Is English cricket, not just Yorkshire cricket, institutionally racist?

Just saying cricket was played in my school in the east end of London not far from the old West Ham football ground

Spinnaker

Pot & Kettle

I’ve never understood why the P word is racist if the person comes from Pakistan. What’s the difference from calling us “Brits”
I think Frogs, Krauts or Paddies, could also be considered racist if we’re applying the same criteria.
I don’t think cricket is any more racist than any other sport or section of society anywhere in the world. We do need to address it though.

Is there an echo in here?

NotTooOld

Can someone tell me why it is racist to refer to a person from Pakistan as a P when it is apparently ok to call a person from Britain a Brit, a person from Australia an Aussie, a person from Scotland a Jock, a person from the USA a Yank, a person from New Zealand a Kiwi etc etc. Or am I mistaken and all these names are racist? Am I missing something here?

Oops. I’ve just said exactly the same thing.

I'm sure racism is alive throughout society in all institutions, businesses etc. If you think about it logically there will always be people who are against one race or religion. So some people in powerful positions will hold racist views. It's far better than it was years ago but I don't think we will ever stamp it out completely.

Alegrias1

^a person from Scotland a Jock^

Just to be clear.... it's not ok to call somebody from Scotland a Jock.

It's insulting and derogatory. Why are we still having this conversation?

And a brit is a small fish. How apt.

So your remark about the small fish isn’t derogatory?

Yes, it suppose it is.

mea culpa.

Now we're equal, can we stop calling each other names?

Alegrias1, I wasn’t calling anybody names, simply listing a few that are in common use and which we don’t seem to worry about.

I worry about being called a Jock (and yes, its happened)

I also worry about being called a Brit.

Scot and Briton will do it, thanks.

HannahLoisLuke: I’ve never understood why the P word is racist if the person comes from Pakistan. What’s the difference from calling us “Brits” I think Frogs, Krauts or Paddies, could also be considered racist if we’re applying the same criteria.

The obvious, rehashed-very-many-times reason that using the P word or the N word is different to using Brits, is because the P/N word is used in order to demonstrate racial and power dominance. Using the word Brit is in many times/places seen as complimentary and therefore isn't an insult.

Also, given that white people are dominant politically/socially using slang to refer to skin colour or nationality comes from a place of dominance.

TBH, I'm sick of the 'but it's where they're from' argument, in relation to people with brown skin. It deliberately ignores the insult. Which is how we get the phrase, 'It's just banter.' thrown about in court. It isn't banter. It's racism.

wellbeck having spend most of my career in education in inner city schools (mostly London but others as well) I can assure you that cricket is very much played in those schools, with inter school tournaments.

I don’t know where you got the idea that it wasn’t.

I’m a bit behind with the posting, I see.

But I couldn’t let that comment go.

I’m not racist (have several races in our family and one of my daughters best friends at college is a Sikh) and I don’t like racism so this is not a racist comment it’s a factual one. I lived in a big multi cultural city and I can tell you now that in my experience the most racist people are the Muslims! Here’s just one example - walking home from work one evening - it was dark but only about 7pm and a full grown man, not a youth said to me ‘get back to your own area white girl’. I pointed out that this WAS my area as my Mum,Dad and myself were all born within a 10 minute walk of that area! Id like to ask Will there be an enquiry lasting half a day into Rafiq’s racist tweets I wonder?! No of course not because it was anti Semitic and that gets brushed under the carpet! And as for Aveline’s earlier comment about the rape of young girls by Muslim men and Worriedwell’s following comment about there being no connection:- well there is because the girls allegations were not investigated because the perpetrators were Muslim and the police didn’t want to appear racist. Just as Rafiq’s antisamitic comments won’t be throughly looked into. Yet the police stop search and harass black men all the time without worrying if they appear to be racist.

Remember when people in the crowd dressed up as Monty Panesar?

It was meant to be an affectionate tribute from his fans.

Was it racist?

I’m asking seriously, not goading, He seemed to be on board with it. I’d like to hear what he thinks now.

It isn't OK to make derogatory remarks about Jewish people but Rafiq's tweets weren't the equivalent of what he has complained about.

He wasn't talking in a derogatory way to someone who was Jewish. He didn't pin them down and force bacon down their throat. He didn't tell them to go and sit by the toilets.

It wasn't a good thing for him to do but to try and make them equivalent is a stretch.

There was a white gang doing similar things to young girls where I live. It didn't even make the national papers when it eventually came out. When a woman I know complained about what was happening to her foster daughter at the hands of these men a social worker told her there was nothing she could do. So no I don't think it is anything to do with racism in cricket.

I used to go help a friend set up the cricket teas that they lay on for after the games (all over yorkshire) and i never saw nor heard any of this racism- and she actually worked for and supported an all asian team.They played against all white or mixed race teams or all asian teams too and no racism was evident- it was just all lads playing cricket- but that was back in the 80s& 90s so maybe things have changed now? And not for the better though it seems.

It seems to me that it's endemic in any sport involving all-male teams, which is most physical team sports. Sexism is rife in the same way. Sport engenders competition which encourages male cliquiness, ganging up and locker room talk.

This makes it very difficult to correct.

So far as I know this doesn't happen in women's team sports.

When we go to France I make very sure they know I am Australian and not British. Very obvious difference in the way you are treated. That’s racism.

Lincslass Absolutely not ok but it is being brushed under the carpet. He is no different from the people he is accusing of being racist.

Women’s team sports are also competitive and can be very cliquey with it difficult for new players to break in. Also in women’s football for example you used to get remarks referring to gay women as dy* although I’ve not heard it so much lately. So it’s not just restricted to male teams. I suspect it’s more rife in professional teams.

When i went back to college back in the late 90's- early 2000's as a mature student (still only in my early to mid 30's) one of our group was a youngish asian guy (whom we all got along ok with, i hasten to add) and his family were from Pakistan- but he often referred to his uncle having a Pa**i shop, and spoke of others he was complaining about as "them Pa***ies" as though that was ok for him to do so.?

Thanks, Avalon, I expressed myself badly. Certainly women's team sports are cliquey, as are many other all-women organisations. I meant that we don't seem to hear of racism in women's sports and I don't know whether this shows that women tend to be less racist than men or that ill-named 'locker-room banter' doesn't necessarily indicate racist attitudes in ordinary life.

nanna8

When we go to France I make very sure they know I am Australian and not British. Very obvious difference in the way you are treated. That’s racism.

No, racism is the Australians who stepped over an opera singer who had a stroke at a bus stop and left her there for 5 hours, because obviously as an aborigine she must have been drunk.

When we lived in Glasgow, DH (Welsh-sounding name but English accent, having been brought up in London) was noticeably treated more resentfully and aggressively than I was (neutral sounding name but obvious Welsh accent).
We were used to “banter” at international sports matches, well meant gibes against other teams due to inter-country rivalry, and gave as good we got (some of it being not so much near as on the knuckle after beer had been taken). This was not the same and felt nastily meant. There is a difference. And not always due to colour.

Two things came to mind. One was that the cricketer commented on a racist incident that happened to him when he was a teenager and long before he played for Yorkshire, so really is irrelevant to his complaint against Yorkshire. The second was because this was not in a court the players accused had no right of reply or defence. Then it came to light that Rafiq himself has made anti semitic remark. (Apparently though it is ok because he apologised?).

I work with a man who is Pakistani. Most of the time he is lovely and great company, until he mentions anyone Jewish and then his racism is horrific to hear. If I spoke about my colleague in the same tone, I would be fired immediately.