t say what they are thinking then we are all buying into the lie that they are promoting. At least when we hear them say what they think we can then decide whether to vote for them. Or not.

No- it is because he did, and it is.

JRM made a rather tactless comment for which he has apologised. He did NOT say the Grenfell residents were lacking in common sense, neither did he infer it.

Why on earth then has this non event been blown out of proportion??????

Oh of course. There is a General Election coming up, so let's put the boot in.

Andrew Bridgen, who defended Rees Mogg certainly meant that Rees Mogg is "clever".

You can hear the interview …

www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2019/nov/05/jacob-rees-mogg-is-cleverer-than-grenfell-tower-residents-tory-mp-suggests-video

"We want clever people running the country... That's a by-product of what Jacob is."

Anniebach You really don't seem to have understood what Grandad wrote. I wish I could remember more about the talk I attended. The point is that in 1966, there weren't the same H & S regulations, although of course the mining industry did have some. The Coal Board was still a huge organisation and the engineers responsible for the maintenance of the tips just didn't have the systems in place to make people listen.

These days, it's very different. We'll have to wait for the second report to find out whether warnings were ignored and by whom, whether the statutory inspections took place, whether materials used were compliant with standards, whether general fire precautions met minimum requirements, how the council responded to complaints, etc etc.

The point is that most of that "red tape" just didn't exist in 1966.

Not meant in the way they’ve been portrayed

He meant every word of what he said. He’s an intelligent man (at least, he’d have us believe that) and always chooses his words very carefully.

I was (quite rightly) criticised on another thread for not actually reading properly something I was posting about.
Like tooting I have listened to the interview and while I agree his comments were completely wrong I don’t think they were meant in the way that has been portrayed by some posters on this thread. One poster has already admitted he/she was only commenting on what other posters had written and not read the original and I think that may apply to many more.

Forgive me

Grenfell is in Kensington and Chelsea London Borough Council

Come on, WW2.

There has been many comments that Grenfell was a Conservative council

That was my point

I think if you listen to the interview he did not just say it was common sense, rather a tragic set of circumstances that led to the tragedy.
Yes he should have chosen his words wisely but the reaction is disproportionate to the intent. And of course a gift to the other parties to exploit for their agendas.

I didn’t realise that there were conservative or labour buildings?

A lot of high rise buildings still have that cladding in place. Not just Conservative ones either.

I assume they have an evacuation procedure in place.

Make one doubt about nationalising every thing again

Perhaps those at the top re Grenfell were not truely aware of the dangers !

Thank you Gonegirl , all that waffle posted about health and safety is just an attempt to cover up the truth . They knew there was danger and ignored it and kept their jobs .

Grandad You're right. Many years ago, I went to a talk by somebody who had done a PhD on the psychology of industrial organisations, which included the Aberfan disaster. He was part of the group which was calling for H & S regulations to be brought in.

Apparently, engineers working for the Coal Board were worried about the tips, but the managements systems and procedures weren't in place for them to take their concerns further. Therefore, it's true that those at the coalface knew there were dangers, but those at the top weren't truly aware of them.

AnnieBach it's just too awful to dwell on. One of the dreadful things that have happened in our life times.

It's not the time to be 'conversational' when being interviewed about such a tragic event - he should, being the intelligent, media savvy, politically astute man we're led to believe he is - choose his words very, very carefully. Implying that it simply came down to common sense shows he's questionnining both the experience and decision making of the fire service and the residents for not doing the 'right thing' - which is quite rightly why there's been such a backlash.