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Where would you rather live? In a high tax or low tax state?

(43 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 07:44:57

The OECD has reported in an email briefing this morning that:

In 2018, four OECD countries had tax-to-GDP ratios above 43% (France, Denmark, Belgium and Sweden) and four other EU countries also recorded tax-to-GDP ratios above 40% (Finland, Austria, Italy and Luxembourg). Five OECD countries (Mexico, Chile, Ireland, the United States and Turkey) recorded ratios under 25%.
There’s one thing to note first, and that is that Ireland’s GDP is massively overstated by the flow of foreign profits through it: the impact may be overstatement by more than 25%, in which case the noted tax ratio is also wrong and the real like-for-like figure would have Ireland above 30%.

Then I will pose a simple question: which would you rather live in? France, Denmark, Belgium, Sweden, Finland, Austria, Italy and Luxembourg, or Mexico, Chile, the USA and Turkey?

And where would you feel safer?

And in which country would your human rights be better protected?

And now, why would you want to drive tax yield and the size of government down?

It’s really not rocket science that tax is good fo9r wellbeing, is it?

Richard Murphy

welbeck Mon 09-Dec-19 18:37:42

and the tories want to drive down what they called low-skilled immigration.
how does this square with growing social care needs.
I have come across many careworkers, over 90% are immigrants. also think of hospital cleaners, kitchen staff etc.
and they call these people, doing vital work, low-skilled because they receive minimum wage. like to see some of them try doing carework, with all the responsibility, hard graft, etc. and often not paid for travelling time or fares to clients.
if I ruled the world, domicilary care would be organised locally, by a public body, accountable, with proper training, career progression and renumeration. aim to recruit people living local to the area they worked in, get to know the area, its facilities, and able to walk between clients.

varian Mon 09-Dec-19 18:21:12

I believe the LibDems want to see an integrated, properly funded social care and health service.

Really the two cannot and should not be separated. The nonsense of "bed-blocking" in hospitals is related to the lack of proper social care provision and good social care can keep many out of hospital.

pinkquartz Mon 09-Dec-19 18:01:28

High tax and Caring

Callistemon Mon 09-Dec-19 17:53:55

The Liberal Democrats propose an income tax increase of 1p in the £ to help the NHS.
Is it for social care varian?
That's what I thought anyway.

Yes, I'd rather pay a bit more tax on earnings and do away with inheritance tax as Norway has done.

Eloethan Mon 09-Dec-19 17:01:46

Definitely higher taxes and a more effective and caring society.

However, as grannypauline's comment illustrates, not everybody will agree as to how that tax is spent.

I would prefer less to be spent on the military and
the monarchy - but there doesn't seem much chance of that happening.

I would prefer more to be spent on relieving poverty, and in particular child poverty, and on affordable housing.

grannypauline Sun 08-Dec-19 21:00:47

As usual a thought provoking post from Whitewave. However I don't think a fiscal solution is the whole answer. The UK is a wealthy country but the arms industry consumes huge sums in a time when there is no outside threat.

IF we cancelled Trident we would save £200 billion which is a lot to play with!

In addition if we stopped joining in with the US in their oversees wars we would be a lot safer and wealthier. We need to divert arms manufacture towards socially useful products (arms to renewables). We can sell these instead! Of course we would lose around £14 billion in exports of weapons, of which 80% goes to the Middle East, mainly Saudi Arabia (not known a s a defender of human rights!),

Seen as a peaceful and helpful country we would be safer and wealthier.

growstuff Fri 06-Dec-19 21:16:23

I doubt if Whitewave is Richard Murphy. The real Richard Murphy is usually critical of the Labour Party, whereas Whitewave has been quite transparent in her support.

BTW Richard Murphy is a Quaker and I don't think Whitwave is.

SirChenjin Fri 06-Dec-19 19:44:48

Phew - I thought I was losing the plot!

Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 19:27:54

sirchen

No I’m not the author. It is Richard Murphy

???

SirChenjin Fri 06-Dec-19 19:25:18

Is he not the author? Are you Richard Murphy Whitewavemark2? I’m genuinely confused! It’s been a long week...

Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 18:14:24

sirchen????

varian Fri 06-Dec-19 18:13:41

I have already voted (by post) for higher taxes. The Liberal Democrats propose an income tax increase of 1p in the £ to help the NHS.

SirChenjin Fri 06-Dec-19 18:11:33

Isn’t Richard Murphy the author of the report? confused

Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 17:56:35

missfood let me put your mind at rest.. I have been a gran since 2011. With a short break.

Missfoodlove Fri 06-Dec-19 17:53:30

Whitewavemark2.

I see you signed off your post as Richard Murphy.
I strongly suspected you were not a “ Gran”
braveneweurope.com/richard-murphy-what-i-think-labour-should-be-saying-on-europe

Luckygirl Fri 06-Dec-19 13:23:24

Higher taxes and decent society with good public services.

jura2 Fri 06-Dec-19 13:18:14

janipat, I would normally agree. But honestly- the response was to a really condescending post.

''May I politely suggest you lighten up and relax a bit.
“It’s the season to be jolly”.''

and in this case, the reply was spot on and well deserved.

iluvsylvanianfamilies51 Fri 06-Dec-19 13:13:17

higher taxes - after watching dispatches the other night about the 4.1 million children living in poverty I cant see how anyone could say otherwise

NaughtyNanna Fri 06-Dec-19 12:38:52

Higher taxes and better universal, public services / infrastructure.

Welshwife Fri 06-Dec-19 12:24:47

Higher taxes every time. We used to have much higher taxes in Britain.

growstuff Fri 06-Dec-19 11:49:16

High and fair tax with great public services.

Jingle bells jingle bells … tchgrin

Blinko Fri 06-Dec-19 11:22:21

I'd always go for higher taxes and a fairer society. Belgium, here I come....

janipat Fri 06-Dec-19 10:58:09

missfoodlove there, there dearly. Don’t get stressed you don’t have to play with the big boys and girls.

Off you go and get your nails done, bake your cake and watch daytime TV

What a horrible condescending reply to someone you could have simply ignored.

To answer the OP, higher taxes used for higher quality public services. Not Denmark, still reported to be very racist by my black friends who lived there for a few years, now much happier in UK. Sweden would be good, but I'll stay here in the UK if that's allowed and campaign for a fairer, better society.

pinkquartz Fri 06-Dec-19 10:28:40

Higher taxes and higher quality public services.
Of course

Whitewavemark2 Fri 06-Dec-19 10:26:59

?thank you.