To want to weep fir the girls in afghanistaan

Any Answers on Radio 4 today spent virtually all the programme on Afghanistan if anyone is interested:

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000yt6x

If the Afghan Army and police force collapse now, no-one would blame America for feeling justified in drawing a line under the whole sorry business. The cost of training and equipping them was a staggering $88billion. That is only a small part of the huge amount of money they have pumped into Afghanistan in infrastructure and welfare projects as well as well as funding their combat role. According to the Costs of War project, the US has spent, in all, $2.26 trillion dollars since it first went into Afghanistan. It must stick in their craw that they will now ultimately have nothing to show for it.

No surprise from China, remember Tibet? The Taliban will obviously be boosted by this news and nothing will or can stop them. China was always known as the Sleeping Giant who would one day flex its muscles to the detriment of the Western world. That day would appear to be imminent. China maybe a pariah state,but look at the size of it?, We should be very afraid.The American Senate seems under the impression that Kabul will be well defended and that the Afghan army will be able to repel the invader? Well American naivety is well known, but I suppose we can only hope.

It truly is unbearable to think about what is ahead for the poor people of Afghanistan, and I don't honestly know what the answer is. As for China, they are slowly becoming a pariah state and seem to have given up their previous pretence of not being the threat from the East. I suppose the best any of us can do is help to fund the charities in the area, hopefully helping people to flee before the Taliban arrive in their towns

Jabberwok
Agree
Horrific for these young women and mental torture for their parents knowing what lies in store for them and powerless to prevent.

China have announced that once the Taliban capture Kabul they will recognise them as the legitamate rulers of Afghan.

That can only inflame the situation.

I don't know what anyone can do for this situation which is heartbreaking.
We cannot go back we don't have the trrops and I no-one has ever been able to win against the Afghanis from another country.
It is the worst situation. and the female MP I saw speaking on Channel 4 news was incredibly brave.

The Afghan army is, apparently 300.000 (hope I've got the noughts correct) strong, well equipped and well trained, with supporting air power, against an insurgency half the size,fighting in robes and flip flops, and yet this well turned out army is and no doubt will, collapse like a pack of cards. Why? I do fervently agree that we in the West simply must stay out of other countries affairs. We interfere again and again, and each time it ends in disaster. Countries must be allowed to evolve as they see fit, however much we disapprove. Lets hope this is the last time?!

love0c

With hindsight should we or any country have involved themselves in another country's problems? However, the saying 'pick your fights'??? so why go in and enter the fight unless you intend to win? We along with the US have walked away leaving the enemy still standing. Utterly ridiculous and pointless. So many deaths of innocent people.

We didn’t, we went in defending our own interests by exterminating Al Qaida.

With hindsight should we or any country have involved themselves in another country's problems? However, the saying 'pick your fights'??? so why go in and enter the fight unless you intend to win? We along with the US have walked away leaving the enemy still standing. Utterly ridiculous and pointless. So many deaths of innocent people.

biglouis

This is all very sad but the West has (yet) to learn that we cannot impose our ideals of democracy upon traditional tribal societies. No foreign power has ever established military dominion over Afghanistan. Nor should they. Western nations have enough upon their hands recovering from covid-19. US taxpayers will not stand for paying for another Vietnam.

Yes, I find that idea that no one has the right to interfere in and try to change a particular culture in a society, to be totally playing with my brain!

I have always agreed with that idea, and yet……..

This is all very sad but the West has (yet) to learn that we cannot impose our ideals of democracy upon traditional tribal societies. No foreign power has ever established military dominion over Afghanistan. Nor should they. Western nations have enough upon their hands recovering from covid-19. US taxpayers will not stand for paying for another Vietnam.

Oh I'm sure any reversal of the Trump agreement would undoubtedly have been extremely unpopular in the US, and of course politically Biden needed to be very mindful of that. He has said that after 20 years of support, Afghanistan must now defend and protect itself, as foreign troops cannot stay there for ever, which I suppose is a point. He also, like Trump wants all American combatants home by 9/11. So not much help or hope from anyone. I agree with SueDomin, those poor women and children just don't bear thinking about.

Just been looking up the decision by Biden to continue with the withdrawal.

So the primary objective of the USA government when it went into Afghanistan in 2001 was to degrade the threat of terrorism
from Al Qaida, against the USA and allies.

It was considered that this objective was achieved by 2010.

Meanwhile the Taliban has got stronger, but the USA considers that whilst it is a brutal regime it is not a great threat to either the USA or its allies.

The threat of terrorism is greater from other parts of the globe.

Another issue is that US veterans are apparently an important source of right wing armed recruitment in USA. Evidence of that - includes 06/01/21. America’s democracy, rule of law and public safety is under threat from armed recruitment.

So what has happened should be no surprise.

America looks after America, it’s interest is paramount.

Do you remember when we were called America's poodle ? I have been reading comments in the Times this morning including one which says "What would Churchill say ?This is not our finest hour"(Tobias Ellwood )
It is a tragedy unrolling in front of us .

I feel like I want to get all the women and children out of that country to safety and leave the murderous men to slay each other into oblivion.

*there should be *their ?

Whitewavemark2 yes, troops from any Country can be deployed under the UN banner after a vote. Russia and China could prove to be problematic and probably not agree, but they are not combative, like you say they are deployed to keep the peace in specific areas, not sure if there remit could/would be changed to cover an entire Country?

GrannyGravy13

I agree Jabberwok President Biden has the authority to overturn President Trumps agreement. They both have blood on their hands.

The Taliban leader/s will be laughing in their caves, being threatened by Ms. Van de Leyen will have make any difference whatsoever.

Did he though? The point is that the agreement was signed very early on in Trumps presidency and the Taliban had armed and readied themselves for 2021.

What Biden had to consider ( and I don’t know if I support him or not) was the likely outcome if he decided to reverse the agreement to his citizens.

What I do think is like others have suggested. That UN troops could have been deployed, but saying that they are usually deployed as peacekeepers and not combat troops which any foreign army will almost certainly become.

I agree Jabberwok President Biden has the authority to overturn President Trumps agreement. They both have blood on their hands.

The Taliban leader/s will be laughing in their caves, being threatened by Ms. Van de Leyen will have make any difference whatsoever.

Biden stalled for a few months we know that, but I suspect intelligence lead him to believe that to remain would cost many more USA deaths which I don’t think he had the stomach for.

I am also not sure about the popular opinion in USA. But I’m betting that withdrawal ASAP was the most popular option.

Oh for an editing facility!

Twenty years ago, when I was teaching refugees, an Afghani man, who'd had to flee because of his politics, said he was glad he had no daughters, 'because Afghanistan is no place for a woman'. Since then, Afghan women have known freedom to be educate and take jobs - freedom they will again be denied them. How can President Biden reconcile this return to the Taliban reign of terror with his Catholic conscience? The Afghan people, and especially the women, now have an acute sense of betrayal.

I do not know however, if a reversal of the Taliban/USA agreement was possible by Biden.

Someone might know?

Biden could easily have countermanded Trumps agreement and at least stalled the withdrawal. He is as guilty as Trump if not more so.