And so the E.U. squabbling starts over the fiscal black hole ?

MerylStreep

I don't what the Rebans are....or do you mean Raybans as in sunglasses?

My Bulgarian acquaintances were very upset by what has happened in their country and then I heard from A Czech person that it is similar there.
At least before everyone was in the same boat and now very different.

Pinkquartz
The Bulgarian government and the men wearing Rebans with ill fitting suits and no necks ? are one and the same.
But when push comes to shove, the no necks have it ?
You won't beat these people. They are masters of their art.
Romania is a very different country. They are coming along in leaps and bounds.

Well, we will have to wait and see MaizieD.

^ can you think of any EU Member State that offers any ' third country' free health care,^

Yes, until we left, the UK did

www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/AboutNHSservices/uk-visitors/Documents/reciprocal-healthcare-agreements-table.pdf

But if some Member States do not ' mutually agree ' then some Member States will have to do as they are told, in other words ' not allowed ' to do as they want.

Oh, come on, POGS. That's how organisations work. You accept that you're not always going to have things your own way when you join an organisation and that there may be a consensual agreement to implement something that you, personally, don't care for. You're presenting the EU as a bullying entity; it's no more such an entity than is a tennis club, or a book club, or any other sort of club.

As far as I can see, costs incurred through the EHIC scheme are claimed back from the appropriate member state, and the UK operates several 'reciprocal agreements', doing much the same thing, with a number of non EU countries. So treatment is 'free' to the treated individual but paid for by their country, and, it's perfectly possible to be an EU member state with reciprocal agreements with non EU states.

Which, if I'm reading this correctly, leaves Portugal free to offer 'free' treatment to whoever they damn well please.

Maizied

' It's not a question of the EU 'not allowing', in any circumstances. It's a question of regulations or agreements decided between the member states and all the member states (which included the UK) observing the mutually agreed 'rules'.
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But if some Member States do not ' mutually agree ' then some Member States will have to do as they are told, in other words ' not allowed ' to do as they want.
--

' It's up to individual states, surely, to decide how they want to treat non-nationals in their health services? I suspect that Portugal is free to treat UK nationals in whatever way they wish.

Health services are state competences, not EU competences. The way they are run and funded varies between states. I don't recollect the EU interfering in how the UK ran its health service or treated other EU nationals.'

You may have a valid point but the Member States are so used to operating under The European Health Insurance Card system it has not really been tested.

The UK will be what is known as a ' third country ', can you think of any EU Member State that offers any ' third country' free health care, custom priorities.

Apparently our contributions were equal to those from all the 19 (or was it 15) smaller countries.

That is because EU contributions are assessed as a percentage of GDP. It stands to reason that countries with smaller GDPs will be paying less. And remember that our GDP was high because of our trade with the EU. The purpose of EU regional funding was to help poorer areas grow their economies; improved economy means higher GPD, increased contributions from those states, and less need for EU funding.

But no, let's moan on about paying 1% of our GDP (with an estimated return in trade income of £10 for every £1 sent) to the EU while it's calculated that our poor growth since the Brexit vote has already 'cost' several years worth of EU contributions... Helping other states never has been our forte, really. We preferred to plunder them...

As I said I doubt it will happen because the EU would not allow a Member State to do so unilaterally.

It's up to individual states, surely, to decide how they want to treat non-nationals in their health services? I suspect that Portugal is free to treat UK nationals in whatever way they wish.

Health services are state competences, not EU competences. The way they are run and funded varies between states. I don't recollect the EU interfering in how the UK ran its health service or treated other EU nationals.

I might be wrong. Perhaps someone will be able to tell me differently.

P.S It's not a question of the EU 'not allowing', in any circumstances. It's a question of regulations or agreements decided between the member states and all the member states (which included the UK) observing the mutually agreed 'rules'.

I have been told by two Bulgarian citizens that the EU money went straight into the pockets of their Govt who are even more corrupt than ours.

The Eu really should have made sure the money went where it was supposed to have gone.
Ordinary people in Bulgaria have a harder life now than they did under the Soviets

Barmeyoldbat.

You are wrong to say ' So the leavers are still banging on about the EU '.

You are ignorant as to how posters engaged in this thread voted, it is your decision to misrepresent posters but that unfortunately happens too often by posters who wish to shut down other posters debating.

Hopefully, the whole EU fiasco will disintegrate soon and we can go back to trading with individual countries to mutual benefit.

You are are all so wrong, I thought we might have moved on with our discussions onto something other than EU, don't we have enough problems here. But carryon.

MerylStreep Sat 22-Feb-20 13:24:48

POGS
Thank you for that info. So true that the eu won't let it happen.
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It was an interesting concept though wasn't it. Country by country they will have to work out if they can afford to put political dogma before trade. Sadly I think ' Ever Closer Union' is the preferred option for the EU Commission but not necessarily for the EU Parliament.

Time will tell.

Barmeyoldbat

'So the leavers are still banging on about the EU'
----

You are mistaken in your synopsis and shows a lack of thought.

If you wish only to stop debate or discussion by those interested in the politics of the EU then dependent on the thread one could make the same comment about Remain or Leave voters. Doing so only serves the purpose of trying to impose your opinion whilst telling other posters what they can or cannot post.

So the leavers are still banging on about the EU

Nothing wrong with wanting to discuss the E.U. Barmeyoldbat! We might have left but this thread does give us who voted Leave an opportunity for us to remember why we did so!

POGS
Thank you for that info. So true that the eu won't let it happen.
Re the eu countries not agreeing. Remember when the Waloons ( pop. 3.6 ml) though a spanner in the works when the eu/Canada trade deal was about to be completed after only 9 years of wrangling?
Tax deals. Jean Claude Juncker, when PM of Luxembourg spent years blocking eu reforms ( from the Guadian)

Urmstongran
And undertake an audit to see where the eu tax payers money is going
I can tell you personally where €20 ml went ( well not all of it)
I was living in Bulgaria when they joined. Our local co-operative farm was 'given' the said amount. This money was 'given' to upgrade their machinery. Not one cent of that money was spent on machinery.
How do I know this? My dear friend owned some of this land but rented it to the government.
There was a big hooha when eu officials arrived to see what was going on but as my friend commented they have more chance of digging a hole in the Black Sea than finding where that money went

So the leavers are still banging on about the EU, If we hadn't we could have applied for money under the emergency funding to help all those who have been flooded but never mind maybe Farage will put his hand in his pocket along with Boris and all the leavers.

Apparently our contributions were equal to those from all the 19 (or was it 15) smaller countries. A lot of money. I’m glad we’re out.

Be careful what you wish for, you can be sure that an agreement within the EU will be found, it always is. You should be concerned that any shortfall will be at our expense, “there is no agreement until everything is agreed”, fisheries is especially contentious. The last thing the UK needs is a tariff war with our nearest neighbour, that’s going to hurt a lot of businesses.

Thanks for the links POGS

I forgot to mention Poland has the edge though in that they are the buffer with Russia.

Merylstreep
referring back to earlier commenting on Poland they have been refusing to taking any refugees yet want the money.
Too much cheek!

Okay, will do so in future MaizieD. My apologies.

Regards the E.U. funding crisis, all this is before Montenegro, Albania, Macedonia, Serbia and even Turkey come with their begging bowls when they join. Oh and maybe funding for the world's third or is it fourth superpower army?

Dig deep "rich" nations your masters in the EU want your money.

Ahaa! I was right

No problem with cut & pastes, but it would be good to have their origin mentioned. Even if they're paywalled...

I'm glad we never joined the euro, too, believe it or not, but that is for sound economic reasons, not born of an irrational hatred of the EU.

P.s. my OP was credited to the Guardian!