Census Questions

Short explanation of DNA tests:

support.ancestry.com/s/article/Y-DNA-mtDNA-and-Autosomal-DNA-Tests

A guide to definitions of ethnicity, UK

www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/style-guide/ethnic-groups#list-of-ethnic-groups

Yes, but that's not the only definition of ethnicity. It's the one the government conveniently uses for its own purposes. It's not what some people use to define themselves or what other anthropologists might use.

I thought we were talking about definitions for census purposes although I realise that nanna8 is in Australia therefore ome definitions may well be different.

growstuff

Esspee

Where did you get the idea that a woman's DNA test will only show results of the maternal line growstuff? That is plain wrong.
I thought I was three quarters Scottish/Irish and one quarter English (my paternal grandfather was from Yorkshire). My DNA shows some Scandinavian (my paternal grandmother was from Caithness so no doubt some viking influence) and my paternal grandfather does indeed show up in my DNA as English, nobody in my maternal side got nearer to England than the Scottish central belt.

It's not plain wrong. Tests for women can only show mitochondrial DNA.

You need to do some research on DNA tests.

Instead of rudely telling people that they need to do some research, perhaps you could read the content of the links you yourself share:

Autosomal DNA tests trace a person’s autosomal chromosomes, which contain the segments of DNA the person shares with everyone to whom they’re related (maternally and paternally, both directly and indirectly).

I know huge numbers who wrote 'European' on their UK census, same as me.

Alegrias1

growstuff

Esspee

Where did you get the idea that a woman's DNA test will only show results of the maternal line growstuff? That is plain wrong.
I thought I was three quarters Scottish/Irish and one quarter English (my paternal grandfather was from Yorkshire). My DNA shows some Scandinavian (my paternal grandmother was from Caithness so no doubt some viking influence) and my paternal grandfather does indeed show up in my DNA as English, nobody in my maternal side got nearer to England than the Scottish central belt.

It's not plain wrong. Tests for women can only show mitochondrial DNA.

You need to do some research on DNA tests.

Instead of rudely telling people that they need to do some research, perhaps you could read the content of the links you yourself share:

^Autosomal DNA tests trace a person’s autosomal chromosomes, which contain the segments of DNA the person shares with everyone to whom they’re related (maternally and paternally, both directly and indirectly).^

Thank you Alegrias1. I get so frustrated when members on here spout rubbish and defend it implying you are a liar.

One gransnetter even disputed the fact my OH had both knees replaced at the same time. She maintained that I was wrong and had misremembered. WTAF!

DD2 is white born in UK- but although it does not show in skin colour, she put 'mixed race' as this is what her DNA and ancestry clearly shows- from all corners of the globe.

Many many years ago entering the USA I had to answer the question Race on a form. I put Human. The immigration officer I got happened to be black. I’ll never forget the warm smile he gave me.

Esspee

Alegrias1

growstuff

Esspee

Where did you get the idea that a woman's DNA test will only show results of the maternal line growstuff? That is plain wrong.
I thought I was three quarters Scottish/Irish and one quarter English (my paternal grandfather was from Yorkshire). My DNA shows some Scandinavian (my paternal grandmother was from Caithness so no doubt some viking influence) and my paternal grandfather does indeed show up in my DNA as English, nobody in my maternal side got nearer to England than the Scottish central belt.

It's not plain wrong. Tests for women can only show mitochondrial DNA.

You need to do some research on DNA tests.

Instead of rudely telling people that they need to do some research, perhaps you could read the content of the links you yourself share:

^Autosomal DNA tests trace a person’s autosomal chromosomes, which contain the segments of DNA the person shares with everyone to whom they’re related (maternally and paternally, both directly and indirectly).^

Thank you Alegrias1. I get so frustrated when members on here spout rubbish and defend it implying you are a liar.

One gransnetter even disputed the fact my OH had both knees replaced at the same time. She maintained that I was wrong and had misremembered. WTAF!

I'm not spouting rubbish and I wasn't implying you're a liar. I resent people who claim otherwise - and by people who should know better.

Autosomal DNA testing is not a precise form of testing and cannot guarantee anything more than an approximation. A woman's true ancestry can only be traced with mitochondrial DNA.

Oh FFS.....

Alegrias she should do some research into DNA testing and I wouldn't have been so curt if I hadn't been "spoken" to rudely in the first place.

I had my DNA done a few years ago. Its showed that my ancestors on both sides, mum's and dad's, had walked into the UK from Dogger Bank 10,000 years ago, Sadly, it didn't show what they called each other, what they ate for tea or where they set up home hut.

I'm living with the disappointment.

nanna8

I have just done an online census and was surprised that one of the questions asked about ethnic origins but you were only allowed to pick 2 . The choices were quite strange. England was stand alone, separate from Scotland and Ireland but my friend who has an Italian, English, Irish and Scottish background wasn’t sure what to put. I was also wondering what the purpose was. What do you think about the census? This time they have really simplified it, what a shame for future genealogists.

It sounds rather odd - do they mean where were you yourself born or what are your family origins?

Ancestry gives you an autosomal DNA test, 'which produces the most comprehensive snapshot of one’s ethnicity and living relatives.' You get 50% of DNA from your father and 50% from your mother and this is reflected in the results.

I imagine in the UK it is very rare for anyone to be 100% anything but I do believe (from research) that my mother was 100% Welsh and my DNA test has come back 53% Welsh. I'd say that is pretty accurate. Maybe the 3% was from my father!

I have been researching my family history for over 30 years. I know who all my 16 great great grandparents were. All of them were born in England and came from families who had been established in England, in some cases back to the 16th century, before which paper records are hard to find. The 10% English is probably from one line, who were established in North East England for centuries, but I know are all descended from one single person, who was born in London. My birth name is very unusual, so it's been easy to trace.

Of course, it's always possible that a father isn't the person who is stated on a birth/baptism certificate. However, I have done all my own research and haven't copied and pasted other people's research, as some people do. I am confident that my family tree is as accurate as it can be and I have always identified as English to the core.

I was given an Ancestry autosomal DNA test as a present a couple of years ago. I didn't expect it to be that accurate, but the results were totally unexpected. Apparently, my DNA is just over 10% English with the rest split almost evenly between French and northern European (mainly German). It was so unexpected that I even queried it with Ancestry because I thought I might have been sent the wrong result. The reply explained the limitations of the test.

If I hadn't already gathered so much information about my family tree, I might have been looking for French and German links in my family, but I know there aren't any, so where have they come from?

The reply I received from Ancestry suggested that my paternal grandmother, who was born in Devon, could be the link to French ancestry from Britanny, as well as some of my paternal ancestors, whom I already knew were probably immigrants from Normandy in the 16th century. It's possible that some of them had northern European (Norse) DNA.

The German ancestry is probably because most of my mother's forbears lived for centuries in Anglo-Saxon areas and they have passed on their Angle/Jute, Saxon and Danish DNA for over a 1,000 years. I doubt if any of them ever identified as German.

An autosomal test only tells you where most people with similar DNA live. It doesn't tell you anything about your personal ancestry. In my case, people with DNA most similar to mine still live in France and northern Europe, which is why I received the results I did. However, that doesn't make me half-French or half-German or any nonsense like that. I'm ethnically English and there isn't any doubt about it.

Men's DNA tests give more personal information because men have X and Y chromosomes. Women don't have Y chromosomes, so can only trace their maternal line directly.

In the case of Welsh ancestry, which snapshot in history do you use? Many Welsh people are descended from people who originally inhabited England. Scottish people might very well find that their DNA is shared with people in England or Canada or other places. It doesn't mean that they are descended from people in those places, but Scots have emigrated and established communities who share DNA, so a simple DNA test can be misleading.

Oops! I didn't edit my post very well.

This part "The 10% English is probably from one line, who were established in North East England for centuries, but I know are all descended from one single person, who was born in London. My birth name is very unusual, so it's been easy to trace" should have been at the end of the sixth paragraph.

An autosomal test only tells you where most people with similar DNA live. It doesn't tell you anything about your personal ancestry. In my case, people with DNA most similar to mine still live in France and northern Europe, which is why I received the results I did. However, that doesn't make me half-French or half-German or any nonsense like that. I'm ethnically English and there isn't any doubt about it.
The reason most people live in those areas is because that is where the ancestors originated. If your research indicates your ancestors were English but your DNA is only 10% English then maybe you should contact some of your closer DNA matches and see if they come from the families you have researched.

No Chestnut my gt gt grandparents are dead, so there' s no point contacting them. Most of my closest DNA matches live in France and Germany. Our common ancestors were centuries ago. They don't come from the families I've researched. They and I are descended from a common source. Autosomal DNA testing can only give an approximation.

An autosomal test only tells you where most people with similar DNA live. It doesn't tell you anything about your personal ancestry.

Not true. The way that autosomal DNA is shared between close relatives could be considered approximate, but on average you share 50% of your autosomal DNA with a parent or sibling, 25% with a grandparent or uncle (for instance) and 12.5% with a first cousin.

So your autosomal DNA can show personal family relationships with close family members that you might not be aware of.

Any shared DNA, within about 100cM, I'd be contacting them, if I was interested in fleshing out my family tree. They could be as close as 5th cousins, which means a shared g4 grandparent. My youngest g4 grandparent was born in 1810, which doesn't seem that long ago...

I'm not interested in fleshing out my family tree further nor in my "ethnicity". The shared ancestors in my case go way back further than four or five generations. It's likely to be at least 20 generations. I've already spent over 30 years of my life researching my family history and I have run a website for years, through which people contact me. I'm not interested in finding any long-lost relatives because I already have thousands. I have distant cousins living abroad, but all of us are descended from people who lived in England. The northern European DNA comes from at least 500 years ago.

PS. Most serious genealogists share my belief that autosomal DNA testing is a superficial tool and almost useless. It's a way for Ancestry, etc. to make money.

PPS. It is true that autosomal DNA testing tells you nothing about your personal ancestry, unless close relatives have agreed to have their details logged.

Fair enough.

The "unless" is the important bit, eh?

Serious genealogists. OK. I am suitably put in my place.

Mine were African.

I could tell you about mine Call but I'm not a serious genealogist, so I'll just sit quietly in the corner, not interrupting the experts.

I got back to the 1500s but someone in my tree traced us back to Adam and Eve via King David and Anne Boleyn.