Police that can’t be trusted

How many stories are the like this one. Too many I’m afraid.
And I do know that there are some wonderful officers out there but life experiences have made me a bit www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-10049805/Frankie-Bridge-details-terrifying-incident-pulled-police.html

I beg your pardon, Rosie if I have got something wrong re off duty police officers, but I did say 'except in an emergency". You use the expression 'when something goes down' which I take to mean some kind of emergency, but an empty-handed woman walking along would surely not have been any kind of emergency.

Well said Rosie51 we know quiet a few Police Officers (two in the Met) they are brave, caring family people.

Couzens had planned the abduction in advance. It wasn't just a spur of the moment decision. When he was ready he went out looking for a victim.
I do feel sorry for all the decent officers who will be sickened by this murder. They will need to be very careful with women in future as many will be afraid if they are approached by a policeman.

I think Sarah believed that the man she spoke to was a trustworthy person and that's why she felt safe to comply with whatever he said. How wrong she was. I would have done the same and in fact did once many years ago. I got into a police car as I was walking home on a dark night. There were two officers. It's a trust thing.

25Avalon, spot on, it's an insult to all those working so hard to do a good job, isn't it?

Fat lot of use that advice is. What I’d like to see is someone standing up and say we got it horribly wrong, bad mistakes were made, we will investigate and put in policies so this doesn’t happen again. Then the public might feel a bit more trust. It is a shame for the decent cops out there.

If after all of that you feel in real and imminent danger and you do not believe the officer is who they say they are, for whatever reason, then I would say you must seek assistance - shouting out to a passer-by, running into a house, knocking on a door, waving a bus down or if you are in the position to do so calling 999. I agree that the list of questions reads as silly and unworkable but parts of this last paragraph are common sense for any woman in any situation where she feels unsafe, even if that person is presenting as a police officer. And of course Couzens was a genuine officer who would have had a warrant card which was always going to complicate things.
I can assure you winterwhite many police officers (they're not all men!) would love not to have to engage when something goes down and they're 'off duty' but like my son and thousands of other decent police they swear to uphold the law, even at danger to themselves, at all times. When the London bombings on 7th July 2005 happened, my son was amongst those running towards the danger, not away from it. I appreciate that Wayne Couzens has further tarnished perception of the police, but please remember for every bad apple (who are found in every walk of life) there are many, many more just doing a good job. Who do people think caught and charged Couzens? The same service that caught Dr Shipman, nurse Beverley Allitt, and paedophile paediatrician Ralph Harper....

I can't understand how Couzens, whilst off duty was still in possession of all his police paraphernalia. Why do off duty officers need their card, handcuffs, police belt etc??

The report I read said he had just finished a shift at the US embassy so presumably on his way home Scones

It's been reported in the press Lucca.

How do we know he arrested her for breaking Covid regulations by the way ? I’m probably being thick

I can't understand how Couzens, whilst off duty was still in possession of all his police paraphernalia. Why do off duty officers need their card, handcuffs, police belt etc??

Surely leaving all this stuff at the station would mean police staff with ill intent wouldn't have the kit on them to lead people to believe they were legitimate.

You can also buy used police uniforms and used police cars still in their police livery on Ebay. Surely this can't be right??
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165088228238?hash=item267006738e:g:ApUAAOSwAeJhJcVh

Think the new 'official' guideline as to what a citizen should now do in these circumstances are both impractical and unrealistic.

I wouldn’t have got in the car without asking questions anyway, but wonder whether that would have helped in this case. I’ve watched enough police programs to know that resisting arrest automatically means handcuffs. I wouldn’t even get in a car with a policewoman, because who knows?

Police are just people - so I'd never trust them 100%, as there's always one bad apple in the cart, anywhere. I'd never get into a car with a stranger. Police don't ever handcuff somebody and take them away single-handedly.

Oldwoman70

I think everyone is shocked and disgusted by this case - however, we must also bear in mind that the majority of police officers can be trusted and are not a danger to women. It is easy to tar them all with the same brush when in reality they are as disgusted by his actions as everyone else.

Maybe so, but how are we supposed to know which ones can be trusted? I will continue to beware.

Which makes it even worse I suppose

Whitewavemark2

MaizieD

I would have got into that car, too.

Despite having led a fairly blameless life (well, one or two speeding fines) I have had quite a lot of dealings with the police over the past two decades. I've never found them anything but polite and helpful. I would have no reason not to trust a police officer. But I am absolutely aware that that is not everyone's experience.

I don’t think your experience would have been similar if you were black or perhaps on a protest or had been unfortunate enough to have been assaulted etc.

It is astounding the sexism and racism that abounds as well as the refusal to take seriously such assaults etc.

I am aware, Wwmk2. I said I was.

I think I was trying to say that an 'ordinary' law abiding citizen would have no particular cause to distrust a police officer.
Poor Sarah didn't fall into any of the categories you mention.

Depends what reason he gave for saying she'd breached covid regulations. And handcuffing seems a wholly disproportionate approach. If it happened as reported I think I'd have shouted, kicked up a colossal fuss and drawn attention to myself for those reasons.
I didn't know that 'off duty' policemen not in uniform were allowed to approach and arrest people except in an emergency. That could surely be stopped straightaway.

I think everyone should be taught their rights in school. It is awful that in this country many people don`t know that a lone policeman can`t handcuff and arrest a lone female on a `breaking covid restrictions` charge.
Poor woman, poor family.

What hope is there ?

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10048901/Bristol-police-officer-sent-100-flirtatious-inappropriate-messages-woman.html

Absolutely ridiculous advice from the Met. Once again putting the onus on women whilst abdicating their own responsibility.
Why did colleagues not report incidents and concerns about Couzens
Why were complaints from members of the public not followed up
There appears to be an ethos of misogyny and abuse of power not just in the Met but in other forces as well.
Of course there are many many excellent police officers but there needs to be someone leading from the top and this is not happening.

MaizieD

I would have got into that car, too.

Despite having led a fairly blameless life (well, one or two speeding fines) I have had quite a lot of dealings with the police over the past two decades. I've never found them anything but polite and helpful. I would have no reason not to trust a police officer. But I am absolutely aware that that is not everyone's experience.

I don’t think your experience would have been similar if you were black or perhaps on a protest or had been unfortunate enough to have been assaulted etc.

It is astounding the sexism and racism that abounds as well as the refusal to take seriously such assaults etc.

I would have got into that car, too.

Despite having led a fairly blameless life (well, one or two speeding fines) I have had quite a lot of dealings with the police over the past two decades. I've never found them anything but polite and helpful. I would have no reason not to trust a police officer. But I am absolutely aware that that is not everyone's experience.

I didn't think there was any evidence to suggest she didn't think he was legitimate? (correct me if I am wrong) so that advice is useless, surely? As I said on the other thread, I would have got in the car too. We are taught to follow rules and authority so I think the police need to come up with a solution themselves so that this doesn't happen again. The blame/solution shouldn't lie in the hands of innocent women going about their business.