I do wonder- is this what the Brexiters wanted?

PS. My sister and her husband are already planning to take Spanish driving tests. Moreover, unlike many people who move to Spain, they can both speak Spanish

Well that’s great. My sister & her husband who have retired there are taking Spanish lessons. Sensible if you live there. We don’t of course. We just enjoy extended holidays but over the years have picked up a decent enough vocabulary between us - especially if ordering in a bar or restaurant!

Mind you, on the Costas I find that (a) the Spanish very much want to practice their English! and (b) lack of fluency in the Spanish language doesn’t detract from the grey spending power which is very much appreciated by the Spanish bar & restaurant owners! All these people spending their pensions brings a huge boost to their economy. I read tourism accounts for 12% of the Spanish GDP!

I can’t wait to go back in July. My sister rang me yesterday. It’s 26°C in Casares (behind Estapona) wall-to-wall sunshine for the next 10 days. Summer has finally arrived in Spain!

MerylStreep

lemongrove

Good post Urmstongran truly.?
Kali you are in Switzerland I believe and you used to have a flat in the UK, or maybe you still have? Or am I mixing you up with another poster I wonder. I know there was a poster who used to go on and on about unfairness because of Brexit and how it had affected them financially, but this may not have been you.
Just remember that voting to leave the EU bloc was the right of every voter in the UK and there was more to think about with that decision than those who had chosen to live in another country.

Ah, now the penny’s dropped. Thank you.

I gather from Kali’s response that the completely wrong Penny has dropped.

Kali2

Oldwoman70

Kali2

Free Movement of people agreed with India in exchange for Deal?

Are you objecting to free movement of people from India or is it every country you object to

I have no problem with it. My question is 'is it what Brexiters wanted or expected'.

To answer your question, I think the vast majority of people who voted Brexit did so with immigration in mind. This isn't to say those people are necessarily racist but Britain is a small island and our infrastructure has been put under considerable strain trying to cope with the amount of immigrants coming here. Perhaps if your life has been adversely affected by this you would vote Brexit in the hopes that this out of control immigration would either stop or be hugely reduced.

How very rude of you MaizieD ( and I may add...what does my question to another poster have to do with you.)
Kali has answered my post, so that’s the end of it, why are you stirring in this way, disgraceful!

MerylStreep

lemongrove

Good post Urmstongran truly.?
Kali you are in Switzerland I believe and you used to have a flat in the UK, or maybe you still have? Or am I mixing you up with another poster I wonder. I know there was a poster who used to go on and on about unfairness because of Brexit and how it had affected them financially, but this may not have been you.
Just remember that voting to leave the EU bloc was the right of every voter in the UK and there was more to think about with that decision than those who had chosen to live in another country.

Ah, now the penny’s dropped. Thank you.

Jeez, here comes the first reinforcement. Well done lemon

lemongrove

Good post Urmstongran truly.?
Kali you are in Switzerland I believe and you used to have a flat in the UK, or maybe you still have? Or am I mixing you up with another poster I wonder. I know there was a poster who used to go on and on about unfairness because of Brexit and how it had affected them financially, but this may not have been you.
Just remember that voting to leave the EU bloc was the right of every voter in the UK and there was more to think about with that decision than those who had chosen to live in another country.

Are you poised to restart the hate campaign, lemon?

You are, of course mistaken, both in your description of the former poster's circumstances and the identity of the one you were addressing here. But clearly ready for the off. Have you alerted the other pack members too?

lemongrove

Good post Urmstongran truly.?
Kali you are in Switzerland I believe and you used to have a flat in the UK, or maybe you still have? Or am I mixing you up with another poster I wonder. I know there was a poster who used to go on and on about unfairness because of Brexit and how it had affected them financially, but this may not have been you.
Just remember that voting to leave the EU bloc was the right of every voter in the UK and there was more to think about with that decision than those who had chosen to live in another country.

Ah, now the penny’s dropped. Thank you.

Just imagine the outrage and hatred if U.K. citizens were treated the same in EU countries.

U.K. citizens aren’t locked up in prisons when they arrive in an EU country - there’s the difference.
www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/13/eu-citizens-arriving-in-uk-being-locked-up-and-expelled?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Oh, but she was an immigrant, not an ex-pat.

Of course Brexit was about immigration - are leave voters cheering at the story of the 24 year old Italian woman ? - put in a detention centre, phone taken away, put back on a plane to Italy for the temerity of coming to the U.K. to help her NHS doctor brother with his children.

Urmstongran

Sorry growstuff. I can only relate about my sister’s circs. I have no knowledge post Brexit of those who choose to emigrate to Spain to live and work. Some friends of ours moved lock stock & barrel to open a bar in Benalmadena. Both aged 60y. But that was 18 months ago. Pre-Brexit and pre-pandemic. That said, they are doing okay but time will tell.

I imagine your sister, post Brexit, weighed up the pros and cons when making her choice? I think you said healthcare was expensive but affordable for them. It will have been one of the factors she took into consideration.

Someone I know aged 66y who has lived in Spain (as a resident) for 20 years chose private health insurance as her ‘peace of mind’. She has severe asthma and some degree of osteoporosis. She told me last summer, she pays €110 per month and it covers everything. Regular check ups, bone scans, blood tests, surgery when needed etc. If I lived there permanently I think it’s what I would do as well.

I didn't claim that it put my sister off her plans. She did do her research and knew what it would cost and can afford it. I was merely stating facts.

What I object to is being told that I don't know what I'm talking about and having what I know swept under the carpet by somebody who quite clearly doesn't know the facts.

PS. My sister and her husband are already planning to take Spanish driving tests. Moreover, unlike many people who move to Spain, they can both speak Spanish.

And who would find it really daunting to have to re-take a driving test in full, in the local language- over 60 or over 70- even those who are good drivers.

I admit that this had never occurred to me a previously but, if going to live in another country, it would be a good idea for driving tests to be compulsory, especially if driving on the opposite side of the road to the country where you learned and passed a test.

This is compulsory in Australia except for temporary residents.

My question is 'is it what Brexiters wanted or expected'.

I didn't vote for Brexit but I would say Yes, this is exactly the kind of deal that Brexiteers were hoping for.

Thank you for reminding me that I haven't had my driving licence back yet, Kali after I sent it off for renewal.
I must chase that up.

Cheers ?

Urmstongran

Sorry growstuff. I can only relate about my sister’s circs. I have no knowledge post Brexit of those who choose to emigrate to Spain to live and work. Some friends of ours moved lock stock & barrel to open a bar in Benalmadena. Both aged 60y. But that was 18 months ago. Pre-Brexit and pre-pandemic. That said, they are doing okay but time will tell.

I imagine your sister, post Brexit, weighed up the pros and cons when making her choice? I think you said healthcare was expensive but affordable for them. It will have been one of the factors she took into consideration.

Someone I know aged 66y who has lived in Spain (as a resident) for 20 years chose private health insurance as her ‘peace of mind’. She has severe asthma and some degree of osteoporosis. She told me last summer, she pays €110 per month and it covers everything. Regular check ups, bone scans, blood tests, surgery when needed etc. If I lived there permanently I think it’s what I would do as well.

If your friend has been resident in Spain for so long she will be covered by the S1. The insurance cover that she pays is for top up.

Urmstongran

growstuff

Oh dear! Yet another fairy tale! The EU have had accounts audited. You really shouldn't believe all the scare stories you read!

They hadn’t in 2016 when I voted to leave.

They are and have been audited each year. You are confusing auditing accounts with qualifying accounts. The EU''s accounts were qualified because of some discrepancies. Those discrepancies were a tiny percentage of the EU's total budget.
Many UK companies have their accounts qualified. It's not unusual.

My brother in law is 74y. He will have to, if he wants to drive in Spain. Which he does! A good driver will be fine. Your friends have lived in Europe for years. They will already be experienced and well used to the road signs and markings etc. It really ought not to be too difficult to sort out.

Healthcare is fine, as the excerpt from the French government has indicated.

Sterling didn’t tank as you surmised months ago so pension exchange rates are still decent - not the 1 for 1 as some doomsters were prophesying saying ‘all these pensioners won’t be able to afford to continue to live in France (or wherever).

It’s time to take a deep breath and be much relieved that things are not as dire as forecasters assumed!

Why Switzerland? Is Switzerland in the EU? I didn't think so.

How bizarre- none of this applies to me.

I know many British people living in France, Spain and Italy who do not speak the language well after a long time there. And who would find it really daunting to have to re-take a driving test in full, in the local language- over 60 or over 70- even those who are good drivers.

Would you?

Good post Urmstongran truly.?
Kali you are in Switzerland I believe and you used to have a flat in the UK, or maybe you still have? Or am I mixing you up with another poster I wonder. I know there was a poster who used to go on and on about unfairness because of Brexit and how it had affected them financially, but this may not have been you.
Just remember that voting to leave the EU bloc was the right of every voter in the UK and there was more to think about with that decision than those who had chosen to live in another country.

You seem determined to take a negative view for sure Kali2!

Did you read the 2 paragraphs from the French website I found for you?

Yes driving licences can be problematic but not insurmountable! My sister’s husband’s UK driving licence expired. He has to sort out a Spanish one, take a test. But a driver is always a driver! It will sort for him (and others).

You seem to want to take up the cudgels here when there is no need. It’s a though you are on a mission to decry Brexit as though it is making life impossible for ex pats or new emigres. It is not the case.

We shall, in the spirit of ‘entente cordiale’ just have to agree to disagree on this topic. Bon chance.

in full

The UK has no agreement currently about swapping driving licences with France, Spain or Italy. So elderly people now find the only thing they can do is to retake licence if full, both theory and practical, and also First Aid, in the local language.

There are currently many 100s of people in France and other EU countries who are unable to swap their UK licence. Their UK licencewas valid until it expired and now they just cant swap. Many are older, or have families and kids that need to get to school, or GP, work, etc- and who can no longer drive and there is no public transport.

Many retirees who are unable to get health cover, and who would have been covered by S1 had they arrived before 01.01.21. I am sorry, but you have no idea of the realities or what you are talking about.

Urmstongran

Yet this I just found on the French government website states

“The trade and cooperation agreement, which applies from January 1st, 2021, contains similar provisions on health care coverage for pensioners to those which currently apply under the European social security coordination regulations. These new provisions apply to circumstances beginning after January 1st, 2021.

Important: Like all non-EU citizens, UK citizens moving to France on or after January 1st, 2021, must be issued with a residency permit (“titre de séjour”) (http://accueil-etrangers.gouv.fr/demande-de-titre-de-sejour/).”

So again, I fail to grasp what the problem might be for your friends/people you know?

I do not believe for one moment that retirees will henceforth stop moving to Europe for their retirement if they so choose.

This seems to clarify & settle the matter ‼️
A storm in a teacup.