Anyone understand why Johnson is so far ahead in the polls? ( 2)

AGAA4

We need an enquiry to start soon about the handling of the pandemic. It could take years.

I am more concerned about what is happening now. The same mistakes again.

Boris announced yesterday an independent enquiry will take place next year. He was all for it.

Chestnut

AGAA4

We need an enquiry to start soon about the handling of the pandemic. It could take years.

I am more concerned about what is happening now. The same mistakes again.

Boris announced yesterday an independent enquiry will take place next year. He was all for it.

I'm not surprised that Johnson is all for it. It was announced yesterday, but the results will very probably be announced after the next election, and by then a lot of people will have forgotten the agonising death toll.

I would be interested to know how many of his apologists lost loved ones in the pandemic.

What I don’t understand is that brexit supporters ( including Rees Mogg who said it could take 50 years to know how successful brexit had been economically) were happy to gamble with the economy to take back control of our borders (I’m sure people on here said it would be worth it, too). And yet, when it comes to having lockdowns to save people’s lives the argument is that you have to way that up against damaging the economy. Now I might be a bit thick but that seems a bit two faced. Even more so as the borders that we took back control of we didn’t bother to close. Or, if we did it was a case of locking the stable door after the horse had bolted. Which is the situation we’re in now.

GrannyGravy13

The only person calling Lucca a name was herself unpatriotic rabid leftie in her post of 15.25.01

Every Country has handled the pandemic differently, the reason being every Country is different, different infrastructure, different population demographics, different locations (i.e. destination as in Australia and New Zealand as opposed to hub as in UK, New York, Amsterdam etc.). Some have private health care, some a mixture of insurance and state health care and fortunately for the UK a free to point of delivery NHS.

Juggling the economy and peoples jobs along with halting all other medical procedures apart from urgent Emergency Medicine to save the NHS will have repercussions for many years.

Because..... lemongrove claims people like me want to see the uk do badly. Why would I ? I live here. My family live here.

I just don’t understand how people can’t see that mistakes were made and that our PM is not “good old Boris”.
And before anyone asks, I have no idea how Labour would have coped, and no I wasn’t a Corbyn fan.

MayBee70

What I don’t understand is that brexit supporters ( including Rees Mogg who said it could take 50 years to know how successful brexit had been economically) were happy to gamble with the economy to take back control of our borders (I’m sure people on here said it would be worth it, too). And yet, when it comes to having lockdowns to save people’s lives the argument is that you have to way that up against damaging the economy. Now I might be a bit thick but that seems a bit two faced. Even more so as the borders that we took back control of we didn’t bother to close. Or, if we did it was a case of locking the stable door after the horse had bolted. Which is the situation we’re in now.

Because Rees Mogg is only concerned about how the economy affects his personal wealth.

Lots of Conservatives, myself included can see with the benefit of hindsight that not all decisions made and the time they were implemented were correct.

Not all Conservatives are Boris Babes

The majority of Conservatives (that I know) are kind, caring thoughtful folks.

If only Chrystal Balls were real and in good working order?

''Not all Conservatives are Boris Babes

The majority of Conservatives (that I know) are kind, caring thoughtful folks.''

Let's accept this. So why oh why continue to support Boris and his Cabinet- who have been proven to be nothing of the sort?

GrannyGravy13

Lots of Conservatives, myself included can see with the benefit of hindsight that not all decisions made and the time they were implemented were correct.

Not all Conservatives are Boris Babes

The majority of Conservatives (that I know) are kind, caring thoughtful folks.

If only Chrystal Balls were real and in good working order?

Some didn’t need hindsight. Just swift decisive action based on evidence around .

Home ownership makes a youngster grow up and see the realities of life. It gives them a stake in society - it's suddenly in their interest to have stability, law and order and a government that's not going to trash the economy.

I do not in any way fear the Labour party coming back any time soon. It's actually possible that the next Labour Prime Minister hasn't even been born yet.

What I do fear is an alternative - maybe the Greens start to pick up the youth vote. They could end up pushing a ridiculous agenda.

In my opinion Boris needs to get young people on the housing ladder.

Getting back to the OP Urmstongran ?
The government is obviously doing enough things right, because they are more popular than ever. It may not last until the next GE, but unless Labour come up with something different, we are destined to have another Conservative government after this one, possibly still headed by Johnson.
Something to muse on.

Kali2

''Not all Conservatives are Boris Babes

The majority of Conservatives (that I know) are kind, caring thoughtful folks.''

Let's accept this. So why oh why continue to support Boris and his Cabinet- who have been proven to be nothing of the sort?

Why? Easy answer to that is because there is no credible alternative!

Even Tony Blair (who let’s remember led the Labour Party to victory 3 times on the trot) agrees with your comment GG13!

Ok. Genuine question.

Would those who have been vociferous in defending Johnson have voted for a different party of they had thought them credible? Or put another way, is this government in power not because they are any good, but because they are least bad?

Urmstongran

Home ownership makes a youngster grow up and see the realities of life. It gives them a stake in society - it's suddenly in their interest to have stability, law and order and a government that's not going to trash the economy.

I do not in any way fear the Labour party coming back any time soon. It's actually possible that the next Labour Prime Minister hasn't even been born yet.

What I do fear is an alternative - maybe the Greens start to pick up the youth vote. They could end up pushing a ridiculous agenda.

In my opinion Boris needs to get young people on the housing ladder.

The issue is that many young people don't have much hope of home ownership, unless their elderly relatives die. How do you suggest Johnson gets them on the housing ladder?

Incidentally, what exactly do people mean by "the economy"?

growstuff

Incidentally, what exactly do people mean by "the economy"?

As a teacher you should know?

Home ownership makes a youngster grow up and see the realities of life. It gives them a stake in society - it's suddenly in their interest to have stability, law and order and a government that's not going to trash the economy.

For many people the economy they live in is already trashed. Who do you think the economy should serve Urmstongran?

I don’t know the answer o that growstuff it’s above my comprehension. But it’s an issue for the Tory party to think on, in my opinion. Incentives of some kind. A highly reduced deposit?

Doodledog that’s a good question. I lent Boris my vote because he promised to Get Brexit Done. He & Rishi Sunak, Gove and David Frost (all Brexiters) are impressing me at present. Labour just looks less somehow with Diane Abbott, mouthy but embarrassing Angela Rayner, Dawn Butler as examples. The Lib Dem’s are still, for me, a wasted or a tactical vote only.

However I like the idea of a centrist, sensible group it isn’t going to materialise any time soon. Shame really as the voters would listen to such a party. The Tories do need a credible opposition. I just can’t see one at the moment but I’d be willing to be persuaded if one came along.

I think everyone of us in the UK has a stake in the economy PippaZ. It just depends upon one’s outlooks as to which political party appeals best to deliver more in line with ones interests. Hence the divisions.

growstuff

Incidentally, what exactly do people mean by "the economy"?

Unless they like lying, those who keep saying that Labour trashed the economy and the Tories look after it cannot possibly know Growstuff. They are just saying what they have been brainwashed to say.

PippaZ

growstuff

Incidentally, what exactly do people mean by "the economy"?

Unless they like lying, those who keep saying that Labour trashed the economy and the Tories look after it cannot possibly know Growstuff. They are just saying what they have been brainwashed to say.

That's exactly what I suspected. That's why I was wondering whether they know what they mean. The "economy" looks very different for a hedge fund manager and somebody in a minimum wage job. The "economy" could be GDP or whatever, but what's really important is how wealth is distributed. It's meaningless to most people if indicators such as GDP and inflation are favourable, but they're not getting a fair share of the spoils.

Urmstongran

I think everyone of us in the UK has a stake in the economy PippaZ. It just depends upon one’s outlooks as to which political party appeals best to deliver more in line with ones interests. Hence the divisions.

So what do you actually mean by "the economy"? Do you know?

Not really Urmstongran. I constantly try to learn and do expand my knowledge but without the education, in that area, I can never know the whole. So I just pester everyone I know who does know to explain all the aspects to me.

One thing I do know is that the Labour Party did not "trash" the economy - far from it - and that although the snearers will have a go at Gordon Brown he is held in high esteem around the world for what he did during the financial crisis. I do wonder what it says about the mass media that tried to paint it otherwise.

What I do understand is that there is growing evidence to suggest that high levels of inequality slow economic growth and limit social mobility. I also understand that a regressive tax system will affect the health and well-being of the entire population ... and a few other bits I have gleaned along the way. Thankfully, every day's a school day and I can keep learning while accepting that others more educated in economics will know a great deal more than I do.

But, while I can happily accept this you keep throwing out meaningless arguments like

Home ownership makes a youngster grow up and see the realities of life. It gives them a stake in society - it's suddenly in their interest to have stability, law and order and a government that's not going to trash the economy.

That is the sort of thing that would be chimed out by Jilly Cooper's Jen Teale in the 1970/80s in an effort to sound the middle-class they felt they had become because house prices doubled. Sad that we are still hearing it when we all now know that, as in 2008, when the bubble pops it brings poverty for some. House ownership is often just about accumulated wealth - not a home. Certainly, the marketisation of homes is a real problem for those not on the housing ladder - and their wealth or lack of it is part of the economy, as is the fact that homeownership can lead to a less mobile society. Equally, house ownership can limit the number of homes that can be acquired by those who do not have one.

One thing I have learned about the economy is that we try to relate it to smaller things we understand, like business or household economies (sometimes called the nation-household metaphor). But these common comparisons rarely do a good job of explaining how governments work. Although it may seem clever to talk about running the country based on making money in the same way as companies make it (or try to) for owners (or those who think they are) and shareholders, democratic governments are meant to be run for citizens - all citizens not just the ones with the most assets. And as we all now know a government, unlike a household, can print money.

But as I said, what I know is that I know very little but I am prepared to listen and to learn.

?I hope you benefitted from the mini lecture Urmstongran

Definitely lemon I sit at the feet of my more educated betters and learn all the time.