Official tonight 'Brexit is NOT done'

Rees-Mogg asks Sun readers for help with his new job – but it backfires

www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/rees-mogg-asks-sun-readers-for-help-with-his-new-job-but-it-backfires-311509/

An excellent article on the NI situation from The Irish Times

varian

Rees-Mogg asks Sun readers for help with his new job – but it backfires

www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/rees-mogg-asks-sun-readers-for-help-with-his-new-job-but-it-backfires-311509/

As we know from responses on this forum, Brexit voters don't actually know what 'petty EU regulations' they would like abolished. They just know that they exist, because the Leave campaign told them they did.

Oh well, when Johnson gets sacked he can go back to writing lies about the EU and then people can write to the Sun about them.

It is hard to trust Paisley here- but listen to what he says

fb.watch/b8EYEMOC-1/

that Johnson told him that he would not abide by the Deal he signed,

"Anybody could 'say' that they're only sending goods to NI. There would be nothing to stop them moving them on through the republic and re-exporting them to the EU. because there is no border between NI and the republic."

What a ridiculous argument for holding a whole province to ransom!

GrannyRose15

"Anybody could 'say' that they're only sending goods to NI. There would be nothing to stop them moving them on through the republic and re-exporting them to the EU. because there is no border between NI and the republic."

What a ridiculous argument for holding a whole province to ransom!

I guess you voted Leave, GrannyRose15. It's the only explanation I can find for simplistic thinking and believing the 'province being held to ransom' trope.

GrannyRose15

"Anybody could 'say' that they're only sending goods to NI. There would be nothing to stop them moving them on through the republic and re-exporting them to the EU. because there is no border between NI and the republic."

What a ridiculous argument for holding a whole province to ransom!

Sorry GrannyRose- but that was VERY clear always. the DUP were fully aware and took the bribe money. And Paisley himself has clearly and openly stated Johnson told him he would sign the Deal, and then refuse to put borders between what is effectively UK and EU.

There is massive concern in the EU that meat products in particular, would cross into EU unchecked- especially as the UK as now made it very clear they will allow the use of antibiotics and drugs, possible unsafe cheaper feeds, etc- so the EU standards will be very different to the UK, and allow the UK to raise animals cheaper and faster, and represent unfair competition. As well as the risk of importing disease- the EU has never forgotten about CJD- any of us who lived in the UK at the time are still not allowed to give blood here, due to risk.

Once animals, meat, goods have crossed from UK mainland to NI- there is no stopping it.

Isn't it very strange that currently it seems that it is the Brexiters who just can't accept Brexit has happened and want to go back on it. Brexit means Brexit- the said- and now they are changing to 'Brexit means Brexit but this is not what we meant'!

GrannyRose15

"Anybody could 'say' that they're only sending goods to NI. There would be nothing to stop them moving them on through the republic and re-exporting them to the EU. because there is no border between NI and the republic."

What a ridiculous argument for holding a whole province to ransom!

"There is no generally accepted term to describe what Northern Ireland is: province, region, country or something else. The choice of term can be controversial and can reveal the writer's political preferences"

And in any case the "province" voted to remain. Who's holding whom to ransom?

Kali2

Isn't it very strange that currently it seems that it is the Brexiters who just can't accept Brexit has happened and want to go back on it. Brexit means Brexit- the said- and now they are changing to 'Brexit means Brexit but this is not what we meant'!

Indeed - sore winners.

Has it not occurred to anyone that if we terrible Brits want to break the rules and send "illegal" goods to the Republic of Ireland then someone in the Republic or elsewhere in the EU must "illegally" accept them. It takes two to tango!!

GrannyRose15

Has it not occurred to anyone that if we terrible Brits want to break the rules and send "illegal" goods to the Republic of Ireland then someone in the Republic or elsewhere in the EU must "illegally" accept them. It takes two to tango!!

That's silly!

Of course there will be smugglers, if it's to somebody's advantage. How does taking sides and blaming people help?

I thought one of the selling points of Brexit was supposed to be about taking back control of our borders. Neither the UK nor the EU wants a gaping hole.

We've had over five years to come up with a solution. Maybe it would have been more productive to accept there is a problem rather than shrugging shoulders and/or coming up with ridiculous schemes such as a bridge (which wouldn't have addressed the main issue anyway).

There is no generally accepted term to describe what Northern Ireland is: province, region, country or something else. The choice of term can be controversial and can reveal the writer's political preferences

region
/ˈriːdʒ(ə)n/
noun
•an area, especially part of a country or the world having definable characteristics but not always fixed boundaries:
province
/ˈprɒvɪns/
noun
•a principal administrative division of a country or empire:
"Chengdu, capital of Sichuan province"
country
/ˈkʌntri/
noun
a nation with its own government, occupying a particular territory:"the country's increasingly precarious economic position

I stand by my choice of word.

GrannyRose15

^There is no generally accepted term to describe what Northern Ireland is: province, region, country or something else. The choice of term can be controversial and can reveal the writer's political preferences^

region
/ˈriːdʒ(ə)n/
noun
•an area, especially part of a country or the world having definable characteristics but not always fixed boundaries:
province
/ˈprɒvɪns/
noun
•a principal administrative division of a country or empire:
"Chengdu, capital of Sichuan province"
country
/ˈkʌntri/
noun
a nation with its own government, occupying a particular territory:"the country's increasingly precarious economic position

I stand by my choice of word.

No-one said your choice was wrong. I just pointed out that it said more about your political preferences than perhaps you realised, or maybe you did.

I would point out that, whatever dictionary you are quoting implicitly says that England is not a country, but Scotland and Wales are.

grannyrose15 by your logic drug smuggling, people trafficking etc is ok because “it takes two to tango”

There are plenty in Ireland, North and South willing to “bend” the rules for profit, they’ve been doing it for decades. It’s suited both sides to take advantage of the different taxation regimes freely because the GFA was more important.

The current dispute is purely about the loss of influence by the Unionists, and I’m quite sure Johnson did tell the Unionists he was going to ignore the protocol, true to form.

It makes sense, when you sign a Treaty, to understand it first...

bbc.in/3JjfdWZ

But you are right Katie- he did understand, VERY clearly and precisely what the Deal meant re the border- so did the Unionists- but Johnson told them not to worry, he would backtrack and then blame the EU. So they are all responsible- Johnson and co, and Unionists.

And the EU is perfectly right and fair to insist that the Deal is implemented as signed.

Remember how right he was. I truly miss our honest and great Tory friends

An honest politician, putting the country first- how refreshing www.facebook.com/JackWDart/videos/592769631194653/

What a loss!

vegansrock

grannyrose15 by your logic drug smuggling, people trafficking etc is ok because “it takes two to tango”

You have completely misunderstood my argument. I am not saying smuggling is OK. What I am saying is that in order for the UK to export goods to the Republic of Ireland someone in the Republic has to receive them. They have to check that all the correct paperwork has been done. If it hasn't then surely it is illegal under their own laws to accept the goods.

If the EU is so worried about their citizens, for example eating meat that is not up to their safety standards, then they can prosecute the importers. No need for the paperwork for goods if NI is their final destination.

Petera

So what word would you have used? If I am showing my political preferences by using English correctly, I obviously need lessons in obfuscation.

''If the EU is so worried about their citizens, for example eating meat that is not up to their safety standards, then they can prosecute the importers. No need for the paperwork for goods if NI is their final destination.''

but this is NOT what the Deal agreed, not the Deal that was negotited and signed- that is the point.

GrannyRose15

vegansrock

grannyrose15 by your logic drug smuggling, people trafficking etc is ok because “it takes two to tango”

You have completely misunderstood my argument. I am not saying smuggling is OK. What I am saying is that in order for the UK to export goods to the Republic of Ireland someone in the Republic has to receive them. They have to check that all the correct paperwork has been done. If it hasn't then surely it is illegal under their own laws to accept the goods.

If the EU is so worried about their citizens, for example eating meat that is not up to their safety standards, then they can prosecute the importers. No need for the paperwork for goods if NI is their final destination.

It's not just about meat. It's about the border itself. It would undermine the GFA to have a hard border between the Republic and NI, which could kickstart the Troubles. So, logically, there needs to be a barrier of some sort between the UK and the Republic - where could it go?

PS. There are nearly 300 border crossings between the Republic and NI, which is more than the whole of the EU with third countries. Any attempt to close any of those crossings would be asking for trouble.