Johnson, Putin, Lebedev, chemical weapons have already been used.

maddyone

M0nica

That Putin has been using chemical weapons at a personel level and killing opponents has been well known for ages. Not just Skripol. Before that there was Litvinenko and whatever politicians say, there was a general acceptance that Russian security would be interfering in our elections, or trying to.

This article is well drawn together and explained, but there is nothing in it that was not already well known.

I agree Monica.

To my shame perhaps I didn’t know. Scary to read at 3 a.m.

MayBee70

And the company that fitted all the electrical things in the No 10 briefing room is based in Moscow.

Why on Earth would you have a Russian company!!

Carol Cadwalldre

“Just stumbled across this. I posted a couple of videos of Lord Lebedev on the day he was sworn in.

And look who stepped in to defend the appointment? Russia’s Ministry of Affairs.

‘We obviously need more Russians in Western parliaments’

I read that amongst others Australia has sanctioned Lebedev.

Should Johnson be investigated for National Security reasons?

I assume partygate investigations are on -going?

It makes me smile (and not in an amused way) when I hear people go on about how the Russian people don’t know the truth of what is going on.

Whitewavemark2

MayBee70

And the company that fitted all the electrical things in the No 10 briefing room is based in Moscow.

Why on Earth would you have a Russian company!!

The answer to that question might open a real can of worms WWM.

Doodledog

It makes me smile (and not in an amused way) when I hear people go on about how the Russian people don’t know the truth of what is going on.

Are you suggesting they do?

It is a very real threat to us. A vacuum bomb has already been used. Putin is insane and determined to win this even if his country sinks in the process. His citizen will be not allowed to get out soon as there is an exodus of Russians fleeing, and
, those that get out tell of a regime they have experienced over fifteen years as controlling and invasive and that they always knew he was a violently insane leader, but stayed because if the beautiful city, their families and friends.
As for China, look how they treat their own people, what they are doing in Hong Kong, can you really trust them?
These two big powers don’t believe in Human Rights.

DaisyAnne

Doodledog

It makes me smile (and not in an amused way) when I hear people go on about how the Russian people don’t know the truth of what is going on.

Are you suggesting they do?

Carol has had a whole slew of rightwingers rubbishing her and her disclosures ever since she first reported the results of her investigations. Pursued by the likes of Aaron Banks, Andrew Neil & Guido Fawkes (Paul Staines, an abhorrent character also in the pay of Russia). The Daily Telegraph was paid by Russia to publish pro Russian stories. The Independent and the Evening Standard are owned by the son of KGB agent. Brexit voters one and all have been particularly happy to cover their ears and eyes at the barest hint of Russian interference in their precious 'victory'.

Are we really surprised that few people were aware of what was going on?

DaisyAnne I took Doodledogs comments to mean that we in the UK don't know half of what is going on while happy to comment that the Russians are in that position.

I agree Grandmabatty.

Thank you for starting this thread GillT57

Grandmabatty

DaisyAnne I took Doodledogs comments to mean that we in the UK don't know half of what is going on while happy to comment that the Russians are in that position.

So did I.

I'd also suggest that people don't want to know what's going on...

Are there any responses from our tory and/or Brexit voters on this thread? What do they think of their Boris being, at the very best, a Russian stooge?

Inappropriate analogy, but here we go anyway:

If a government had spent decades telling you that other countries were out to get you, that they didn't value you and that they just wanted to get something over on you. If they told you the association of other countries were the enemy and you were the good guys. If they told you that everyone was out to get you.

Would you be in Russia or would you be in Brexit Britain?

MaizieD
You could turn that round.
Maybe, just maybe Mi5/6 are treating Boris like a mushroom:
Keeping him in the dark and feeding him bullshit ?
He’s a handy fool to have in your arsenal.

Grandmabatty

DaisyAnne I took Doodledogs comments to mean that we in the UK don't know half of what is going on while happy to comment that the Russians are in that position.

That's how I read it as well Grandmabatty and I shudder to think what else has been going on that we don't know about.

bookwormbabe

Grandmabatty

DaisyAnne I took Doodledogs comments to mean that we in the UK don't know half of what is going on while happy to comment that the Russians are in that position.

That's how I read it as well Grandmabatty and I shudder to think what else has been going on that we don't know about.

We never know about all the planned terrorist attacks that are detected before they have a chance to destroy lives. We are not told about the attempted cyber crime until after it has been thwarted. We only know immediately with both of these when they get through the net

Why do you think that everything to do with national security should be out in the open for debate, if it becomes public knowledge then our enemies will know also.

There are reasons that MI5 and MI6 have not been disbanded

Grandmabatty

DaisyAnne I took Doodledogs comments to mean that we in the UK don't know half of what is going on while happy to comment that the Russians are in that position.

Thanks, Grandmabatty. That is what I meant.

Why do you think that everything to do with national security should be out in the open for debate . . .

If that was to me, the answer is that I don't, and I didn't suggest otherwise.

Doodledog

*Why do you think that everything to do with national security should be out in the open for debate . . .*

If that was to me, the answer is that I don't, and I didn't suggest otherwise.

No it wasn’t aimed at you Doodledog , it was in response to bookwormbabe

But we're not talking about M15 &M16 in this thread. We are talking about Russian interference and influence in our political and daily life. This is not cloak and dagger intelligence stuff; this is stuff that had been in the public domain for a number of years now and has been marginalised or rubbished.

So, let's try again.

What do our tory/Brexit voters make of it all and are they happy that their Boris is, at the best, a Russian stooge?

MaizieD

But we're not talking about M15 &M16 in this thread. We are talking about Russian interference and influence in our political and daily life. This is not cloak and dagger intelligence stuff; this is stuff that had been in the public domain for a number of years now and has been marginalised or rubbished.

So, let's try again.

What do our tory/Brexit voters make of it all and are they happy that their Boris is, at the best, a Russian stooge?

MaizieD Mr.Johnson was not my choice for leader of the Conservative Party then or now.

I can only assume that there is far more to this than is being alleged

I am sorry but I stand by my comments that we do not know all that goes on within governments.

I wonder if there are any Tory voters who actually now regret their vote.

How can anyone reading these facts be other than flabbergasted at what they are reading?

Are there any historians amongst us who could point to anything similar in U.K. political history.

A prime minister

Fronted a referendum that has been since found based on fraud.
The security services saw him as a risk as Foreign minister
Is under caution by the police
Associated with cronyism and corruption
Everything that we have been discussing on this thread.

Whitewavemark2

I wonder if there are any Tory voters who actually now regret their vote.

How can anyone reading these facts be other than flabbergasted at what they are reading?

I do not regret voting for my Conservative constituency MP.

I do not think that this is a good time to be having a leadership election in the U.K., but it should be high up on the agenda, if not first once the Russian/Ukrainian situation has come to an end.

A negotiated peace, sooner than later hopefully.