Post office Scandal - public inquiry

MaizieD

What is worrying is that, as Marina Hyde pointed out in her article, there seems to be a growing attitude that the computer cannot be wrong.

But computer programmes have real live people writing them, and installing them, who can be as prone to error as any other person.

Over all, the UK's experience with IT doesn't seem to be a particularly good one.

I have come across this attitude too and I hope the learning from this enquiry does address this point and make some recommendations for when individuals are in conflict with IT -generated data.
I haven't heard that the sub postmasters felt that racism was a factor in their mistreatment.
I hope they get generous compensation too. What a lovely bunch of people they come across as, when you see the interviews on TV.

I agree Grantanow but not sure the Met are the best people for this investigation

It takes a long time because all governments and big companies play for time: some claimants die, others run out of steam and the lawyers make more money. A public Inquiry is fine but I'd like to see Met Police investigation to find out if anyone entered into a conspiracy to pervert the course of justice.

GillT57 yes Private Eye have kept this going for years, my husband has followed it. It's horrendous how lives were devastated by guilty verdicts in court and I feel great sympathy for those innocent people who were advised by their legal representatives to plead guilty to escape harsher punishment. Will their chance of any compensation be annulled by the guilty plea?

MerylStreep

The government department that the post office came under ( when this was discovered) threw £100, 000,000 at the case to fight these poor souls.

Disgraceful. Interestingly, I have just looked on Companies House and 67 of 70 officers are marked as resigned.

The government department that the post office came under ( when this was discovered) threw £100, 000,000 at the case to fight these poor souls.

That's exactly my point Jaylucy, just why on earth nobody thought 'hang on?' , why are all these people, who undergo extensive background and financial checks before they are permitted to be run a sub post office, who have lived and worked and contributed to their communities for decades, why have they all suddenly decided to defraud the post office? And, even then, the CPS have to examine cases before prosecution to ensure there is a reasonable chance of conviction, so why did nobody there wonder just what was going on? There is far, far, more to this and there has obviously, to my mind, been a massive cover up. Even now, nobody from Fujitsu has been interviewed as far as I am aware.

What I do not understand is how and why Royal Mail were apparently totally unable to see that with so many "culprits" that something must be wrong somewhere ?
Nearly 800 people supposedly guilty of fiddling the books - all at the same time ?
People that had had to undergo quite extensive checks on their background before they even got their jobs and businesses granted to them and literally spread all over the country, not to mention possibly others that they couldn't get the charges to stick to ?
Or was it just that some bright spark that actually knew about the problems with the system and decided that rather than putting their hands up and admitting the problem, decided to justify their no doubt over the top salary and just claim it must have been "the others"! Or was it just a stupid way of finally closing down the whole mail system so someone from outside could swoop in from overseas and pick up the whole thing for peanuts ??!!

Feel so sorry for all the wrongly accused people.

Private Eye have been campaigning about this scandal for years, extensive reporting on the cover up, the ruined lives, the secrecy of it all. I am glad that it is finally making main stream media and the news and that it is being discussed. It was a topic on QT last night, and one of the panellists, a previous director of Siemens, I think, said that it was beyond comprehension that nobody noticed the pattern of 'sudden thefts and frauds'. These people in Post Offices are decent, hard working people, and the damage to their reputations and good name is beyond compensation. There must be a trial of the directors of Fujitsu, the government department responsible and as was also said on QT last night, what the hell is going on with the CPS that they didn't think there was something untoward with the massive increase in fraud and theft offences being committed by previously honest, trustworthy people. A massive scandal, and it must not be supressed.

And the original group who sued only got £20k and no right for more compensation though it was due to them this all came out. One MP is trying to get this anomaly fixed.

A statement from one victim:

Sub-postmistress told she was 'only one' with Horizon problems
Mrs Hazzleton told the inquiry she repeatedly rang the Post Office helpline for Horizon issues as shortfalls in her accounts began to "snowball" in 2000 but got little assistance.
Instead, she says, she was told that she was the only person having problems.
Asked by Sky News if she believes there was a cover-up, she said: "Yes I do, because for one reason, and this has become a common thread, as in my case, they said I was the only one who was going through that problem.

That no one else is having issues with their computer.

People have been talking about this for years and how outrageous and unfair it was on innocent sub postmasters. The Royal Mail seemed to just ignore the obvious. It's dreadful what happened to these people.

Absolute shocking, these poor poor people, and still some whose convictions haven't been squashed, unbelievable. All I can do is echo what has been said. Not so sure about racism, but who knows? Suddenly! All those people and it didn't occur to somebody that there could be a glitch in the system??
Someone or people need to go to prison for this astonishing miscarriage of justice.

sodapop

I think people did know Luckygirl and actively covered up the problem. There was dishonesty if not criminal activity from the people at the top.
I feel so sorry for the post office workers and their families, so many people affected and for so long.

I'm sure I heard that the man from the computer company who trained the Post Office staff warned his bosses that there blips in the system but was ignored.

It is just unbelievable that those at the top in the Post Office and the computer company thought there were so many dishonest employees in one organisation in all areas of the country!
The possibility of that happening must be zero.

But still they ignored the problem.
Really, people at the top of both organisations need to be prosecuted.

Like others on here, I feel for those poor people whose lives and reputations were destroyed by this scandal. I too am at a loss to understand why the PO didn't join the dots and realise much earlier that the IT system was faulty.

I am puzzled by the suspicion voiced on here of racism, as it looks as though everyone was prosecuted, no matter their ethnicity or background - unless anyone knows otherwise?

The victims deserve to be fully compensated, though how such a loss could or should be calculated is is bound to be an issue.

Those who have spoken out on TV want to see people responsible at the PO prosecuted, and I don't blame them.

I think people did know Luckygirl and actively covered up the problem. There was dishonesty if not criminal activity from the people at the top.
I feel so sorry for the post office workers and their families, so many people affected and for so long.

Allsorts, for 'the person' I would put MANY persons. It was not only one person who was negligent here. Let's have every last one of them sought out.

Ahem. The civil protests please….

Nobody has officially mentioned racism but it struck me when watching the news reports that it could have been an element. That's all. Racism is endemic in this country. Many of you may not have seen it but, having lived in Brixton during the riots in the 80s I can assure you that it did exist and still does.

I’ve followed this case for years, it’s absolutely scandalous these people were treated, like liars, made to pay money back they hadn’t taken, they lost their good names and employment. No one has been held responsible. No money can make up for all they they lost, but they should be paid for all those lost years. How they never linked a new computer system with tgecshortfall beggars belief. They should get the person responsible and take his assets, then he will know how these people felt.

Esspee

Didn't the person ultimately responsible retire with a huge payoff and a very generous pension. Sorry but for the life of me I can neither remember her name nor the details.

Paula Vennells, Esspee

Not only CEO of the Post Office but an ordained priest!

Smileless

They knew from early on that there was a fault.

www.silicon.co.uk/e-regulation/governance/post-office-horizon-problems-345666

Yes, Dinahmo and it is truly shocking.

I have been in tears seeing some of those poor people on television, some had been imprisoned, lost businesses and others had died/committed suicide.
Lives ruined, their families in despair.

The people running the Post Office in our town disappeared amid mutterings of wrongdoing - I don't know what happened to them but I reckon they must have been victims of this too.

As DH said - why on earth did no-one realise there were anomalies, why did no-one think it was odd that all these people were supposedly committing fraud, especially after a new computer system was installed?

No amount of compensation will make up for the distress caused to their lives.

Didn't the person ultimately responsible retire with a huge payoff and a very generous pension. Sorry but for the life of me I can neither remember her name nor the details.