Does Briton have a moral duty to take in as many Afghan refugees as possible?

Ailidh you make several good points. Sadly, there are many who blame the migrant population, whether they be recent arrivals, in the process, or planned like the Afghan people, to promote their racist rhetoric. The number of times I have read on FB posts from people saying that we should house our own before we accept refugees, we should house our homeless veterans before we house traumatised Afghans, we don't have enough housing etc., etc. None of these are simple issues, especially homeless veterans, and none of it is the fault of those poor souls in Afghan. The shortage of housing is scandalous, but cannot be blamed on a few thousand refugees, but people like Farage keep pumping out their poison.

The "net benefit to the UK" statements I always find problematic. I don't dispute them but as a blanket statistic it does not take account of the places that already have large immigrant populations and where local people are left feeling - rightly or wrongly - that their ability to access crucial services, like schools and health care is seriously impeded.

I say "locals" rather than indigenous because I remember 30 years ago the Indian population in my area complaining that they were being swamped by eastern European immigration.

That said, I would prioritise the needs of terrified Afghanis over my local inconvenience any day.

the other thing we firget, is that there already is a significant Afghani population in this country and many of those coming to Britain now will have extended family and friends already over here. I am sure this community is already active in welcoming family and compatriots, some of whome will be traumatised by death, avoiding death and the fear for their lives. Mental support from those understanding their previous lives back home is essential.

Many of the Afghans coming here will already speak good English; that was one of the reasons that they worked with the British. Since they speak English, there should not be a problem for them getting work, although if they are highly educated with skills, then they should be employed in their area of expertise, and not expected to work in an area of work that is unknown to them. Apparently fifteen thousand have already arrived, and hopefully some more can escape, but I’m afraid so many will be left behind with the Taliban. It’s a desperate situation for them, and indeed for all the Afghans still in Afghanistan when all the combined forces finally pull out. God knows what their lives will be like then.

CraftyGranny

I don't think any of those things, Alegrias1 and I have nothing against immigrants. Just being Practical , you have to draw the line somewhere

I don’t know how anyone can look at people fleeing their own country with nothing looking just to survive, most of the people fleeing at the middle class, people with skills, and sync well time to pull up the drawbridge and keep myself safe it doesn’t matter that I have enough to share I’m going to worry about me and to hell with the rest of the world

I must not be practical

We're getting 300 Afghan refugees in my local area. There has been a huge outpouring of support, financial and practical donations.

No.

The strong work ethic is only one of the benefits. The willingness to do jobs others won’t do or train for jobs that are out there is part of that.
We do absorb large groups of immigrants, I think I read about 70,000 who had made applications for asylum in 2020. Sometimes the media gives the impression that we do nothing.

Mollygo I agree. But at present that is not a problem. We lack lorry drivers, care workers and hospitality staff, to name but three areas of job shortage and I am sure there are others.

The availability of work should govern where people are resettled. Most immigrants who come here like this, or illegally, have a strong work ethic and unlike all the apocryphal stories you here want to work and easrn their keep. We have successfully absorbed large groups of already English speaking immigrants like the East African indian population and they have changed our country massively and for the good. There are fewer Afghanis and they will be as well educated and resilient.

M0nica sometimes where there’s high unemployment it’s because there aren’t the jobs.
I think you’re right about many of them having expertise, although the Taliban are understandably reluctant lose those with expertise in fields they need.
Lincslass I’m impressed with what your local hospital is doing.

M0nica

lincslass Too often areas with cheap housing are areas of high unemployment. If jobs and available housing come together, so much the better.

Travelling on the motorways, it is easy to see that their are haulage companies all over the country so clustering should not be excessive, although I think for a group of people as traumatised as the Afghani's will obviously be, to be housed with other people who have been through what they have been through is essential.

They do have one advantage, many of them already speak good English. Many will be professional people who worked with the British, not just as translators - engineers, doctors, and so on and the various professional bodies should be approached to assess such professionals and help them to qualify or registered for British professional qualifications as quickly as possible, so that they can return to the careers they know and already have expertise.

Proud to say we are also, in our local hospital , having a programme for refugees Drs, radiographers, to help them certify for working in the UK. Good feedback from them so far. Hidden away in the depths we are doing our bit.?

lincslass Too often areas with cheap housing are areas of high unemployment. If jobs and available housing come together, so much the better.

Travelling on the motorways, it is easy to see that their are haulage companies all over the country so clustering should not be excessive, although I think for a group of people as traumatised as the Afghani's will obviously be, to be housed with other people who have been through what they have been through is essential.

They do have one advantage, many of them already speak good English. Many will be professional people who worked with the British, not just as translators - engineers, doctors, and so on and the various professional bodies should be approached to assess such professionals and help them to qualify or registered for British professional qualifications as quickly as possible, so that they can return to the careers they know and already have expertise.

M0nica

All the European immigrants have gone home. Send them to places that need lorry drivers and put them on accelerated courses to get their HGV licences and instead of a friendly smiling Polish delivery driver, we will have a friendly smiling Afghani delivery driver.

They will have work and be able to support themselves and their families and they will also be plugging a critical job shortage gap. I am sure there are other job gaps as well, hospitality and care.

Do not send people where the cheap housing is, send them where the jobs are.

You have to spread these refugees throughout the country. As one of the areas were there is cheap housing, and deprivation, our local council has already agree to take some people. There are also plenty of jobs going as well. Being in a cheap‘ area does not mean we are not willing to help and provide work.

All the European immigrants have gone home. Send them to places that need lorry drivers and put them on accelerated courses to get their HGV licences and instead of a friendly smiling Polish delivery driver, we will have a friendly smiling Afghani delivery driver.

They will have work and be able to support themselves and their families and they will also be plugging a critical job shortage gap. I am sure there are other job gaps as well, hospitality and care.

Do not send people where the cheap housing is, send them where the jobs are.

Sorry for the repetition at the end.

Actually, the title of this thread is slightly difficult.
Do I think we have a moral duty to take in Afghan Refugees? Yes.
I watch films of those people terrified of what will happen if they stay. I am concerned for those who have helped the UK and for the women and girls whose futures are uncertain under the Taliban and for the LBGT people who risk death by just existing. I’d like to see them all offered a place of safety here.
But who decides how many is ‘*as many as possible*’?
Is it the people who are unlikely to feel the impact of large scale immigration?
I read yesterday that a higher number of refugees /immigrants are usually placed where the property is cheaper. These are also the places where deprivation and poverty are cited as a reason for a faster spread of Covid. How can we get round this?

Is it the people with working knowledge of what is involved in resettlement of immigrants?

Is it the general public on social media?

Do we put a number on it like some other countries or refuse to quantify numbers, like Australia?
I read yesterday that a higher number of refugees /immigrants are usually placed where the property is cheaper. These are also the places where deprivation and poverty are cited as a reason for a faster spread of Covid.
How can we get round this?
Agreeing that we have a moral duty is the easy bit.

CraftyGranny

I don't think any of those things, Alegrias1 and I have nothing against immigrants. Just being Practical , you have to draw the line somewhere

I don't think "practical" comes into it when it comes to saving people from life under the Taliban. Save their lives, then work out where they can live. Maybe it will be here, maybe it won't. But either way, get them out of Afghanistan, as many as we can.

Also to mention, craftygranny, immigrants are a positive force in our economy. Don't believe me? Believe the London School of Economics.

'many people continue to assume that migration is a drain to the economy and to public services.

EU migrants contribute positively to UK public finances. According to recent research, they pay more into the system through taxes than what they take out by using public services and receiving benefits.'

blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2019/05/29/eu-migrants-contribute-to-uk-public-finances-but-the-money-hasnt-gone-where-its-needed/#:~:text=As%20a%20result%2C%20many%20people,public%20services%20and%20receiving%20benefits.

I don't think any of those things, Alegrias1 and I have nothing against immigrants. Just being Practical , you have to draw the line somewhere

How is this offensive? Let me count the ways…

Firstly, using the oncoming disaster caused by climate change to make a point about immigrants. But I think you might believe this to be poetic allusion, so we’ll leave that there.

So it’s really about pretending that this country is sinking under the weight of immigrants, which portrays them as a homogeneous bunch of ne’er-do-wells who only bring negative things to this country. Not people who come and add to our society by being doctors, entrepreneurs, vets – anything you can name. I just caught a bit of the start of the Ch4 News where a fish processor from NE Scotland, I think, was complaining that they couldn’t get staff and the government needed to allow them to employ people from overseas without all the red tape. Well d’oh, we had that and they voted it away. Who is it causing the country to sink? The ones who can’t join the dots, I’d say.

Alegrias1

CraftyGranny

Alegrias1

Somebody else posted this but I can't find the original post or I'd credit it.

We've really not been doing our share and we need to stop thinking everyone in the world is out to get us.

I completely disagree with you Alegrias1 we are a tiny country compared with most of the others, where the hell are we going to put them all, plus the channel migrants.

It isn't the water rising because of global warming, it is the county sinking under the weight.

No, you're completely wrong. Austria? Sweden? Is Germany 15 times bigger than us? Does Pakistan have the infrastructure to support 1.4 million refugees?

Your comment about the country sinking is not only wrong, but pretty offensive too.

Really, why is that

CraftyGranny

Alegrias1

Somebody else posted this but I can't find the original post or I'd credit it.

We've really not been doing our share and we need to stop thinking everyone in the world is out to get us.

I completely disagree with you Alegrias1 we are a tiny country compared with most of the others, where the hell are we going to put them all, plus the channel migrants.

It isn't the water rising because of global warming, it is the county sinking under the weight.

No, you're completely wrong. Austria? Sweden? Is Germany 15 times bigger than us? Does Pakistan have the infrastructure to support 1.4 million refugees?

Your comment about the country sinking is not only wrong, but pretty offensive too.

Alegrias1

Somebody else posted this but I can't find the original post or I'd credit it.

We've really not been doing our share and we need to stop thinking everyone in the world is out to get us.

I completely disagree with you Alegrias1 we are a tiny country compared with most of the others, where the hell are we going to put them all, plus the channel migrants.

It isn't the water rising because of global warming, it is the county sinking under the weight.

Somebody else posted this but I can't find the original post or I'd credit it.

We've really not been doing our share and we need to stop thinking everyone in the world is out to get us.

It's a difficult one. Of course we should be helping the Afghans, especially the ones that were helping the British Forces. But, If we are taking people indiscriminately, how do we know we are not taking in terrorists. There so many other senarios. Homes will be found for them here, as with the Channel migrants, yet there are so many British people who are either homeless or are living in crowded conditions because of the shortage of council homes.
The scenes and reports from Afghanistan are heartbreaking I know. Should more Islamic states offer help? I don't know the answers and would not like to be the one making the decisions.
I do know that we should proceed with great caution though.
And as for that pathetic excuse of a US President, agreeing to a deadline of 6/7 days to get everyone out - words fail me.