Institutional racism in the police?

There is some speculation as to the various statements that have been made. Initially a representative of the police said they firmly believed a "stranger" attacked the two women but I don't know how that could have been established so quickly and anyway that line doesn't seem to be so strong now. Possibly they have other information that they are not divulging. I believe it is the case that people are usually murdered by someone they know.

Whatever the outcome regarding who committed the crimes, the very fact the mother believes her daughters' "disappearance" was not taken seriously enough suggests that there is a problem regarding trust in the police. I don't believe these feelings - expressed by many black people -are imaginary. It would suggest that vast numbers of black people - or indeed any group of people who feel they are routinely discriminated against - are either deliberately dishonest or unreliable due to psychological instability.

Having your daughters' dead bodies used as a backdrop for selfies would, I imagine, reinforce the already simmering feeling that their lives had been of no particular importance.

Sorry I didn't mean that personally Sue Donim.
It just got me thinking about attitudes to gender, race, profession & how we perceive things. Best go to bed now methinks.

I also don't doubt that she believed it to be true & it may well be (hopefully the investigation will give some answers). The mother has shown such dignity in the face of what must be an unbearable tragedy for the whole family.

Which actually I’m not sure really answers your question, but I suppose I’m maybe saying that I hold them to higher standards. Strange really, as I’m an atheist.

Tbh, I’m a trusting soul (not always to my advantage, it has to be said!) and do in the first instant tend to believe people. In this case, being a woman of the cloth, I cannot imagine that their mother would be saying something she didn’t believe because it would, I hope, be against her principles to do so. I don’t know what she would gain by saying something that she doesn’t think is true.

Sue Donim I am intrigued by your comment that you would "trust her mother's judgment as a member of the clergy". Does that mean you would not trust the judgment of someone of no professed religion?
Sadly I agree that there is institionalised racism in most organisations which needs to be rooted out & dealt with. In my job I occasionally have to deal with people who go missing. In my experience unless they are underage or vulnerable it would be unlikely that police would instigate a search within 24 hours (dreadful for the families but adults can "choose to go missing").

Exactly. That’s why there’s a police watchdog investigation into it.

The address was known to the police ?

So much supposition SueD and supposition does not make it factual.

What difference does that make? The police may just have heard that one address and immediately dismissed everything else as irrelevant.

They had two different addresses Sue lived in different boroughs.

Again, their mother thinks so. As a member of the clergy, I’d trust her judgment.

Smallman attacked the police response when her daughters were reported missing, accusing officers of “making assumptions”, and she said: “I knew instantly why they didn’t care. They didn’t care because they looked at my daughter’s address and thought they knew who she was. A black woman who lives on a council estate.”

Perhaps some GNers are not totally aware of how the family dealt with this. Too many suppositions in comments here are being made.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000khd5

32.32 - the mother talking to Martin Bashir. She makes a point of saying there are good police

I think all there is left to say is that no assumptions should be made by anyone at this point about police procedure.
What the two policeman guarding the scene did was awful, and a different thing altogether, I think we would all agree on that.

That’s exactly what their mother does think - that a certain address = reputation for troublesome people and so no one took it seriously.

To my mind, for two sisters to disappear and neither of them be answering their phones for hours, and presumably not being at their homes, would be a cause for concern.

Does living on a council estate make one ‘a type’

Or.....two grown women who were together and had been partying with friends SueDonim into the small hours of Saturday, who could have gone on somewhere together....this is what the police would initially think.We should not fall into the trap of thinking the police will not search or care about anyone who is either black or rents a council house.

That’s the issue, though, Lemongrove. It’s not necessary for an action to be deliberately racist. It could be something like police assuming that these were two women who were black and lived on a council estate and therefore were ‘the type’ of people who’d do something of this kind.

On another aspect, the police have stated clearly that they were murdered by a stranger. I don’t know how the police can be so certain and I don’t understand why, if that is the case, they are not putting out strong warnings for people to take extra care.

WOODMOUSE I find it odd that the two women had been left alone in the park by 12:30 am. The middle of the night in a country park in the dark?
Probably someone will jump on me and tell me I'm being ridiculous, that women are as capable as men, but I wonder why none of the men stayed with them to make sure they got home safely.

Perhaps I'm just old- fashioned in my views.

I was wondering about that too lemon; strangely quiet.

maddy you are right, this silence on the crime is unusual, which gives me to think that the police may well know who did it, or at least suspect somebody,(evidence and proving it are necessary) and that takes longer.We shall see!

trisher.... Because this lady believes so doesn’t make it true.
She is a grief stricken mother.
Rushing to think everything is a racist crime and the police call centre who handled this missing persons case were deliberately racist in not searching right away is conjecture on anybody’s part.
The police no doubt wished they had searched right away as this has turned out, but if they gave it the same priority as any similar report, then they're not to blame.A double murder like this is rare.

tickingbird you may not believe it is racist. The mother believes it is and I prefer to believe her. I think possibly she has a great deal more experience than you have.

The murder of these two young women is a heinous crime, currently unsolved. All of us feel deeply for the mother who has behaved with such dignity in her darkest hour and hope that everything is thrown at the investigation to find answers.
The disgusting act of the two police officers is despicable in so many ways not least that it tarnishes the reputation of the majority of good police officers who are currently struggling to uphold the law in a climate of police bashing.

Two women who decided to stay in the park together. Carry on trisher.