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Unman Khan and some light on the issue

(115 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Mon 02-Dec-19 08:48:43

After Johnson yesterday sought to gain political capital on the death if British citizens, I thought it would be useful to outline the whole issue in detail, with the help of an excellent Guardian article.

Why did Usman Khan go to jail?

Convicted in 2012. Case involving al-Qaida inspired groups intent on setting up a terrorist camp in Pakistan and carry out attacks in Kashmir.

Khan pleaded guilty.

Sentence

Justice Wilkie considered Khan enough of a long term risk to the public for him to receive an indeterminate sentence rather than a fixed term. Indeterminate means that he could not be released without parole board approval.

Appeal

Successful.
Leveson concluded that khan terror plans largely related to overseas and therefor not a substantial risk to the public. Khan received 16 years. Release after 8.

The Law
The type of sentence Khan received was an extended sentence for public protection, introduced by Labour in April 2005, alongside the IPP sentence.
Both types of sentence required that a parole board assessment be made before release.
In 2008 Labour changed the law to ease pressure on the soaring prisoner numbers. This required that only that extended sentences the requirement for parole oversight was removed.
Khan became automatically eligible for release midway through his term.
Rules for terrorism sentencing was changed by the Conservatives in 2015 as the Islamic state grew. All terrorist prisoners now have to apply for parole.

Is Johnson right in blaming labour?

Conclusion - no

It is true that Labour”s 2008 law change created the type of sentence that allowed automatic release, but Labour also created a viable alternative, in the indeterminate sentence, which required parole board oversight.

The Tory manifesto does say “we will introduce thought sentencing for the worst offenders and dnd automatic halfway release from prison for serious crimes” but is has nothing specific on terror offences.

Johnson assertion that terrorists spend 14 years in prison is new.

Is anyone to blame

Difficult.

Labour gave the judges a choice
An indeterminate sentence which required parole oversight
Or
A determinate sentence which did not.

Justice Wilkie chose the first, the court of appeal overturned his decision.

The Law changes by the Tories have simply reduced the discretion available to the judges in terror cases.

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 16:06:48

The father of London Bridge terror attack victim Jack Merritt has accused Boris Johnson of using his death to “make political capital capital”.

David Merritt, who has been vocal about his son’s stance on rehabilitation in the eight days since his death, said on Twitter that the PM represented “the worst of us”.

Writing on Twitter on Saturday, Merritt said Johnson had been taking people for a ride during the BBC Election Debate against Jeremy Corbyn on Friday evening.

He wrote: “Corbyn spoke the truth last night. Johnson lied and used our son’s death to make political capital.

“Wake up Britain, this man is a fraud.

“He’s the worst of us, and he’s taking you for a ride.”

Cambridge University graduates Jack Merritt and Saskia Jones, 23, were attacked by Usman Khan during a prisoner rehabilitation event at Fishmongers’ Hall on Friday November 29.

Khan attacked five people, including the graduates, armed with two kitchen knives and wearing a fake suicide vest before he was tackled by members of the public on London Bridge and then shot dead by police.

During the BBC debate, the two party leaders were asked about balancing the needs of security against human rights in the wake of the terror attack.

Corbyn said: “What happened on the streets of London was utterly appalling and I was very moved by what Jack Merritt’s father said about what his son was trying to do.

“That he wanted a society where you did address the huge problems where somebody committed awful acts; of course you must imprison them, of course you try and rehabilitate them if you can.”

Johnson said: “I have huge sympathy for Mr Merritt and the families of both victims and it was an absolutely terrible thing.

“But I still think it’s wrong that someone like Usman Khan, who was sentenced to 21 years or 16 years plus five on licence, should have been out automatically on eight years.”

But Merritt said on Twitter that there was no justification for cutting the early release tariff and claimed it was just trying to “look tough.”

He added: “There is no justification at all for cutting the early release tariff from a half to a third of sentences for all sentences over four years that carry a maximum life sentence – that’s just trying to look tough on the backs of other prisoners’ suffering.

“If prisoners have engaged with rehabilitation and turned their lives around, why should they be punished for what Khan did?”

Speaking to reporters in Reading, Liberal Democrat leader Jo Swinson said: “I’m heartbroken for Jack Merritt’s father for what he is going through, which I can’t even begin to imagine the intensity of that grief.

“And that he has something to say and he has really clearly said he did not want politicians to politicise his son’s murder.

“And the very least Boris Johnson could have done was to listen to a grieving father and respect his wishes. And instead, he has done the opposite.”

Sarah Turnnidge Huffpost UK

M0nica Sat 07-Dec-19 16:55:43

I am afraid that Jack Merritt's father has postioned his views within a partisan political sector. He is clearly a Labour Party supporter and is now using his personal tragedy to favour one particular party.

I would feel just the same had he placed himself in any other political party and used his son's death for a political cause.

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 17:02:05

He is condemning the cynical exploitagion of his son's tragic death by Boris Johnson. He has said his son intended to vote LibDem and he will do the same, but his point was not to endorse any party, just to make it clear how distasteful and disrespectful to his family Boris Johnson's remarks have been.

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 17:04:37

exploitation

eazybee Sat 07-Dec-19 17:38:08

I am refraining from voicing my opinion of David Merrick's articles and comments as his son has been brutally murdered.

Shame on you, Varian, for reproducing it.

inkcog Sat 07-Dec-19 17:49:05

I suppose the poor man must be totally beside himself with shock and grief. Infact he possibly hasn't reached grief yet.

varian Sat 07-Dec-19 17:49:47

Why should anyone be ashamed to reproduce Mr Merritt's comments? He is a brave and honest man speaking up for his murdered son who by all accounts was a wonderful young man who did a great deal of good in his short life.

Those who should be ashamed are those who still support the disgraceful Boris Johnson.

pinkquartz Sat 07-Dec-19 17:50:00

Monica

"Are you suggesting that if two countries go to war and happen to share a similar religious background it is because their religion discourages discussion. How would you explain the two world wars where the main countries involved were all Christian?"

No ! I did not mean that.

Iam64 Sat 07-Dec-19 18:28:23

I don't know how we can know which party Mr Merrick would vote for, although I suspect we can rule out the Conservative party. I confess, that would apply to my adult children and grandchildren, they wouldn't vote Conservative, Ukip or Brexit, though they may vote for Green, Lib Dem, Labour, independent.

Why varian should be ashamed of reproducing David Merrick's words is a mystery to me. So far as I recall, no one criticised Jo Cox's family or husband for making pubic statements in the aftermath of her murder.

`

M0nica Sat 07-Dec-19 21:44:32

Well what did you mean Pinkquartz?

I am just saddened that David Merrick has said what he has said within a clearly partisan political newspaper. I felt that what he said was so much more powerful when said from an independent non-aligned position.

varian Sun 08-Dec-19 00:25:57

What he said was powerful from whatever position it came .He deserves our respect.

Evie64 Sun 08-Dec-19 00:39:38

Personally I am incredibly proud of those Londoners, whatever their backgrounds were, for preventing more deaths by a person who has the audacity to call himself a British citizen. We need to look at why these disenfranchised radicalised Muslim men feel the need to attack us so violently and without discriminating against women and children (Manchester bombing). Oh yeah, it was the Iraqi War that Blair took us into that began this wasn't it? Makes me so cross.

Yehbutnobut Sun 08-Dec-19 06:45:52

One was Polish so not all were ‘Londoners’.

And how dare you criticise a bereaved father’s choice of newspapers Monica. It was entirely up to him and do you seriously suggest they did not print his request (ignored by the Sun, the Daily Mail and the Daily Express) faithfully word for word?

inkcog Sun 08-Dec-19 09:02:06

A complex tragedy which can not and should not be reduced to sound bites in my opinion.
Mr Merritt and the others who have lost children/family members are likely to be in a state of shock and heightened emotions.
One of those who acted so bravely is Polish and one is a Muslim.

Mohammed’s boss said: ‘He was there. He held the guy down. ‘The terrorist was pinned down to the floor. ‘He was on his break. He came back afterwards to work. ‘He didn’t say anything. He went back to work. He was washing dishes.’

Read more: metro.co.uk/2019/12/01/mohammed-kitchen-porter-joined-polish-chef-stop-london-bridge-terrorist-11248935/?ito=cbshare

Twitter: twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: www.facebook.com/MetroUK/