Kate & Will's Caribbean Trip

Yes they can be voted out, may not beat Thatchers record
11 years and we will have the ‘he/she lied’ as we do after every
general election

And we should remember, the "host" country didn't invite them. They invited themselves. Like Elizabeth I making a progress.

Is that an established fact, volver? Have you a reference?

The 'host' country could have said no'. It didn't have to put on displays or lavish entertainments. We don't have any particular hold on them after all, we couldn't threaten to withdraw funding or throw the government in prison...

I do like to think that these places have some agency of their own, that they're not just imposed upon.. I think it's a bit disrespectful of them to think otherwise.

I wonder, an ageing monarch always seems to bring out the worst in everybody, when Elizabeth 1 was dying everyone who was anyone was rushing off to toady up to James1, then when Queen Victoria was on the way out it was all going to be a disaster but Edward V11 salvaged/ worked wonders with anglo french relations in the nicest possible way! Times are very strange and I am not sure its all over yet.
I guess this tour has been long in the devising and unfortunately times have changed drastically in the meantime.

The media didn’t bother to report other parts of William’s
speech.

Oopsadaisy1

I don’t think Charles will refuse, it would seem that he can’t wait and I don’t think William would either, maybe the youngsters might.
But it’s a life of extreme privilege why would they willingly give it up? and I can’t see any British PM wanting to go down in History for abolishing the Monarchy.

They wouldn’t be giving up a life of wealth if they weren’t the RF. The Royals are extremely wealthy and could live their lives in luxurious anonymity if we didn’t have a monarchy. As it is, these riches come with a huge encumbrance of never ending public duty and scrutiny. I know which I’d prefer.

If we keep the monarchy, it needs to be slimmed right down. Charles and C, William, Kate and children . It’s understandable why Harry and family don’t want to be part of it but IMO a pity. The family needs to move into the 21st century. It feels stuck somewhere in the 50’s, just so dated, doesn’t reflect Britain now.
I’m not criticising W and K, don’t think they put a foot wrong but, they’ve been badly advised. Maybe they could be a bit more assertive and tuned Into the country as it is now

But it’s a life of extreme privilege why would they willingly give it up?

They're not the only family who live a life of extreme privilege. All very wealthy people do. At least most wealthy people have to perform what must often be very tedious 'royal duties'. Let's have a pop at them, too for being leeches on society...

Charles cannot be expected to make big changes as his mother
edges to the end of her life. He did make some cuts, protection
was stopped for all except for working family members,

How can four do the charity work of 7 ? scrap the Duke of
Edinburgh awards even though so many young people still take
part. Sophie’s charities, Anne is involved with many charities,
when Diana dumped her charities they did suffer loss of money.

You don’t think the RF actually run the DofE award ?

Not the family

MaizieD

^And we should remember, the "host" country didn't invite them. They invited themselves. Like Elizabeth I making a progress.^

Is that an established fact, volver? Have you a reference?

The 'host' country could have said no'. It didn't have to put on displays or lavish entertainments. We don't have any particular hold on them after all, we couldn't threaten to withdraw funding or throw the government in prison...

I do like to think that these places have some agency of their own, that they're not just imposed upon.. I think it's a bit disrespectful of them to think otherwise.

TBH MaizieD I don't have a reference, but I think I have read that the royals decide where to visit in their vast array of kingdoms. I could be wrong.

We don't have a hold on them but can you imagine the press coverage if W&K had to stay in a Premier Inn and have their dinner in Wetherspoons? ?.

When W & C visited countries down under with the baby, grumpy Aussies were not impressed to learn they were paying a large amount towards the cost of the tour. It was all over the news.

volver

MaizieD

And we should remember, the "host" country didn't invite them. They invited themselves. Like Elizabeth I making a progress.

Is that an established fact, volver? Have you a reference?

The 'host' country could have said no'. It didn't have to put on displays or lavish entertainments. We don't have any particular hold on them after all, we couldn't threaten to withdraw funding or throw the government in prison...

I do like to think that these places have some agency of their own, that they're not just imposed upon.. I think it's a bit disrespectful of them to think otherwise.

TBH MaizieD I don't have a reference, but I think I have read that the royals decide where to visit in their vast array of kingdoms. I could be wrong.

We don't have a hold on them but can you imagine the press coverage if W&K had to stay in a Premier Inn and have their dinner in Wetherspoons? ?.

For a start, Belize is independent, so not one of the 'vast array of kingdoms'. It would surprise me if an independent country could have a royal visit imposed on it...

Putting them up in a Premier Inn and feeding them at Wetherspoons would really take the wind out of the sails of the complainers, wouldn't it ? I wonder if it would bother W & K...

There would be nothing to stop Charles or William or Kate standing for presidency if that’s the role they actually wanted. Then they could get voted in. You could have as much pageantry as you wanted- France manages lots of it.

For a start, Belize is independent, so not one of the 'vast array of kingdoms'.

Belize has Queen Elizabeth as Head of State right now, whether it's independent or not. Just like Australia or New Zealand. See Vanessa59's post above.

So, Belize is one of her vast array of kingdoms...

Vanessa59

When W & C visited countries down under with the baby, grumpy Aussies were not impressed to learn they were paying a large amount towards the cost of the tour. It was all over the news.

..and apart from some security costs the Jamaicans have refused to pay

"Robert Morgan, Jamaica’s Minister without portfolio in the Office of the Prime Minister, revealed that the country will not be “paying for the visit”."

Not inconvertible evidence they were not invited but this wouldn't be the behaviour of any Jamaicans I know if they invited me.

I see Reuters is questioning the Cambridges trip.

I bet there will be a complete re-think after this and if trips abroad are made they will take a very different character.

The colonial Britain look is not good and so outdated.

Decisions about trips abroad, are decided by both the palace and the government.

Why don't Royals pay for their tours

The committee wrote: “We, the members of the Bahamas National Reparations Committee (BNRC), recognize that the people of The Bahamas have been left holding the bag for much of the cost of this extravagant trip.

“Why are we footing the bill for the benefit of a regime whose rise to ‘greatness’ was fueled by the extinction, enslavement, colonization, and degradation of the people of this land? Why are we being made to pay again?

Belize has just announced a review of its constitution and signalled a move to a republic. Two days after a visit from William and Kate.

the solomon islands got self-governance in 1978. It now appears that china is in process of getting their feet under the table. They are in process of obtaining a security deal. Money talks

Whoops; apologies, volver. I got 'independent' and 'republic' mixed up.

I still think that there is something odd about the fuss being made about this visit. There are people in all these countries who went along with it, planned the itineraries, organised receptions, etc. etc. They didn't have to do it. It feels as though this was set up to fail.

I think that what this visit shows is that many in the U.K. and particularly the ruling classes are still stuck in the past.

It is indicative of the attitude that has brought about the type of behaviour we continue to hear and see from dyed in the wool traditionalists, who talk and act as if we continue to wield power.

Bizarrely I think that all the time we were members of the EU, this power of a strong economic block, where the U.K. has a large level of influence ensured this power spoke to the world. Traditionalists mistook this power and seemed to assume that we would take it with us when we left the EU.

However it is clear and has been shown this week that the U.K., no longer has the power it once wielded. This is a lesson many in the U.K. have not learned.

The world has changed. If we just go back, say the past 5 years only, an example would be the black movement has taught our society a salutary lesson, that has been accepted and lived by most, but rejected and repelled by others. These others are those who live in the past, who are fighting a losing battle and failing to understand that the changes we have experienced matter and we therefore need to move with the times. The two people we sent out to represent the U.K. were informed of this in no uncertain terms, by the ancestors of those who lost their freedom, toiled, and died, made the representatives of the class who gained vast wealth on the backs of their ancestors, exactly why they should now make a clean and complete break from this historic and outdated relationship.

Very true Whitewave. Sadly, our uk government these past 12 years reflects those outdated ruling class ideas. The Leave campaign reflected this Britain Rules the waves view

Iam64

Very true Whitewave. Sadly, our uk government these past 12 years reflects those outdated ruling class ideas. The Leave campaign reflected this Britain Rules the waves view

I look to countries like Portugal and the Netherlands with some envy. Countries which one had huge colonial interests but have come to terms with their place in today's world.

I can’t help feeling rather sorry for William and Catherine. The trip itinerary would have been planned by advisors and civil servants, with some input from the countries visited. William and Catherine had little choice but to do as they were told. I agree that the tour looks very 1950s and outdated. Perhaps these tours should be dropped because I don’t know what use they are. The countries involved should have refused the tour if they didn’t want it.
The days for a republic in Britain have now arrived in my opinion. The monarchy is past its sell by date and needs to go in my opinion. I understand others may think differently.

MaizieD

Jamaica is not a 'small Caribbean island', it's one of the bigger ones. It is poor, though.

Surely the islands' governments were consulted about the visits? They could have said 'no', couldn't they?

I've been looking at The Gleaner. Lots of breathless reporting of Kate's wardrobe, along with reporting of the protests. I suspect that actual opinion on the island is pretty evenly split.

Jamaica has been discussing full independence for at least a decade. It's not exactly shock news.

Jamaica has been discussing full independence for at least a decade. It's not exactly shock news.

It's not sudden news - why don't they just get on with it?
It's not as if the RF is preventing them from doing it.

In fact, I do wonder if William and Catherine might be mightily relieved if we in the UK had a referendum and decided to become a republic, especially for the sake of their children.
If not, I think they'll do the best job possible and what is expected of them.

Someone mentioned the fence between the Royals and the poor Jamaican children - photos can tell a story and can also lie!
It was at a football match and Marcus Rashford was with William and Catherine too, shaking hands with the excited children through the fence round the football pitch.