Rebecca Long Bailey sacked by Keir Starmer

Grandad1943 Sometimes when I read your posts I am reminded of a conversation we had whilst on holiday in Tuscany in the 1980s. Also staying at the hotel were a couple with two friends. She was a writer, now very well known for her historical family sagas. Her husband was a manager at Fords. The other man was a bank manager and the 4 were Tories.

We sat together at dinner one evening and talked politics. The writer' s father was a Nottinghamshire coal miner and she had been brought up in a Labour family. She, my OH and I all thought that the Labour Party were lagging behind in realising what people wanted. All of us had benefited from the NHS and a good education - none of us went to uni. But we all had aspirations and were achieving them. But the Labour Party were still in the past.

Blair, when he won the 1997 GE, was a breath of fresh air and he achieved many things, until the Iraq war. I have a strong memory of watching the result of the 1997 GE with friends and waiting for Portillo's result. We were all so elated.

I have always voted Labour but only joined the Party after Corbyn was elected leader, mainly so that I could vote for him. I have close friends who have been members of the LP for longer than I have known them, which is 40 years and their dislike of Corbyn is intense. We had a conversation yesterday about Corbyn and one of their complaints was that he lacked leadership qualities. I have always thought that strong leaders are not a good idea because their colleagues don't stand up to them. Thatcher and Blair are good examples. If they were opposed they didn't take much notice.

I was once told by someone on another platform that I was stupid for not voting Tory and that young people are idealistic and vote for the left but as they get older, they want to protect their assets and so they vote Tory. But I and my friends, some of whom are very comfortably off, vote Labour because we want a fairer system for everybody.

Anyway, to cut an even longer story short, you do sometimes remind me of that Nottinghamshire miner - living in the past.

Problem is that many of the idol worshipping Starmerites in the party do not seem to be able to take that on board.

It was really annoying to be called a Corbynite and worse. Do people now have to put up with more Daily Mail speak? If you have a decent argument you should not have to attack the people putting another one.

It seems to be fairly widely reported that many US policemen have been trained by the Israeli military police, and that the neck kneeling technique is one that Palestinian people recognise.

I think it is absolutely justifiable to comment about the ways in which police and the military behave in various countries and to look at whether the techniques used in one country have originated in another.

Many people, including myself, have commented adversely on the way in which Saudi Arabia, for instance, is run and how its power has caused mayhem in other countries like Yemen. Would that qualify me to be labelled "anti-muslim"?

But any comment whatsoever about Israel is immediately jumped on and described as anti-semitic. Despite the very real racism present, and evidenced on many occasions, within the Conservative Party, it has very wisely kept on the right side of Israel. Labour will never be allowed to flourish unless it too learns that even a sniff of support for the Palestinians will ensure it will be branded "extremist", "racist", etc. etc.

eleothan

RLB was not sacked for criticising the Israeli state, but that some of the accusations she retweeted were demonstrably false.

You cannot get involved in these sort of conspiracy theories, if you are a member of HM opposition. We must expect higher standards of our leaders.

RLB has been around long enough to be aware of the tinder box surrounding this issue and the dog whistles emanating from such a tweet. It was a crass and stupid thing to do given the recent difficulties Corbyn had experienced with anti-semitism.

One other thing I will say is that she has not performed well against Williamson. I think she suffered from lack of preparation, and appeared weak in her performances in parliament.

If we want a labour government, we need people of the highest calibre.

Meanwhile however criticism of Israel does not equate to anti-semitism. Never has never will.

The reasoning behind Rebecca Long-Baileys action does now seem to have become more clear. A few days back the Israeli government annexed large sections of the West Bank into Israel. Therefore on the face of it, Long-Bailey re-tweeted the anti-Israel message in support of the Palestinian people on the west bank.

However, it may well be that in that action Long-Bailey calculated that Starmer would have no alternative but to dismiss her from her shadow cabinet position and that would galvanise the left in the Labour Party and wider movement into action.

If the above was Long-Baileys intention then she has certainly succeeded, for John McDonald immediately tweeted to all on the left on the party and Broader movement "Don’t Leave, Organise",

The above was a reference to a long-standing grouping within the Labour movement that came into being so as to get Jeremy Corbyn elected as leader in 2015. McDonald's message has had its effect in that twenty-one Labour MPs signed up to the grouping yesterday, it is reported, with one of them being Jeremy Corbyn.

It is also being reported that Starmer was so concerned at what was taking place yesterday that he arranged a video conference call to both McDonald and Corbyn in an attempt to placate the obvious growing anger in the PLP and the wider movement at the sacking of Long-Bailey. Apparently, that conference call did not go very well.

So, if Rebecca Long-Baileys intention was to rouse the left it has certainly succeeded with Corbyn and McDonald now very much back in the picture.

It would also seem that the " Don't Leave Organise" group is set to replace Momentum as the main rallying point for the left within the Labour movement.

So, it is a case of watch this space.

Link to a Guardian report on "Don't Leave Organise" can be found here:-

www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/26/keir-starmer-faces-backlash-from-leftwing-mps-over-rebecca-long-bailey-sacking

It does not matter why RLB got sacked maybe she engineered the issue as a challenge to Starmer, more likely woke up tweeted without thinking and then was angry when told to withdraw.

It does not matter now she is in the wilderness for a long time.

Starmer has a lot to fix in the Labour Party and does not need dissent in the cabinet, everyone needs to be singing from the same hymn sheet.

Conspiracy theories are not what is needed grandad you have no idea what RLB intentions were no more than I do.

But supposing it is true and RLB behaved as you indicated.

In my view we don’t want people like that in the Labour Party let alone the opposition.

Whitewavemark2

But supposing it is true and RLB behaved as you indicated.

In my view we don’t want people like that in the Labour Party let alone the opposition.

And who are "WE". Just those that you feel should be members of the organisation.

Would you preclued all on the left who work as activists on the shop floor and in that assist employees with problems in their workplaces.

The above is probably the case as those "core members" of the Labour movement never ever get a mention from the right in the Labour Party.

Yes if that's true and we have no reason to believe it is I am glad she has gone. Her performance in her current role has been poor as was her performance during her bid for the leadership position. I have read the entire Maxine Peake interview and caught believe anyone would throw their career away over it. That interview had the political insight of a slice of cheese. It was dire.

I like Labour MP’s of the calibre of say Yvette Cooper, John Mann (now in the Lords I know) and Gisela Stuart (who stood down in Edgbaston). Voices of reason and intellect. People like this I could get behind and vote for!

The LP now will most likely tear itself apart. They don’t seem to want to unite behind Starmer and he’s their best chance of success. McDonnell is a dangerous ideologue and a big power within.

If the LP splits Tories will romp home every time.

Can the Labour Party survive?

Urmstongran - there is a lot of support for Keir Starmer within both the LP and the wider public.
The question I think, is can Momentum survive within the LP. I wish they'd set up a separate political party. I suspect the LP would be more electable without that group. It's so reminiscent of the period when Neil Kinnock threw out Militant

Galaxy, it was not the "performance" of RLB that mattered, it was the fact that she represented the left of the Labour movement in the Shadow Caninet.

The above maintained a balance and representation in the PLP which has now been broken. That loss of representation may prove crucial to the PLP in the coming months as it faces insolvency.

It took the far left 32 years to take control of the Labour Party,
they are not giving up the control now.

Her performance might not matter to you Grandad but it matters to me.

I didnt mean you personally there grandad rather that many who support the labour party arent interested in a certain sector being represented despite their lack of ability.

Anniebach

It took the far left 32 years to take control of the Labour Party,
they are not giving up the control now.

the "left" through the trade unions has always been the major source of income for the Parliamentary Labour Party although the party has never cared to acknowledge that fact with the exception of the Corbyn era.

However, in the coming months it may well have to come to grips openly with the above "fact" and also that it had been the right-wing within the party that got it into such dire financial plight.

The Labour Party suddenly has ‘the right’ and ‘the left’,

No, it still has ‘the far left’ and ‘the centre left’.

I think that identifying the left as the trade unions is wrong.

The unions by and large support the Labour Party. Some union leaders support the left wing, but union members are largely more to the right than you are suggesting grandad

If there is a split in the Labour Party it is by no means assured that the unions will support the left wing.

Presumably there would be a vote, therefore it is by no means certain which way that vote would go given what we know about union members.

I think that Starmer is in a much stronger position than you are giving him credit for. Look at the leadership election results and the fact that he has supporters in the key positions. He is also way more popular in the country than Corbyn ever achieved even at his best.

The left are in danger of becoming superfluous if they refuse to support the party leader. Perhaps it is time to set up their own party?

Starmer now considers the RLB issue done and dusted, regardless of the shrieks from the left. She did wrong, got sacked - move on.

Time to get back to the real job of opposition. Which Starmer excels at, just ask Johnson.

The reasoning behind Rebecca Long-Baileys action does now seem to have become more clear. A few days back the Israeli government annexed large sections of the West Bank into Israel. Therefore on the face of it, Long-Bailey re-tweeted the anti-Israel message in support of the Palestinian people on the west bank

So it's okay to use a Jewish conspiracy trope - a lie - in order to support a completely different possible wrong? I hear the bottom of a bucket being escaped for that argument.

She knows the issues the LP have had and yes, she should have read the whole thing and made a better decisions. Having made the wrong one, proffered a half hearted apology when asked, refused to delete the tweet when asked, and the refused to answer calls from Starker, I can only think she got exactly what she wanted.

Starmer!

I don't know where your info came from GGumpteenth but this source says it was Starmer's office that refused the meeting she asked for. I did wonder did he give instructions to his office then walk away and did they decide no talks were the best idea. In other words is a similar system as that that worked against Corbyn still in place to make sure Starmer doesn't veer to the left?
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rebecca-long-bailey-sacked-keir-starmer-talks-antisemitism-a9585751.html

'Love' the way people who are not, and have never been members of the LP, are so quick to put in their statement as to what is happening inside of it.

I am so proud to state that I have always been on what is described as The Left in the Labour Party (Yes, was told sixty plus years ago that I would change once I had adult responsibilities). Never did, in fact, life and those responsibilities only made me me realise how the only real way forward for a better and more equitable life for us all - was through socialism.

Before I moved house, I was in a constituency Labour Party that was probably had about 40% jewish membership. Firmly and consistently against the current State of Israel racist policies and very supportive of so many who labelled as anti-semitic due to their criticism of that right wing government. Funny, never called racist when they equally apposed similar governments like Saudi Arabia!!!

I threw my support behind Starmer - as I felt that even a more right wing labour government was so very much better than virtually any type of tory government. I am now very disappointed in this action of his and hope it does not portend a witch hunt in the party.

So, yes, I will probably join the Organise group.

I admire Starmer for getting rid of RLB as quickly as he did. I'm liking him more and more......

franbern I’m not sure that you can know who is a Labour Party member can you?