Anyone understand why Johnson is so far ahead in the polls? ( 2)

I think I would be happier if this information came from more than one source.

Incidence in France now 184 per 100,000. R number 0.77. Case numbers, admissions to hospital, admissions to intensive care all falling by about 20% per week. 28% of adults vaccinated. Over 500,000 vaccinations per day.
Data below for anyone interested in facts.
covidtracker.fr/

There is little doubt that many European countries have made a hash of dealing with covid,

There is no reason to think that we would have been any different, GillT57. It was the vaccines that saved us. Even so, we were well ahead of Europe in the number of excess deaths before the vaccine kicked in.

GrannyGravy13

I think I would be happier if this information came from more than one source.

Well, I don't think that a team of respected investigative reporters, working for a respected right wing newspaper, would be making it up. I wouldn't even have mentioned it had it come from a left wing source; that would have been pointless.

Plenty of it is familiar from other sources, such as minutes of Sage meetings, documentaries about the PPE shortages and its causes, parliamentary select committee reports, other newspaper reports and NHS whistleblowers. We even know ourselves how ministers have lied; such as the fiasco over the test target for the end of April 2020. It's just been pulled together into a book.

Yes the UK is 2 months ahead with the vaccine programme.
Here in France the children have had more days in school than almost all other European countries, other hospital treatments and operations have continued, as have face to face GP appointments. I detest the idea of turning Covid into some kind of competition, but there are other factors besides speed of vaccination.

lemongrove

Alegrias1

France had 250 deaths this week

Hmmm .... check your figures.....

Yes, you are quite right.....250 is the daily number of deaths on Tuesday 11th May in France ( 267 in Germany.)

Funny how figures vary. According to Sante Publique France the number of deaths as at 12 May was 107,119 including 184 deaths on Wednesday. The numbers are falling and there is a long way to go before the UK number of deaths is reached.

I accept that France was very slow to respond. Probably because it doesn't have an NHS the approach in the beginning was quite disjointed.

My original point in referring to France was that the UK was not the only country supporting workers financially. Other countries are doing that too.

As regards comparing France and the UK, this was in answer to Chesnut who told me that France had a smaller population. Which is true but only 2.5 million fewer. Comparing the percentages of the urban population is valid as the figures are very close. As I said, it is in the rural areas where the population density in France is smaller. I think that in the more sparsely populated areas in the UK, the number of cases is also fewer.

For those who are interested the number of first vaccines given reached 18.55 million on Wednesday.

You’re right Mamie it’s not a competition. Every country has made mistakes. People who think the UK has done better than others overall are burying their heads in the sand, it’s probably more comfortable to do that so I can understand it - but pillorying other nations is not helpful.

Pillorying? ?Ah come on Casdon ...it’s called being honest.
I can understand that burying heads in the sand ( because it’s more comfortable) is rather nice for those who always seem to wish that the UK does worse than any EU country.Newsflash!
We are doing just fine and are set to continue hopefully, as far as Covid is concerned, and are set to do better than was thought economically according to the BOE.

Doing just fine. Tell that to all the people that have lost loved ones. How callous....

Oh and, hurrah, the economy is going to be ok. Well, that’s all that matters to some isn’t it.....

Why would anyone wish the UK to be doing worse? That’s just silly.
We are not doing too badly now but I personally think a lot of mistakes were made last year. A lot. But I get the impression that thinking that makes me some kind of unpatriotic rabid leftie, so I’ll shut up.

And lessons weren’t learned from the mistakes either.

You can come and talk to me Lucca. There are some people who seem to like calling people names. My guess is that it's to try and shut them up. We used to call it bullying.

The economy matters Maybee but perhaps you can’t see that.

lemongrove I don’t want the UK to do worse than any other country at all, I just don’t like people pretending that we got more right than other countries when we didn’t. We got some things right and some things wrong, and so did everybody else.

PS. They're usually the people who don't have anything to say themselves.

Don’t be silly growstuff nobody has called Lucca anything.

Casdon

lemongrove I don’t want the UK to do worse than any other country at all, I just don’t like people pretending that we got more right than other countries when we didn’t. We got some things right and some things wrong, and so did everybody else.

I think a contract for blinkers slipped under the radar somewhere.

lemongrove

Don’t be silly growstuff nobody has called Lucca anything.

Are you trying to shut me up too?

Tough luck!

We got vaccination right....extremely right! First in ordering vaccines early, then in helping to get the AZ vaccine researched and made, then in giving people one jab ( lots of people) instead of a slow roll out and doing two jabs.A lot on GN were scathing about it, but it was science led and gave the UK a big advantage.?

growstuff what on earth is the matter with you? Who has told either you or Lucca to ‘shut up’.....where is that post exactly?

Yep, I supported the 12 week gap. MHRA/JCVI idea, wasn't it? Implemented by the NHS.

I argued at the time nobody would be blaming the government for it, so now nobody should be praising them either.

The only person calling Lucca a name was herself unpatriotic rabid leftie in her post of 15.25.01

Every Country has handled the pandemic differently, the reason being every Country is different, different infrastructure, different population demographics, different locations (i.e. destination as in Australia and New Zealand as opposed to hub as in UK, New York, Amsterdam etc.). Some have private health care, some a mixture of insurance and state health care and fortunately for the UK a free to point of delivery NHS.

Juggling the economy and peoples jobs along with halting all other medical procedures apart from urgent Emergency Medicine to save the NHS will have repercussions for many years.

The point is that it is all about a much bigger picture than just Covid numbers (important though they are). The short and long-term impact on the mental health of adults and children, the sustained progress of children and young people in education and training, medical treatments and operations cancelled and postponed, support for businesses and the economy etc etc.
No country will have got all these right and unless governments are prepared to support international co-operation, then they never will.

Yes, the UK did get vaccination right, which has saved many lives, and no, the attempt to delay lockdown on the second wave was disastrous when the government ignored the scientific advice, and that cost many lives. What’s so hard about acknowledging we did well on some things and badly on others?