Legacy of the fraudulent referendum

Excellent post Dickens at 09.38.

trisher

So that's the fruit and veg growers, the meat farmers and the fishermen all likely to find themselves unable to earn a living. All thrown under the bus by Brexit. It isn't really any use trying to explain to them that it took 45 years to establish the EU, so Brexit will take a bit longer. They'll all be out of business by then,

I don't know why as we have imported so much food from the EU for very many years.

The amount we will be importing from Australia and New Zealand will be tiny in comparison and probably far less than we imported from those two countries when we threw them under a bus in favour of the EU.

I don't think we are spending any more or less post Brexit at our holiday home abroad, namely around 12,000 euros per annum. The bills and maintenance continue as before, the gardener and cleaner still get paid, the mechanic still services the car etc. We eat out as before and although we are sadly limited to how much wine we can bring home, we now buy only the really expensive posh stuff abroad and just supplement with plonk at home. Fortunately there have been no changes in property ownership, so our place is still an investment. The dog has now become French, so vet fees and treatments are considerably reduced. Even my hair colour and re style is cheaper in France.
The 90 days issue is daft because it helps neither side, luckily we don't wish to spend long periods away.
Perhaps our area doesn't attract the loud British tourists referred to here, maybe that depends more on the age demographic, but I'm guessing even the people of Magalluf and Ibiza have found a way to make it work for them. I would be very surprised if the British contribution to tourism on the continent dropped significantly once the pandemic has passed.

Alegrias1

Urmstongran

How about this one Barmeyoldbat? In the Telegraph just now:

“Patients will receive new cancer drugs more quickly following post-Brexit changes to the regulatory oversight of pharmaceuticals.

The change of policy has already slashed approval times by as much as a month. The MHRA, Britain's regulator, has approved seven cancer treatments under the Project Orbis scheme, which it entered into last year after licensing decisions were no longer made by the European Medicines Agency.

Four of the newly approved treatments are for lung cancer and breast cancer. Another three are extensions of existing treatments.

Project Orbis links the UK to the US, Canada, Australia, Switzerland, Singapore and Brazil, harmonising the regulatory process so trial data can be submitted to all the regulators at the same time, where it can be reviewed and treatments approved.“

However, the two new schemes, while likely to expand significantly, are still relatively limited in range and coverage – and from the UK’s perspective, they could not be seen as an equivalent replacement in scale at this stage for its former direct involvement in EMA mutual recognition and centralized review procedures.

Mm hmm. Con indeed

www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/pricing-and-market-access/uks-first-drug-approval-via-project-orbis-html/

And the last clause of the article ...

"...whether this will represent any clear advantage over its former membership of the EMA remains to be seen."

On the topic of pharmaceuticals, the UK government has not yet committed to replacing the billions the UK was receiving from the EU for R & D, which is putting British jobs and research centres at risk.

Urmstongran

^Can you imagine how some Spanish and other coastal holiday resorts feel? English shops everywhere, English Cafés and restaurants, hardly anyone who speaks Spanish?^

A somewhat biased view there MaizieD as tourism accounts for 12% of GDP on the Costas. Many visitors (like ourselves) go out to enjoy the sunshine and spend our pensions in said cafe bars and restaurants. We don’t want their jobs! We take private health insurance so our health needs are covered!

Loads of Spanish cafe bar owners are bemoaning the loss of tourism. They were looking out for us all last Easter, hoping for golfing parties, holidaymakers and long stay pensionistas.
We are as a group VERY WELCOME.

Sorry to spoil your narrative but don’t let the truth get in your way of a good rant!

It wasn't me that said it, Ug. Try reading with understanding...

So that's the fruit and veg growers, the meat farmers and the fishermen all likely to find themselves unable to earn a living. All thrown under the bus by Brexit. It isn't really any use trying to explain to them that it took 45 years to establish the EU, so Brexit will take a bit longer. They'll all be out of business by then,

"The president of the National Farmers’ Union has accused the government of using British food producers as a “pawn” in post-Brexit trade deals.

Minette Batters, who has led the organisation representing British farmers since 2018, said “the most prized food market in the world” had been “handed over for nothing” by ministers, in their rush to sign wide-ranging free-trade agreements with Australia and New Zealand after the UK’s departure from the European Union.

Under the terms of the UK-Australia deal, which was signed in December, Australian beef and lamb farmers will gradually gain more access to the UK market over the first 10 years, before all tariffs and quotas on imported meat are removed. Similar arrangements have been agreed for Australian dairy products, with a five-year transition period, and eight years for sugar.

“It does feel like a betrayal,” Batters said in an interview with the Observer. “My greatest fear was that we would be used as a pawn in trade deals and effectively that is what’s happened.”

The nation’s food producers said they had been promised by successive environment secretaries, since Michael Gove held the post between 2017 and 2019, that any post-Brexit free-trade deals would include permanent protection for domestic food producers, in the event of a wave of imports.

“These are really bad trade deals for the UK because there are no checks and balances, she said. “We were promised as farmers that there would be forever-and-a-day safeguards, so if there was a problem, they could do something about it.”

www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jan/29/minette-batters-i-feared-farmers-would-be-used-as-a-pawn-in-trade-deals-and-thats-what-happened

MaizieD

^Culturally, the town has not changed much and what little change there has been is beneficial. But compare that to, for example, Boston in Lincolnshire, where a big percentage of the residents were born outside the UK and where the 'culture' of the place changed, it seems, virtually overnight^. Does it matter? Well yes, I think it does. We are all a bit 'tribal' - as are the immigrants themselves - and that sense of 'belonging' to a community matters

It's quite ironic when you think that for some 200 years we (Britain) rampaged around the globe imposing our culture on a great many countries and using their resources to make our country wealthy...

It's quite ironic when you think that for some 200 years we (Britain) rampaged around the globe imposing our culture on a great many countries and using their resources to make our country wealthy...

Even more ironic is the fact that we have absorbed facets of some of those countries' cultures into our own and now regard them as 'British'.

But the fact remains that many people identify with their local community / culture, and that is what I was pointing out. I was looking at this from other people's perspective.

The town where I live has always been diverse in its culture (especially in the Arts and Entertainment). We have a mix of Thai, Japanese, East European, Spanish, Italian, French and Polish residents, and it has been like that for the 15 years I've lived here, and nothing has changed. That is the culture and community I personally identify with.

The fraudulent referendum was won by lies, cheating and foreign interference. The proven illegalities would have completely nullified the result had the referendum been mandatory, meaning the decision should be enacted, but it was deemed to be merely advisory, giving parliament the freedom to reject to fraudulent win.

"Brexit: Former chair of Vote Leave refuses to apologise for breaching electoral law. Michael Gove and Boris Johnson also among key figures facing growing calls to account for campaign’s illegal behaviour"

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-vote-leave-drops-appeal-break-electoral-law-chair-andrew-marr-a8848231.html

What a pity only a minority of our politicians had the guts and integrity to stand up to the power of the right wing media and corrupt party donors.

A great win for Vladimir Putin, who conspired to destabilise the West by weakening the UK and the EU.

A great win for the billionaire tax dodging newspaper proprietors who had their own agenda.

A great win for Dominc Cummings and his front man Boris Johnson.

But an utter tragedy for our once great country.

Pantglas2

Kali2

There is 'tourism and tourism' ! And there is a bigt difference between those who travel for 1 week or two, or those who travel like swallows, for a whole season.

I think many Spaniard would love to see more Spanish restaurants, serving good quality local fare, and bars, and tourists being more respectful of the local culture and fare, and try to make a mit more effort with learning the language, etc.

The snobbery on here is very telling - if you substitute Spaniard/Spanish for Welshman/Welsh does the same apply?

All travelers get to choose where they go, what they eat and most hosts are glad for their business!

Call it sneery, if you wish. Mind you, this kind of tourism is not only for the Costas- we have 'the other kind' here- hordes of very rich, very snobby, haughty, loud British tourists in resorts like Verbier, Gstaad, or St Moritz. Full of cash and so disrespectful towards locals and staff from all over the world.

Yes, their cash is appreciated and welcomed- but not the above!

The Portuguese and East Europeans staff in those resorts hate them, but keep stumm. Mind you, not quite as much as the Russians.

Urmstongran

Or this Barmeyoldbat reported in the Telegraph on 27 January:

“London has retained its crown as the world’s top destination for financial and professional services in terms of its overall offering in another boost for the City.

The Square Mile outperformed other major financial hubs, including New York, Singapore and Paris, as firms quickly adapted to Brexit, according to a new report by the City of London Corporation.

The study examined the global business offering of each city, taking into account 95 metrics including those in nascent fields such as green finance activity.

It found that the City had an “unmatched international financial reach”, while it also excelled as a hub for tech and innovation and its share of headquarters of Fortune Global 500 companies rose by a third over the past year.

It also remained Europe’s leading destination for investment in financial services and was the world’s leading foreign exchange trading centre.

The City was given an overall competitiveness score of 61, followed by New York on 58 and Singapore on 53. Paris received a score of just 41.”

Oh good.

Things haven't got appreciably worse then.

It was all worth it.

Urmstongran

How about this one Barmeyoldbat? In the Telegraph just now:

“Patients will receive new cancer drugs more quickly following post-Brexit changes to the regulatory oversight of pharmaceuticals.

The change of policy has already slashed approval times by as much as a month. The MHRA, Britain's regulator, has approved seven cancer treatments under the Project Orbis scheme, which it entered into last year after licensing decisions were no longer made by the European Medicines Agency.

Four of the newly approved treatments are for lung cancer and breast cancer. Another three are extensions of existing treatments.

Project Orbis links the UK to the US, Canada, Australia, Switzerland, Singapore and Brazil, harmonising the regulatory process so trial data can be submitted to all the regulators at the same time, where it can be reviewed and treatments approved.“

However, the two new schemes, while likely to expand significantly, are still relatively limited in range and coverage – and from the UK’s perspective, they could not be seen as an equivalent replacement in scale at this stage for its former direct involvement in EMA mutual recognition and centralized review procedures.

Mm hmm. Con indeed

www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/pricing-and-market-access/uks-first-drug-approval-via-project-orbis-html/

I’m away now for lunch with my stepfather. It’s been nice chatting.
?

Or this Barmeyoldbat reported in the Telegraph on 27 January:

“London has retained its crown as the world’s top destination for financial and professional services in terms of its overall offering in another boost for the City.

The Square Mile outperformed other major financial hubs, including New York, Singapore and Paris, as firms quickly adapted to Brexit, according to a new report by the City of London Corporation.

The study examined the global business offering of each city, taking into account 95 metrics including those in nascent fields such as green finance activity.

It found that the City had an “unmatched international financial reach”, while it also excelled as a hub for tech and innovation and its share of headquarters of Fortune Global 500 companies rose by a third over the past year.

It also remained Europe’s leading destination for investment in financial services and was the world’s leading foreign exchange trading centre.

The City was given an overall competitiveness score of 61, followed by New York on 58 and Singapore on 53. Paris received a score of just 41.”

...con ...

How about this one Barmeyoldbat? In the Telegraph just now:

“Patients will receive new cancer drugs more quickly following post-Brexit changes to the regulatory oversight of pharmaceuticals.

The change of policy has already slashed approval times by as much as a month. The MHRA, Britain's regulator, has approved seven cancer treatments under the Project Orbis scheme, which it entered into last year after licensing decisions were no longer made by the European Medicines Agency.

Four of the newly approved treatments are for lung cancer and breast cancer. Another three are extensions of existing treatments.

Project Orbis links the UK to the US, Canada, Australia, Switzerland, Singapore and Brazil, harmonising the regulatory process so trial data can be submitted to all the regulators at the same time, where it can be reviewed and treatments approved.“

I think we have to move in from Brexit - it was a coin, we all know that, and once again it was initiated by an attempt to appease restless backbenchers.

And here we are again with a leader doing exactly the same thing in the context of a global pandemic.

Oh for a statesperson who will do the RIGHT thing and follow their conscience rather than prioritising his/her political future.

Urms, 5 years ago is to far, lets have an uptown date one please.

GrannyGravy13

Blame the folks who could not be bothered to get off of their backsides to vote, not the ones that did!!!!!!

“In every country that has ever held a referendum there are people who don’t vote. In the most progressive (least despotic) ones they consider those people don’t vote because they are happy with the status quo so special majorities or supermajorities are set. We didn’t. We had a referendum based on lies with a simple majority used to change our constitution. It was fraudulent and because of the way those of limited perception see lies as reasonable, people who didn’t vote as “other” and outside interference as acceptable, the arguments will go on.”

Urmstongran

It’s not a competition Alegiras.
Every euro spent n whatever part of Spain (posh or common) helps their GDP.

I'm not sure which bit you think is posh and which bit is common, but if it's Jerez that you think is posh I'd recommend a visit to a neighbourhood bar there at 2 in the morning...I can recommend one. Or several, now I come to think of it.

I'm sure they'd love to hear you ordering in Spanish so that they can practice their English.

And you could joyfully learn how to spell my username . Mind you I wrote as "sink", so what do I know...

Kali2

MaizieD

Culturally, the town has not changed much and what little change there has been is beneficial. But compare that to, for example, Boston in Lincolnshire, where a big percentage of the residents were born outside the UK and where the 'culture' of the place changed, it seems, virtually overnight. Does it matter? Well yes, I think it does. We are all a bit 'tribal' - as are the immigrants themselves - and that sense of 'belonging' to a community matters

It's quite ironic when you think that for some 200 years we (Britain) rampaged around the globe imposing our culture on a great many countries and using their resources to make our country wealthy...

Can you imagine how some Spanish and other coastal holiday resorts feel? English shops everywhere, English Cafés and restaurants, hardly anyone who speaks Spanish? Same in parts of France like Dordogneshire! And many Cities all over Europe and elsewhere, where large expat communities live parrallel lives, their own schools, own Churches and clubs, never learn the local language, or take part in the local community. Anglos-Saxon expats have always been the worst at not learning the local language and just shout louder to anyone who has the gall not to understand them!

Scraping the barrel here. During my career I met many people from around the globe, some of them being in the U.K. for 30 or more years, and no ability to speak English , costing no end of money in translation fees. At least we provide that, don’t think EU countries provide that in a health care setting. Or if they do you have to pay. Yes. Really barrel scraping , travelled a lot overseas, never heard anyone shouting to be understood, a polite do you speak English yes., as I did in the Netherlands.

... son's in-laws and friends. Actually son is almost Spanish now, but nationality a very slow process.

We haven't been to see our family in Andalucia for over two years because of Covid, but I would have thought that missing Brits would easily have been replaced by Scandinavians, Germans, French etc. We always enjoy having so many restaurants offering different cuisines, as it is a nice change from rural France. English is widely used because so many northern Europeans speak it. I don't think from my experience of Spanish people (son's in-law and friends) that they are as precious about their language as some countries.
Brexit is undoubtedly a disaster of epic proportions (in my opinion), but not sure Brits in or not in Spain is one of them.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Quotes deleted post

Kali2

There is 'tourism and tourism' ! And there is a bigt difference between those who travel for 1 week or two, or those who travel like swallows, for a whole season.

I think many Spaniard would love to see more Spanish restaurants, serving good quality local fare, and bars, and tourists being more respectful of the local culture and fare, and try to make a mit more effort with learning the language, etc.

The snobbery on here is very telling - if you substitute Spaniard/Spanish for Welshman/Welsh does the same apply?

All travelers get to choose where they go, what they eat and most hosts are glad for their business!