Sunak has decided to help out certain industries - at last.

GG13 no one has asked you to. Certainly not me and I don't suppose that there are many people. if any, who are interested.

Visgir1

growstuff

I certainly worked bloody hard and have virtually no assets - I still have to work and will have to pay National Insurance Contributions, despite being above state retirement age.

Confused.. If you have reached state pension age and are in receipt of your state pension you do not pay NI?

You will have to from April, if you are still working. It is possible to do both- work and have the state pension although some people defer if they continue to work above the retirement age,

This sounds like the politics of envy growstuff. I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth, neither was my present husband. My parents lived far too frugally in order to have their own very modest property, which I as their only child inherited. I got married in my teens to what turned out to be a very abusive man; I stuck it for 23 years. I could have gone to Cambridge. I studied evenings, weekends and holidays to qualify as a solicitor. Not easy in the 70s in a man's world but I did it and it was incredibly hard to move up the ladder but I did and became a partner, ultimately moving to a partnership with a City firm. The hours I worked and the abuse I took from some household name clients who wanted everything NOW you wouldn't believe, right up until I retired. I haven't had an easy life by any means. So I make no apologies after the sacrifices I've made and the abuse I've taken at home and at work for now having a nice house and 'something to fall back on'. If I could have had a better life believe me I would, but someone had to pay the bills and put food on the table.

No politics of envy from me ... or OH. We have done very well in different ways, and yes, we know about the prejudices of the 70s and 80s when I returned to full time study as a mum of two, and the glass ceiling- and even in the 90s when our daughters fought that very fight.

The fact we have done 'very well' and can afford an excellent standard of living has never made us want to not pay our fair share in taxes to help those who, for all sorts of reasons, have not been able to do the same.

Yeah, yeah, yeah! "The politics of envy" is such a well-used epithet - can't you come up with something new?

In my case, it most certainly isn't the politics of envy because I am not the slightest bit envious of smug people.

PS Germanshepherdsmum How about actually justifying why those with assets pay less tax than those with the same income who actually work for a living?

Dinahmo

Visgir1

growstuff

I certainly worked bloody hard and have virtually no assets - I still have to work and will have to pay National Insurance Contributions, despite being above state retirement age.

Confused.. If you have reached state pension age and are in receipt of your state pension you do not pay NI?

You will have to from April, if you are still working. It is possible to do both- work and have the state pension although some people defer if they continue to work above the retirement age,

We're posting about the same thing.

It doesn’t matter that the country isn’t officially in lockdown, people are behaving as if we are, with crushing commercial consequences.

Urmstongran

It doesn’t matter that the country isn’t officially in lockdown, people are behaving as if we are, with crushing commercial consequences.

Yes, that's why the industry needed help from the chancellor, he must have known they were going to need help from the discovery of the new variant onwards. People have been really scared about losing their jobs. It is this sort of help that Governments can give, it's one of the reasons for their existence.

Urmstongran exactly, we were out last night, local popular restaurant for people who like to be seen, TOWIE, etc (we sit away from them) there were only three/four other tables occupied. In normal circumstances it would have been buzzing.

People are going out less, of course they are, and they are doing the right thing.

I really dislike the expression "politics of envy" I am sorry that the tax (NI) rise is being carried solely by working people. An income tax rise would have been a fairer solution, we all should chip in if we have the means.

Ilovecheese

I really dislike the expression "politics of envy" I am sorry that the tax (NI) rise is being carried solely by working people. An income tax rise would have been a fairer solution, we all should chip in if we have the means.

I agree an income tax rise would have been fairer all round.

growstuff

PS Germanshepherdsmum How about actually justifying why those with assets pay less tax than those with the same income who actually work for a living?

... how about asking the government why they chose to burden working people with increased NI contributions instead of raising taxes on income - which would probably have excluded the lower-paid and included the wealthier pensioners?

... and themselves.

I don’t make the rules growstuff. I have always paid my taxes and have never indulged in tax avoidance or evasion. I worked beyond retirement age too. Don’t have a go at me if our present circumstances differ. I recall now that we had a bit of a spat about my first husband having left me with debts to pay off and my feeding my child rather than myself. You know my history. I feel no guilt about being one of the ‘unemployed wealthy’ whose taxes haven’t (yet) been raised. What I have today I’ve earned in more ways than one.

GrannyGravy13

Ilovecheese

I really dislike the expression "politics of envy" I am sorry that the tax (NI) rise is being carried solely by working people. An income tax rise would have been a fairer solution, we all should chip in if we have the means.

I agree an income tax rise would have been fairer all round.

A tax which taxes all income, including from shares and property, would have been even fairer.

Germanshepherdsmum

I don’t make the rules growstuff. I have always paid my taxes and have never indulged in tax avoidance or evasion. I worked beyond retirement age too. Don’t have a go at me if our present circumstances differ. I recall now that we had a bit of a spat about my first husband having left me with debts to pay off and my feeding my child rather than myself. You know my history. I feel no guilt about being one of the ‘unemployed wealthy’ whose taxes haven’t (yet) been raised. What I have today I’ve earned in more ways than one.

I'm not having a go at you. I just disagree with your stance on the "politics of envy" - that's all. It's a lazy put down.

Btw growstuff I am not ‘smug’. What an unpleasant thing to say for no reason other than my financial position seemingly being better than yours.

I agree with growstuff

growstuff what about taxing ISA’s or Premium Bonds? which is where a lot of wo/men on the street invest to save themselves paying tax?

A tax which taxes all income, including from shares and property, would have been even fairer.

Yes this.

A tax which taxes all income, including from shares and property, would have been even fairer.

Investment income is taxed, it's just that it's taxed at a lower rate and there is a tax allowance on it, too.

I queried this once on twitter and was told, rightly or wrongly, that dividend income is paid from net profit; the rate of 7% was lower than the standard income tax rate because the company profit had already had corporation tax levied on it. I don't know if our taxation experts can confirm or refute this. But it still feels inequitable.

GrannyGravy13

growstuff what about taxing ISA’s or Premium Bonds? which is where a lot of wo/men on the street invest to save themselves paying tax?

Premium bonds lose value yearly because of inflation. They also produce no income if your numbers never come up...

Tax free ISAs (and they're not all tax free, are they?) were a government wheeze to encourage people to save. Wasn't it an attempt to make us all prudent and save for our old age..

Quite what their economic function is I don't know...

I think you are correct MaizieD we have to declare all income/interest etc it incurs tax but not NI.
Which is why an income tax rise would have been fairer.

MaizieD nothing wrong with being prudent/forward planning for old age, if of course your circumstances allow.