Danger man Trump strikes again

Totally irrelevant however- notice you have not responded about Saudi.

Iran was actually in the process of returning to ordinary life. It was building diplomatic relationships, it was becoming a holiday destination.

Is that so? These Iranians don't seem to agree with you:

The Spectator, January 2019:

Iran has been miserable ever since the Ayatollah Khomeini returned from his Parisian exile to usher in his total Shiite state. It’s a suffocating place, with Islamic conformity enforced on pain of flogging, jail and death, and a lousy, mismanaged economy made worse by US sanctions.
For all its ancient civilisational glories, Iran is also a cruel, spiritually deracinated land. I increasingly struggle to decide where the blame lies: with the present regime or some deeper ailment in the national soul.

This could perhaps explain why, for the last 3 years, Iranians have topped the league tables of nationalities seeking asylum in the UK. One asylum seeker said “Iran was like hell,” he says. “I prefer to sleep in cardboard here rather than live in Iran

In 2018, more than 4000 Iranians sought asylum here and that number has increased since then, with the number of small boats carrying them from France in the last year.

However trisher, should you decide to take your holiday in Tehran, (or elsewhere in Iran), don't forget to send us a postcard telling us how delightful it is.

I don't think opal is alone in supplying weapons to Saudi.

Ordinary pleasant life in Iran
Evil regime in Saudi

Where do you do find this propaganda, trisher?

They are both as bad fighting their proxy war and starving
children to death in Yemen.

And the Army Welfare personnel are bullies.

Someone needs to build a wall around the whole of the Middle East and forget about it. They're stuck in the Middle Ages and had enough time to evolve but they refuse.

Chanting ‘death to America’ in parliament and not even one woman. Like something out a history book. What a failed state I feel sorry for their people.

Iran was in the process of returning to ordinary life

Ordinary life fighting proxy wars, ordinary life where women are suppressed and subject to a fatwah if they ride a bicycle!, ordinary life calling another country Satan, an ordinary lovely holiday destination.

Pity, I was planning a trip to the Caspian Sea.

As my dear mother used to say.
If you pull a Tigers tail you can expect to get bitten.
I am not a DT fan but I hope Iran will take note and further in incidents can be avoided for all our sakes

I don't know Opal at what point do you say to an evil regime like Saudi Arabia enough is enough? Perhaps when they are bombing innocent civilians in Yemen. Oh no I forgot! you just keep supplying them with the technology to do it!

"^And at the moment Trump is posing a terrible threat to us all^."

Might I suggest that it is actually the Iranian regime that is posing a terrible threat? How much are the USA supposed to put up with before taking action? I thought their response was considered and appropriate, no civilians were injured and they took out a man responsible for planning numerous attacks on their armed forces and citizens, in a targeted and precise attack. Yes it may well have repercussions, but at what point do you say to an evil regime like Iran that "enough is enough"?

As to what is really going on it's quite simple. In order to stop people examining what is going wrong in the society they live in, to distract them and keep them from civil unrest, you need an enemy. The US have had many through the years. Iran was actually in the process of returning to ordinary life. It was building diplomatic relationships, it was becoming a holiday destination, and as there aren't that many places left where the US can wage war that had to be stopped.
I still wonder that there is so little recognition of the damage that is done to people when they are trained to kill. And think it isn't surprising that some ex-service personnel refuse to use the forces welfare service. After all would you expect the victim of bullying to accept counselling from the bully?

Ug why can’t Iran be left alone to go its own way? Trump supports many dictators and evil regimes anyway.

I think the transition from service to civilian life can be very difficult, even with the help of a supportive family.

growstuff there is help to obtain housing through the MOD (the JSHAO) and also STOLL and Haig Housing but there are many ther charities offering help to them specifically.
If PTSD is the problem then priority housing could be arranged too.

If, of course, they have the ability to access help and don't just disappear off the radar.

I’m English and British and I’m both glad and relieved to be such. There are many countries in the world where I would hate to live. We have freedom, democracy, the NHS, clean water and enough food, there are so many reasons to be patriotic. Our armed forces are amongst the best in the world. There can always be improvement in all things, and that has been discussed many times on different threads on Gransnet, but overall we live in a wonderful country.
Our leaders from all parties have been reasonably restrained, we do not have a Trump, Putin, or Hassan Rouhani in charge now, nor have we ever had such a person as our Prime Minister. And at the moment Trump is posing a terrible threat to us all.

There are many countries where I would hate to live, I won’t name them as that might be regarded as racist and my comment removed, but there are countries where there is no freedom of speech, and few if any human rights, and where a site such as Gransnet, with its huge range of topics discussed, including many political ones, and forthright views expressed, would be illegal and lead to many of us being arrested for daring to express our own views. It’s worth remembering that.

and then ...?

Iran is a pirate state, pretty much everyone in the West agrees on that. We just don’t know how to deal with it, we never have, and relations have vacillated between cold war and military escalation ever since the fanatics came to power in 1979.

Trump does not want to be a Bush, he also refuses to be a Carter or an Obama – that he will leave the Middle East covered in a web of red lines. When the Iranians decided they were free to cross them, they misjudged the President badly.

I cannot understand why it is ok to be a proud Scot, Irishman or Welshman and fly your flags , but in some circles to be a proud Englishman and fly the English flag is wrong and immediately associated with the BNP.

I am English and British and have no problem saying that I am patriotic:

Patriotism is love and attachment to ones country, it isn’t blind obedience.
I must be patriotic then. I love this country where I was born. I’m well aware our history confirms it has never been perfect.
Granngravy - I don’t see anything wrong in loving our country, we don’t do so “right or wrong”

Sadly nothing metaphorical in the current situation ...

nuclear MAD has worked for some time- it will stop working because of MAD men

True jura. I was speaking metaphorically.

WadesNan humans have a tendency, genetic unless overcome by civilisation and education, to be tribal. Football or country it’s all one and the same. Love and charity don’t come into it when the blood lust and hatred are in the ascent.

"a freedom without love or charity or duty or patriotism, is unworthy of our founding ideals, and those who died in their defense" Barak Obama

''It's not a question of not supporting the troops themselves. I don't think anybody doubts they'll do as they're told and will do the very best they can. It's the lunatics who put them in the situation in the first place who should stand before them in battle.'' agreed

however, in a nuclear war, it does not really matter if you are behind or in front ...

Patriotism is the last resort of scoundrels.

Best, and most effective, way forward for Iran is wage a cyberwar. Paralyse the US through its banking systems, energy companies, internet, etc. Trumps moronic supporters will soon turn against him when the lights go out and their money dries up.

Much preferable to the nuclear option methinks.

What is wrong with being patriotic?