Criminalisation of refugees

welbeck

the tone of some of these comments suggests that people are not interested in the legal niceties of refugee status, they just don't want foreigners here.
if that is what you mean, why not say it.

That bland comment hardly covers the breath and scope of the problem! Firstly in defining who are genuine vulnerable refugees amongst the many who attempt to come here. Secondly to realise our small and already highly populated country cannot keep taking more and more new arrivals ad infinitum. Where will we be in 20 or 30 years and what will our population be? It's not about 'not wanting foreigners here' it's so much more complex than that. Maybe you can't understand that.

Too right Alegrias1. Absolutely barbaric. Again words fail me.

Who on earth would seek asylum here anyway? We are not close to anywhere

Me for a start nanna8
I wish I'd torn up my return ticket in November 2019.

I do know a few Australians who are descendants of Original Peoples, some whose families have been there for generations (one or two descended from First and Second Fleeters) and very many who have immigrated since WW2 from all over the world.

I don't think you'll find anybody here who opposes a fair and legal system Gwyneth, but if anyone does I'm sure they'll answer.

But there's quite a lot here who oppose draconian measures aimed at pleasing those who think that desperate people trying to get to our country are wasters trying to make a fast buck.

Just out of interest would all those who oppose a fair and legal immigration system be prepared to take those who come here illegally temporarily into their own homes?

We don’t want foreigners here. Oops I forgot, we are all foreigners except the Original Peoples. Must revise the thinking. ??

the tone of some of these comments suggests that people are not interested in the legal niceties of refugee status, they just don't want foreigners here.
if that is what you mean, why not say it.

Thanks Callistemon for those figures. We are a nation of migrants and there are many wishing to come. There is a process. At the moment it is not happening much because of Covid. The drownings have stopped now which is a small but important point. Who on earth would seek asylum here anyway? We are not close to anywhere .

Australia accepted about the same number of refugees as the UK in 2019/20.
It has a much smaller population and had, pre-Covid, a high number of legal immigrants.

For the year ending 30 June 2020:

There were over 7.6 million migrants living in Australia
29.8% of Australia's population were born overseas
Australia's population increased by 194,400 people due to net overseas migration
368,700 people moved interstate, a decrease of 8.7% from the previous year.

Has the Australian system stopped people attempting to get into the country from losing their lives at sea? Or do the fatalities continue despite the draconian immigration laws?

Yes, the Australian system is truly a negative one. Hard to believe of a civilised country.

NotSpaghetti posted an excellent link today at 15:30 Lemongrove that explains the disastrous outcomes of the Australian approach.

Although it’s hard for the authorities to ascertain the true age of young men who arrive here, it’s known that some are much, much older than they say.Who wouldn’t claim to be a child to get in?
One the subject of sending people to Rwanda, it’s only mooted as a plan as yet, and would not be ‘camps’ but proper centres whilst credentials are checked.Australia does a similar thing, using off shore centres.
It’s probably the only way to stop people smugglers and the continued human misery and drownings.Once it’s known what will happen then the Channel crossings will stop.
I don’t think that Rwanda centres will happen, but they could
Be sited elsewhere.

I just still don’t see the relevance then Chestnut
- this whole thread is about refugees.

We don’t actually know anything much about the 9,000 other than the countries they came from (as I looked that up). They came from 163 different countries as of March last year.

NotSpaghetti

Apologies Chestnut
I've quoted from the wrong post.
So how many of the 9,000 are asylum seekers?

Where is that info...

I don't know how many. I just said that we don't know how many. But they are all still here so what's the difference? Unless they are deported they are still here, asylum seekers or not.

MaizieD

Chestnut

MaizieD Assuming he was 'wicked' and 'deceitful' is just plain nasty. What a horrid view of humanity some people have.
I believe it is very wrong to deceive people who have put systems in place to help the most vulnerable and are trying to help children. It seems you believe it is acceptable for these people to be deceived, thus denying an actual child the help they need. That is a horrid view in my opinion.

Who said that the young man in question deceived anyone?
You were making assumptions and judging him on that. Not nice.

Isn't it deceitful to pose as a child when you are actually older? He was not the only one. I find it most concerning that children are not being helped because young men are taking their place. That is what is not nice.

Chestnut

MaizieD Assuming he was 'wicked' and 'deceitful' is just plain nasty. What a horrid view of humanity some people have.
I believe it is very wrong to deceive people who have put systems in place to help the most vulnerable and are trying to help children. It seems you believe it is acceptable for these people to be deceived, thus denying an actual child the help they need. That is a horrid view in my opinion.

Who said that the young man in question deceived anyone?
You were making assumptions and judging him on that. Not nice.

... though of course we were originally talking about people who had been granted asylum.

Apologies Chestnut
I've quoted from the wrong post.
So how many of the 9,000 are asylum seekers?

Where is that info...

NotSpaghetti

Chestnut obviously I don't know but I'm hoping you will tell me.

Please come back when you have the data Chestnut that "many" of the the 18,400 foreign nationals (your figure) in prison here have been granted asylum?

Please come back with a link to the actual data.
I can't take it seriously if it's just an idea.
Sorry.

Sorry, but you have completely misquoted me. There are 9,000 in prison and I said 'How do you know how many are not asylum seekers?' thus implying that some may be but we don't know.

Chestnut obviously I don't know but I'm hoping you will tell me.

Please come back when you have the data Chestnut that "many" of the the 18,400 foreign nationals (your figure) in prison here have been granted asylum?

Please come back with a link to the actual data.
I can't take it seriously if it's just an idea.
Sorry.

MaizieD Assuming he was 'wicked' and 'deceitful' is just plain nasty. What a horrid view of humanity some people have.
I believe it is very wrong to deceive people who have put systems in place to help the most vulnerable and are trying to help children. It seems you believe it is acceptable for these people to be deceived, thus denying an actual child the help they need. That is a horrid view in my opinion.

I didn't realise he was in Sweden, but surely it illustrates the point because Sweden is such a tolerant and welcoming country. There are wicked people who will take advantage of that. Posing as a child is such a deceitful thing to do.

He was 16 when he left Afghanistan. 16 is a child. We don't know how long he'd been in Sweden when the photo was taken. But the fact that it took him a long time to get there, couldn't just hop on a plane and get there in a few hours, speaks of resourcefulness and determination. Nor bad qualities for new immigrants to a country.

Assuming he was 'wicked' and 'deceitful' is just plain nasty. What a horrid view of humanity some people have.

MaizieD

Alegrias1

NotSpaghetti

Chestnut

Alegrias1

I did a reverse image check. Daily Mail, what a surprise.

This is what they said about this person:

^An earlier version of this article said that Ahmed Farid 'claimed he was 16'. We are happy to make clear that he claimed to be 16 when he left Afghanistan but was 18 in the photograph when he was holding the fluffy bear. We have removed references to him as a gesture of goodwill.^

Not a child then.

He claimed he was 16 when he left.
Obviously not a child now!

And in Sweden.

Always has been

What? The lad that is being held up as an example of a fraudulent 'child' isn't even in the UK?

It's a bit like scraping the bottom of the barrel to do that, isn't it?

I didn't realise he was in Sweden, but surely it illustrates the point because Sweden is such a tolerant and welcoming country. There are wicked people who will take advantage of that. Posing as a child is such a deceitful thing to do.

NotSpaghetti

How ludicrous! I'm sorry, this is nothing to do with asylum seekers Chestnut

How do you know how many are not asylum seekers? They have been allowed to enter the country and are still here.