England will have no further Covid restrictions until after the New Year.

and a wall of opposition from Conservative backbenchers and ministers. ''

I can't help thinking that that is the most pertinent point in the article. Because, of course, a merchant banker and a coterie of extreme free market right wingers have far more covid expertise than a scientist

(though, TBH, I always found Jennie Harris a bit suspect)

I’m pleased that we haven’t been bounced into a full lockdown but I think there are measures that could have helped that have been ignored. Social distancing should be obligatory, table service only in pubs and restaurants, obviously mask wearing to continue in all indoor venues, vaccine passports or negative test to get into every venue from small coffee shops to theatres. Sports venues closed, games played in private. That’s what I would have done if I was PM.

''However, government sources have suggested that is now unlikely, based on the latest data and a wall of opposition from Conservative backbenchers and ministers. ''

Thanks. I have read it twice, and can't see that the data was 'false'.

Kali2

Urmstongran

And this, despite Jenny Harries trying to bounce us all into lockdown last week by feeding false data to Javid.

Just had to backtrack to this comment. Could you please back this up with evidence please. You can't really make this sort of statement without proven links to that effect. Thanks.

I’ve been out to lunch with friends Kali2. Just home.

Here you go:
www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/12/25/dodgy-data-used-push-tighter-covid-restrictions/

Sago if you really have to go dinner at friends I suggest you do a laterakl flow test just before you. Haven’t you read the rest of the posts

I am delighted Boris has held his nerve, more restrictions would devastate the country.

I really believe that by using our common sense we can more or less continue as normal and avoid more lockdowns.

We are seeing friends for dinner tomorrow evening so we have agreed to do LFT’s in the morning.

This is what most people are doing now, it has resulted in a crazy amount of positive tests country wide and caused many to change their Christmas plans but is far better than lockdown.

It is fortunate we can now do lateral flows I don’t know many who have had it recently but they report having suffered worse colds and would not have realised unless they has tested
My grandson was ill for 1 day although in contact with other family members they did not get it including myself and his brother

Until about a month ago I knew few people who had had Covid, now I'm hearing reports daily of people who have just had it or have it now. It's mostly people under 50 who have been vaccinated and children who are succumbing now.

By taking every care and a bit of good luck over the last 22 months none of my fully vaccinated family had been diagnosed until gd caught it 10 days ago, followed by dd and dh both positive in the last 2 days. I await my fate.
The last thing I would do is go out into a crowd on nye. Madness.

Urmstongran

And this, despite Jenny Harries trying to bounce us all into lockdown last week by feeding false data to Javid.

Just had to backtrack to this comment. Could you please back this up with evidence please. You can't really make this sort of statement without proven links to that effect. Thanks.

DD1 and DSiL have it, DGS1 is just out isolation after having it - they are just waiting on DGD getting it then another 10 days. We have not seen them except to drop off food at garage door. I have just had PCR yesterday and waiting result. If I have it DD2 and DGS2 will have to have PCRs and DD2 will have to self isolate and not go to work in NHS till results. The 3 of us are triple vaccinated. DD1 and DSiL are double vaccinated and on day 7 of isolation and still testing positive so forgive me if I would rather support Scottish Government rather than Boris. He is taking a risk and are lives less important than business?

As far as I have heard and read, the only worrying area of the country is London, where, shockingly one third of people have refused the vaccine.
There has been an attempt to reach out to certain groups which are particularly hesitant, so all we can do is hope that persuasive tactics work well.

Apart from that it’s good news with deaths and hospital admissions low, despite high cases.

Ferguson possibly may not have been wrong 100% of the time but he has come pretty close if you look back on his totally inaccurate doom-ridden ‘predictions’ for SARS, Mers and various other potential epidemics.
I have no idea why Boris appointed him given his record.

Labour have called for the information that the government have used to carry on regardless to be made public. This would seem like a sensible suggestion. After all are we not all grown ups??

Regarding SAGE Urmstongran
By Prof Valance 24/12/21
“All of the information from behavioural science through to immunology, modelling and virology, together with input from scientists from around the world comes to SAGE committee and its job is to try to turn this into advice for ministers……….
those who want to engage seriously with a debate that affects us all need to consider all the data in the round, not only those that fit an argument while ignoring the rest………
Speaking scientific truth to power is a difficult but necessary part of the democratic process if ministers are to be able to make an informed decision. This is what SAGE does”.
What other input would you suggest I wonder Urm?
I don’t think the science advice is the issue.
It’s the lack of transparency in how the politicians come to decisions concerning our health and what balance is given to science/politics. We might respect them more if this was the case.

We haven't had the figures over the Christmas period yet.

A political decision I'm afraid or rather the decision of the usual suspects of whom the PM must not disagree or he may find himself voted out.

By the way, I hope relaxing the rules is the right thing. It will just prolong the agony for another year if it is the proven wrong. When I hear that schools are fitting ventilation systems, I will breathe a sigh of relief.

No surprise from a populist PM to whom being popular is worth taking a gamble with the health of a nation yet again! Something he has continued to do since he claimed covid wasn’t a serious threat when it first reached our shores.

Surely, apart from allowing omicron to spread, he should be considering the adverse effect this will have on children who will suffer more if schools have to close again. He just doesn’t get it still!

Lateral flow tests aren’t totally reliable, but reduce the risk.

I’ve heard of several cases where an LFT was negative, but later the same day (one within a couple of hours) a 2nd test was positive. This could either be because the original test was faulty, or the virus didn’t show significant amounts of pathogen until slightly later.

So it’s a good idea to take a LFT test as near to meeting up with others as possible, and repeat if the get together is prolonged.

Pubs have been closing for a good few years now, perhaps due to cheaper alcohol from supermarkets, perhaps due also to the smoking ban. We can't save them all, covid has just speeded up their decline.
When you think of all the industries that we have already lost, steel, shipbuilding, coal, clothing, all manner of industries have been lost, for different reasons. I really don't think the hospitality industry can be saved without Government support.

I also don't like the "we have to live with it" mantra. But then I have recently read a post from someone who thought polio was not that bad, so who knows.

growstuff

rosie1959

It has been reported that the hospital admissions do not show which patients have been admitted because of Covid against those which have been admitted with something else and just happen to test positive although they have no symptoms

Who's reported that?

The figure I've seen from official sources is that about 10% of deaths from Covid in hospital are people who would probably have died anyway, but caught Covid in hospital.

Can remember have seen various medical professionals reporting that admissions are not split between people who are admitted because of Covid or tested positive on admission not actually caught in hospital

I think there are some subjects that expose deep seated prejudices. And it's often a surprise when that happens. I think the pandemic has demonstrated the view people have of those who have disabilities or chronic conditions. It's as if they arent seen as real people.

Sorry that was in response to your post of 11.52. Several more while I was typing.

I agree growstuff. I’m concerned about the fallibility of lfts too. How many times have we heard of people having several negative results followed by a positive pcr?
I despair at the ‘we will have to learn to live with it’ attitude as though it were the common cold. To hell with those who are vulnerable, they’re expendable. And then along comes the next mutation. I’m not advocating lockdown, just sensible precautions - and yes they might mean some pub owners going under but are we all supposed to sacrifice our own welfare to ensure their profits?

growstuff

rosie1959

I think England has made the right call at this moment in time.
Hospital admissions are not increasing by huge amount and the death rate has remained stable and decreasing.
Our main problem seems to be the number of people getting infected not because it makes them seriously ill but because it takes them away from essential services. We also have a problem with the unvaccinated
We will see if the restrictions in Scotland and Wales make a great difference I suspect they probably won’t
Things will have to move if Covid becomes less serious as it is with Omicron

Which source are you using for decreased deaths?

Uk coronavirus dashboard

rosie1959

It has been reported that the hospital admissions do not show which patients have been admitted because of Covid against those which have been admitted with something else and just happen to test positive although they have no symptoms

Who's reported that?

The figure I've seen from official sources is that about 10% of deaths from Covid in hospital are people who would probably have died anyway, but caught Covid in hospital.