Get back to the office! But why?

Yes, some of the jobs could go abroad, but some companies have actually been "repatriating" call centre jobs.

Actually yes, that reminded me. Friend works for a major utility company and their call centres are now UK based after many years in India.

We'll have to see how it pans out. But I'm still in the dark as to why Europe seem to have all embraced the office again.

Totally agree with your last sentence.

SueDonim

Yes! Yes! Yes!

Can we "grannies" form some kind of cross-party action group? It all makes so much sense. It would be good for the environment and people's wellbeing and would rebalance the economy.

suziewoozie

GG it’s not an either/or. There are many models being used which don’t involve kitchen tables. Some involve spending some time in and some time out of the office, some have those who want to going in, some involve hub and spoke with the use of serviced offices close to where the worker lives.Some businesses have already found that increased flexibility has increased their recruitment base and many report increased worker satisfaction. Too many people are trying to frame this discussion in the usual tedious dichotomous either/ or - all at home or all in the office. That’s just silly - we are going to see a much more flexible, varied situation. As for pension funds, it’s their responsibility to find other things to invest in which will develop the economy in different and more sustainable ways.

I did not say it was an either or situation, I said different people are comfortable with / need different ways to work according to their situation/health whilst Covid is still around.

I am an employer and have had to adapt over the last 5 months. Some employees need to be in the office full time some do not, one now comes in once/twice a month and works from home the other days.

There is not a one size fits all solution but killing off the office culture in the UKs cities would be disastrous on many levels.

Oopsminty

*Yes, some of the jobs could go abroad, but some companies have actually been "repatriating" call centre jobs.*

Actually yes, that reminded me. Friend works for a major utility company and their call centres are now UK based after many years in India.

We'll have to see how it pans out. But I'm still in the dark as to why Europe seem to have all embraced the office again.

Totally agree with your last sentence.

I don't know the reason for that either. However, I know Germany quite well. There is no city the size of London and there are various regional centres scattered around the country. Local transport is much better and better integrated than in any of the UK's metropolitan areas. Germany also has more manufacturing and successful small businesses, which are the backbone of the economy. Maybe there are some reasons there, although I admit it's only speculation.

It's been very hard on ancillary businesses in the centre of cities The worst aspects are that many will go to the wall and that wonderful after work life that I remember from working in London will be diminished, to be expected, sadly. I think there are a lot of fears it won't come back, thinking of theatres and the like.

I have had conversations with my son about it, as he is affected, hasn't been into the office for months. He and his girlfriend both work in publishing, their employers are quite happy with staff working from home and for them all to continue like this for a while. Depending on the type of business a company is involved in, if it has been viable for them to not have their employees in the office, I think it's safe to say they will have saved a lot of money in what they have to provide for the working environment. So much so, I imagine they must aske themselves do they need very large, prestige offices, or could they manage with smaller spaces, particularly if they are to stagger how many staff they have in at any one time, which will leave a hell of a lot of empty office space I imagine.

The upsides from working from home my son tells me is that he and his girlfriend are saving a lot of money they would have spent on their commute, most people who work in London have to go a good few miles out to afford to buy, or even rent, the cost of season tickets are ridiculously expensive. He also tells me they have a better work/life balance, previously they were usually out of the house from 7 am to 7 pm. A few downsides at times he misses the dynamic of working with colleagues and the after hours get togethers, and when working from home it's can prove difficult to have a proper division between work life and home life. They both tell me that the "Zoom meetings" can be continuous and intense some days and it's hard to wind down.

Clearly Covid has exacerbated the writing on the wall, I think there will be a limited return to the office in due course not sure things will go back to the way they were.

My offspring are all working from home and find that productivity has risen, pollution has lowered, Commuter stress is Zero, and they gain time by not travelling.

What’s not to like?

Both have been told that this will carry on for the foreseeable future. One works for one of the biggest pharmaceuticals, the other works for a government agency.

Both have been in discussions as to whether to encourage everyone to return to the office and the decision was made that it made no sense to do so at the moment.

No one is taking the government seriously.

There is not a one size fits all solution but killing off the office culture in the UKs cities would be disastrous on many levels.

It's already dying in some businesses. The economy will just have to adapt. It has no choice.

Oh I forgot travel expenses saved!

I was also wondering about Europe and thinking that perhaps their transport was a more pleasant experience than here, and their commuting time less. I have also read that the German Govt. is subsidising some employees to work less hours, to try and prevent mass redundancies.

Or maybe more people live in small flats? Just speculation,

I wouldn't be sad to see lots of coffee chains close down especially the corporate foreign owed ones, who seem to think they are immune to paying their fair shares of taxes to this country. I very rarely use a cafe but, if I do, I always look for a local independent or one in a garden centre.

The company I work for occupies 3 separate office buildings across a town. Immediately prior to lockdown, we were days away from signing a 3 year lease on a 4th building, due to workforce expansion. Because 90% of our workforce are working from home, the lease on the new offices has been cancelled. We have also notified the landlords of 2 of the existing office buildings that our leases will not be renewed in December of this year.
The small independent sandwich shop where most of us bought our lunches has already shut down. As has the men's barbers where many of our staff went for a quick lunch time trim. The wine bar that many of us met up in on a Friday after work, has said that it's closing it's doors at the end of September, when its lease is up. I suspect that the dress shops and shoe shops where many of my younger colleagues spent quite a lot of their wages is also suffering.
So it's not just about pension funds and international coffee shop chains; it's about the small independent retailers and hospitality venues where many office workers went to socialise at the end of the week.

that wonderful after work life that I remember from working in London will be diminished, to be expected, sadly

I worked in Fleet Street when all the national dailies were there. The print rooms were open 24/7 and it was indeed an amazing culture. You could be chatting to a famous journalist one minute, be eating in a "greasy spoon" cafe the next and then going to listen to a band jamming in a pub ... and rolling home a bit worse for wear on the tube!

Those days are, alas, long gone!

Economically it's far from ideal, but for almost every other reason, working from home makes total sense.

I suppose also that working from home is more satisfactory if one is already in a partnership and/or has a family.
Single people, especially young single people need to mix in order to form relationships.

I think that if working from home continues as a way of life then that could actually stimulate the evening time economy, so that people can mingle and socialise.

Perhaps nightclubs, bars, social clubs etc. might benefit.

growstuff the chains of coffee/sandwich shops will cut their losses and move on.

I fear for the small businesses, the individual dry cleaners, heel bars, book shops, taxi drivers, office cleaners etc, what will happen to them? Homes repossessed and out of work.

The City of London and other city centres around the UK are much more than people in suits behind desks.

Who are the people who work in most of London's coffee bars? Would they be immigrants by any chance?

If you fear for them GrannyGravy lobby your MP. Millions of people can't be made to do something they don't want and is unsafe, especially if their companies are happy for them to work at home.

The world is ever changing and we're going through a very bumpy transition. Wait until January and there'll be some even bigger bumps.

MissAdventure

Economically it's far from ideal, but for almost every other reason, working from home makes total sense.

Why is it economically far from ideal? I'm genuinely interested in your reasoning rather than trying to be argumentative.

Ilovecheese

I suppose also that working from home is more satisfactory if one is already in a partnership and/or has a family.
Single people, especially young single people need to mix in order to form relationships.

I think that if working from home continues as a way of life then that could actually stimulate the evening time economy, so that people can mingle and socialise.

Perhaps nightclubs, bars, social clubs etc. might benefit.

I was thinking about that. Maybe people won't be so knackered after their commute that they'll start going to local pubs and restaurants more.

Who are the people who work in most of London's coffee bars?

There is a world outside of London you know! Smaller, regional towns that have a mix of offices, light industry and retail and it's these smaller towns that employ people from all demographics and they will be just as badly affected as inner cities. The retaile industry was already struggling before COVID and with so many office workers no longer travelling into the town centres, they'll be hit again.

Wow! Just come back to this thread that I started earlier. So many in support of changed working patterns but also great points raised and debated positively.

growstuff, I was thinking in terms of small independent coffee shops and other businesses, but actually, I think with less time spent commuting, leisure activities may well move up in peoples' priorities.

Totally agree with your post Chewbacca

Isn’t it likely that people who work from home are less productive than if they were in the office?

Do people really put in the same number of hours at home when they are surrounded by the temptation of things which need doing ?

Yes there isn’t the daily commute, but how many workers can honestly say they haven’t put a wash load on, or put the hoover round etc ?

There have been many posts on here over the past few months from posters expressing frustration at being unable to contact companies by phone, whose staff have allegedly been ‘working from home’

There are lazy people w everywhere, whatever their work arrangements.
There are ways that companies can keep a check on output.

It could have that effect MissA but, on the other hand; if you think about a company the size of ours, with a workforce of approximately 100, the number of social events that usually take place each week/month will have had some impact on local bars, restaurants and the bowling alley. Birthdays, weddings, promotions and just general end of week/month get togethers are now vastly reduced in our company alone. We also used to use a local company for outside catering for our client meetings, board meetings and promotional events. We don't do that now. And we're just 1 company in a small town. There are hundreds more just like us; replicated across the country.