At last a fully functioning opposition

SirChenjin, in regard to your above post, I am sure that Kier Starmer would wish to look beyond the internal troubles of the Labour party and concentrate on gaining the long term support of the wider electorate.

However, to be able to carry that out Starmer has to be leading a viable political organisation, and that the Parliamentary Labour party is not at this point in time.

Dollymc1 and Grany, I totally agree with your posts on how Corbyn was treated by the MSM. However, what is also now being alleged within the leaked report is that unelected employees and other senior officials at the Labour Parties own Central Office worked against Jeremy Corbyn throughout his entire leadership period. In that, they even worked to prevent the party from winning the 2017 general election and then sent each other emails of commiseration when Labour did so well.

Totally incredible actions and a matter that has to be thoroughly investigated before the whole Labour movement in this country can move forward any further.

Dollymcl I totally agree with you. Well Said.

I have been a member of the Labour Party for more years than I care to remember
Jeremy Corbyn never stood a chance , vilified by the MSM
He was a decent and honest politician, I doubt we will see his like again

If he’s got any sense - and Im sure he does - then he’ll be looking beyond that to the wider electorate who I’m sure are ready for a change. I’m in Unite and I pay my political levy - I certainly didn’t vote for a Corbyn and I’ll vote for Starmer if he continues as he is. The internal wrangling doesn’t interest me and I suspect many others feel the same. Time will tell.

Whitewavemark2 in regard to your above post @13:34 today, Labour voters are an entirely different entity from Labour Party members and affiliate members.

It is very unlikely that there will be an election in the near future, therefore the requirement of voters will not be wanted at this point in time. However, the requirement of the support of Labour members and especially affiliate members will be totally paramount in the coming months. In that, the outcome of the leaked antisemitism report is only one of two other crucial problems that Starmer as new Labour leader faces.

Whatever is concluded when the above report is published, the Labour Party will be facing litigation and claims from the Crown prosecution Service and employees within Central Office for infringement of the Data Protection Act and through that failure under employers duty of care. The foregoing may very well deliver the whole Labour Party into bankruptcy.

Along with the above, there is in the autumn, I believe, the resigning of all trade union members to continue payment of the political levy. The previous time this had to be carried out activists in the trade unions through an outstanding effort convinced over sixty percent of their members to pay the levy, with the Unite Union having an incredible eighty-five percent of its members agreeing to the payment. Many feel that the same enthusiasm by those activists may not be forthcoming on this occasion unless Starmer can convince them he will be on their side and fully fighting for their ambitions.

Therefore, unless Kier Starmer, as he has started he wishes, can bring about unity within the Parliamentary party and also between the broader Labour movement and the party the future looks very bleak indeed for the PLP.

Good to see you have also developed a sudden concern about sexism within the party, something women have been raising for years.

It is good to see the approval that Starmer is reviewing from the Labour voter.

Amazingly only 5% of Labour supporters polled disapproved of Starmer, giving him an amazing 95% approval rating.

Starmer’s approval rating amongst the wider voter is gradually climbing which is good to see when Corbyn’s rating finished at -51%, a mountain impossible to climb.

The inquiry panel that is to examine the leaking and content of Labour Party antisemitism report has now been agreed by the National Executive committee. A party spokesperson stated on Friday that Martin Forde QC would chair the investigation, which will cover both the contents of the report and the circumstances of its release.

In addition to Forde, the panellists will be three Labour peers: Debbie Wilcox, a former leader of Newport city council; Larry Whitty, a former Labour party general secretary, and Ruth Lister, a professor of social policy at Loughborough University.

Many will be pleased to see Larry Whitty appointed to the panel as his background in the trade union movement and then as a former General Secretary of the Labour Party will be invaluable by way of his experience in the working and structures of the Labour movement.

The investigation is to commence immediately with many on the left of the Labour movement feeling It is critical that the inquiry focus on the very serious allegations of racism, sexism, senior staff members trying to sabotage Labour’s 2017 general election campaign and a failure to pursue antisemitism cases.

However, it would seem that the NEC online meeting became very fractious when demands for the suspension from employment and membership of the Labour Party of many named for misbehaviour in the document was turned down by the Labour Leader.

Several members of the NEC stated that In any other organisation, members accused of racism, sexism and misuse of funds would be suspended pending an investigation. Labour, they asserted, should be no different, and we call on the Labour leader to suspend those named in the report while the investigation is ongoing.

However, at least now the investigation is underway with already one senior Labour movement member resigning his post and the sudden resignation of another being linked to the inquiry and the allegations against employees and others at central office.

Link to the above can be found below:-

www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/01/labour-appoints-panel-to-investigate-leaked-report-on-staff

Ilovecheese, in regard to your post @17:21 today, all who are members of the Labour movement wish to see a Labour government come to power so as to truly bring about a fairer and more equal Britain.

However, what we all have to recognize is that the Parliamentary Labour Party has not been fit for the above purpose in over a decade. What the leaked report has possibly exposed is why that situation came about and how it has been deliberately maintained for at least the last five years.

While the Parliamentary Party has completely failed its members and supporters in recent years due to factionalism in the party, the trade union movement has been at its best by way of it's coordinated actions in the courts against employers using gig economy terms of employment.

Surely any left thinking person in Britain will wish to see what has been achieved through the trade unions repeated in the Labour Party. However, that will not be achieved by delaying the urgently required investigation, and through that, hoping all that has alleged to have been carried out "swept under the carpet" at central office.

I know what Whitewavemk2 means about the real aim is to replace a Conservative Govt with a Labour Govt. But only if it really is a change . If the Labour party goes back to supporting the austerity measures that have been in place, or indeed, as Alastair Campbell wanted, to have even worse austerity, what is the point?

Whitewave2, If as alleged employees and other senior persons within the Labour Party central office worked to prevent a Labour victory in 2017 then that requires immediate independent investigation for without that the Labour movement overall cannot move forward. However, what have we all witnessed in the past week, only Starmer still not agreeing to the independent investigation being carried out by persons outside of the Labour Party.

It has been a week since the national executive agreed on what the terms of the investigation should be and it is now only Starmer who is now holding up the required urgent start of that investigation.

Until all that has been alleged is either upheld or dismissed and measures to prevent such occurring again, what would there be to prevent any faction within the Labour Party working again to prevent a Labour victory in any future general election called.

WWMK2 I do read your post and you said but at the whole wretched lot of those self styled left wingers whose aim to remain pure to their ideology may mean that the left or centre left never gains power to help all those the left wingers profess to work for
Those were the people that almost brought the LP to power in 2017. What the right wingers were up to remains to be decided but most of the people I know believe that the full extent of what went on will probably never be known.

I just feel really sad about the people within Labour who wanted Labour to lose the 2017 election, like I felt sad about Labour M Ps who had claimed excessive expenses. I voted for Keir Starmer and am willing to give him a chance, but his appointment of Rachel Reeves has been a great disappointment to me. I hope the views that she has expressed in the past regarding austerity and about unemployed people are not an indication of the direction that Keir Starmer wants the party to go.

Blimey!! Why don’t you read my posts.

Of course where the democratic process is proven to have been subverted I would fully expect those found guilty punished.

I don’t seem to be able to repeat it often enough. The enquiry is underway. Let it take its course. Why on earth should anyone waste energy on it until the verdict!

Use your energy fighting the real enemy who are the Tories.

I am not biased against the left that is rubbish, I am however biased against anyone who is apparently undermining our democratically elected leader. As it happens I voted for him, but in the past we have had leaders who would not have been my first choice for all sorts of reasons, but my loyalty is towards the Labour Party and it’s proud history meant that I fight as hard for a centre left as I would a left leaning leader. That has been the party's choice of leader and that is who I support.

To remain part of the movement, but to undermine the leader is wrong. Just as wrong to undermine Starmer as Corbyn. You can’t have it both ways.

I fought for Corbyn and I will fight for Starmer. The party is greater than the leader -always has been.

WWMk2 Do you then take no account whatsoever of the actions taken by the right wingers in the LP to undermine Corbyn in 2017? Is it not possible that without that there would have been a Labour government? Why is your anger directed at left wingers and not at those individuals who used their positions to prevent a change of government? Are they not the people who let down the poor and under privileged?
Are you not in fact just demonstrating a bias against the left wing of the party?
Why do you think it is left wingers who must change and adapt and not the right wing of the party? They are the ones who have consistently failed the poorest in society.

grandad your words ring hollow when looking at your previous statements.

What I have repeatedly stated is that the enquiry will look at these matters. I am content as is my LLP as to the way it is being handled as is my MP as are all my labour voting friends.

Everyone I know who is a Labour Party member is accepting that due process will be carried out. I have not suggested, neither do I believe that it is water under the bridge. It isn’t, but it is being dealt with, and I fully expect that democracy will be the winner, with those subverting it being brought to book.

Examining our navels when so many people are dying or do not have sufficient to eat or will die of cancer, and all the other myriad issues, seemed self indulgent in the extreme, and frankly I question the motives of these people

Let the enquiry quietly take its course. My energy is on the poor, the sick and the services they rely on.

Whitewavemark2, in regard to your "quite extraordinary" post @11:59 today, I will state that I shall always post on this forum in the same manner as I always have, and will not be seeking or accepting the advice of yourself or any other person on what the content of those posts should be. Should you or any other forum member not appreciate what I state in those posts, then there is no requirement whatsoever to read them.

That stated, I have no issues with Kier Starmer becoming the leader of the parliamentary Party, but like very many others in the Labour movement, I do have profound concerns in regard to the deep and possibly illegal processes that have led to Starmer being in that position.

In regard to the above, should the allegations in the leaked report prove to be correct, then those circumstances will carry serious implications for the whole of democracy in Britain in regard to both the past and the future.

The Labour movement is the only realistic left thinking alternative to Conservative right-wing politics in the United Kindom. Therefore, should it have been, as alleged, that following Jeremy Corbyn being twice overwhelmingly elected to lead the Labour party there were those within Central office who took it upon themselves to "bring down" that elected leadership, those actions are beyond just verbal condemnation.

In that, if as is further alleged those persons colluded with others in the extreme right-wing media by way of acting covertly against an elected leadership, then the implications of that should be very clear to anyone who states they believe in the democratic governance of Britain.

For persons to state that the above is now just "water under the bridge" then those persons are also stating that there is in Britain a body of political opinion that should never hope to archive a fair voice and status even from within a party of opposition.

The foregoing is the reason why I and many others who make up the huge affiliate membership of the Labour Party believe that this matter must be investigated quickly but thoroughly by an independent body before the whole labour movement can progress into the future. Nonetheless, there would seem to be those within the Parliamentary Labour Party and beyond who wish to delay that progression and set the investigating body of the inquiry so as to ensure a "whitewash" outcome. However, others are rightly determined that will not happen.

for once in a blue moon, I agree with WWM2

trisher your post about Starmer is exactly why he has a chance of leading the LP to power the next time around.Indeed, if he couldn't, it would be a poor do, considering by then how many years the Conservatives would have been the leading party.With Corbyn ( or a Corbyn soundalike) they would have no chance at all.

trisher this is not directed at a either you or grandad but at the whole wretched lot of those self styled left wingers whose aim to remain pure to their ideology may mean that the left or centre left never gains power to help all those the left wingers profess to work for.

Absolute nonsense

You can tell I’m cross can’t you!

OK so the left wing are not happy with what they suspect will be Starmer’s drift away from the left.

They have absolutely no evidence! Other than suspicion.

Frankly I think it is all nonsense. We are living through absolutely unprecedented times and the future is looking extremely uncertain.

To risk the chance of a labour government because of a perception is entirely self indulgent.

The poor, the children in poverty, the NHS the welfare state, can’t survive such self indulgence.

Undoubtedly many would prefer left wing policies, but we are where we are and if that means that there is a more centralist Labour Government then so be it. It is far preferable to the shambles we have at the moment and the misery so many people have suffered during the past decade.

Of course Starmer benefited from Corbyn’s resignation, but so would RLB, Lisa Nandy etc done so if they had become leader, that is a ridiculous argument.

I am sorry but I find this nonsense beyond puerile and would suggest that those who are trying to capsize the boat either get a grip and begin to understand the implication of all the silly innuendo, and await the outcome of the enquiry in an adult manner or leave the Labour Party and set up a political party more suited to their beliefs.

Whitewavemark2 perhaps I can help. There is amongst the left wing of the party a perception that Starmer has never been entirely comfortable with the drift to the left and that he will try to take the party further to the right than they would find acceptable. They believe therefore that although he was not involved in the despicable undermining of Corbyn he has benefitted from it. In order to stop this belief spreading he needs to make sure it is dealt with completely and efficiently. The fear is that he will not. We should remember as well that contrary to much of what is posted on GN had there been a concerted effort to stand behind Corbyn in 2017 Labour might well have won the election. The belief therefore is that it is left wing policies that will bring about a change of government, the party needs to keep faith with those policies and if the PLP doesn't embrace those policies they will have to go. Personally I don't think Starmer will be leader by the next election, I'm watching Lisa Nandy.

whitewave - good post,
awaiting a response

At long last and not before time labour has a leader who lives in the real world.

eazybee I realise I'm late in responding to your question "Doreen Lawrence?"

She is the mother of the murdered Stephen Lawrence whose death has been the subject of several inquiries about the way in which the investigation was handled,the way in which the Lawrence family were treated and police corruption over several years.

It's no wonder that there has been an accusation of racism and they haven't just come from her.

I am disappointed at your posts grandad for a few reasons.

Corbyn lost the election and then resigned.

Starmer along with others put himself forward for leadership and won.

I understand that you are not a Labour Party member.

From your allegations there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Starmer has in any way anything to do with what people are claiming went on in 2017.

Your continued posts about an issue that is under investigation, or at least the investigation is being set up shows a level of desperation which is hard to fathom.

Can we assume that your choice of candidate didn’t win?

Whilst your post suggests you have real issues with Starmer, unlike the majority of the Labour Party, you never outline what exactly your problem is with Starmer other than trying to continually dish him.

I along with millions of other in this country are desperate to see the end of this Tory government who has caused so much misery and death. Your attitude however appears to suggest that you would rather see a Tory government than a Starmer government.

Quite extraordinary.

Please don’t reply with a long post about what is being suggested was done by “the right” or “Corbyn opposition” I get that. And have read it ad nauseum frankly. But I would like to understand what you are trying to suggest should happen and if you would not be prepared to support Starmer.