Death spiral of the Tory Party

DaisyAnne

There is no point in this Callistemon.

Oh, there is. The point is you made an offensive post and accused me - on n open forum - of something of which I am not guilty.

I said:
We can't expect perfection (none of us are) but if only we could have a party of Decency, Morals and Courage picked from all the best politicians regardless of political bias

And you accuse me of fascism!

I think you owe me an apology.

MerylStreep

Callistemon
I’m sure your imagining things ?

It gets worse, MerylStreep

It would be laughable if it wasn't so vile and untrue.
Truly sickening that someone who wants safer streets and better sentencing laws for violent criminals is called an extremist.

Are the the women protesting to reclaim the streets considered extremists because they want to reclaim the streets and to feel safe?

I despair.

I haven't used the word Callistemon. The person who has used it the most on this thread is you (I checked).

It was also used in answer to comment about the regime you would like when you said I really don't know who are the best people to deliver that., but not by me and it referred to "the best people to deliver that" not you.

I have not said it.

And this is still a pointless conversation.

The problem of the Tories was created by Johnson who appointed Brexiteers to the Cabinet instead of competent people and threw out some very intelligent MPs. Corbyn similarly messed up the Labour front bench. Don't waste time on the Lib Dems who ratted on their voters by going into coalition. All the rest including the Pixie's Party are also rans. It will take decades to create a better quality political class.

Disingenuous DaisyAnne

Your meaning was clear.
Untrue but clear.

I wouldn’t hold your breathe Calli. You are definitely owed one but none so blind etc etc.

Grantanow

The problem of the Tories was created by Johnson who appointed Brexiteers to the Cabinet instead of competent people and threw out some very intelligent MPs. Corbyn similarly messed up the Labour front bench. Don't waste time on the Lib Dems who ratted on their voters by going into coalition. All the rest including the Pixie's Party are also rans. It will take decades to create a better quality political class.

Yes, it's very depressing.

There are decent politicians in all parties but decent doesn't seem to get them elected.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Are you for real, DaisyAnne?

Callistemon is one of the most pleasant posters on GN.

varian

Nightsky2

varian

In spite of the overwhelming evidence of incompetence and corruption, the Tory party will not die as long as people still read The Daily Mail, The Express, The Telegraph and The Sun and vote as instructed.

We can all see the evidence on Gransnet.

Varian….The Telegraph and the Sun…now that is offensive. I expect someone as clever as you only read the Guardian. I’ve flicked through it on the paper stand a couple of times but have never been tempted to buy it.

Does it have good cartoons like the Matt cartoons in the Telegraph.

The point is that, The Sun, The Telegraph, The Daily Mail and The Daily Express are Al supporters if the Tory party as are most of their loyal readers.

At the time of the fraudulent referendum of 2016 newspaper readership was found to be the strongest determinant of voting patterns.

No, I am not a regular reader of The Guardian, although J sometimes look at Guardian online and MailOnline.

I prefer to get mu news from a variety of sources.

I recommend that you do the same.

Another offensive comment.

If you're are against this, you must be happy that someone who tortures and murders their child or laughs while a partner does so, or abducts, rapes and murders a woman from the streets should only get a relatively lenient sentence, halved for "good behaviour" then? [Source; Callistemon]

... it is extremely strange not to want a better society where women and children can walk the streets without fear. [Source: Callistemon]

I take it you do not want longer sentences for rapists and murderers then?
You're happy for women and children to be fearful to walk the streets? [Source: Callistemon]

These quotes were all from Callistemon's posts. It appears that, in a belief that only her way is the right and moral way, those who disagree are to be compared to the criminals and told they think the way the criminals do.

This is not a reasoned argument. I am happy to discuss the myth of stronger sentences, etc., but this is an extreme attempt to stop people from putting forward a different view.

In the news it seems the Tory party can breathe a sigh of relief as their problems are pushed off the front pages by the French election.

I understand why Sunak has referred the Tory Party's current challenge to the PM's Independent (?) Advisor. He wants to be proved right because he believes he has done nothing wrong. He hasn't from a legal point of view but he still seems to be being tin-eared when it comes to politics.

I’m not sure that he hasn’t done anything wrong tbh.

Not declaring a vested interest seems pretty dodgy to me.

Ah. I thought it was agreed that what he had done was legal. I can imagine that matters very much to him. He will see himself as one of the good guys because he obeys the rules. The fact that he and his government make those rules, and that they favour those who can make money other than by working, seems to pass him by.

Yes I’m not sure tbh. Ought to read a bit more about it really.

I was thinking [Ballad of Reading Gaol style] that he is more likely to be politically hanged for a fool than a knave. Then I thought of all those at the poorest end of society and how much harder he has made their lives so possibly both when it comes to it.

From the Telegraph.

So it must be true.

Chancellor may not stand at next election if he loses job as friends say he is more inclined towards life in California than on back benches.

A young man meets a young woman, they get on well, she happens to be very rich, he happens to want a career in politics.
He is excited by the new Tory idea of spend big, level up, increase opportunity.
Bang. Pandemic. All priorities have to change, work hard and juggle to furlough and keep people safe. Find funds for nightingale hospitals just in case, find funds for immediate vaccine research, find funds to increase universal credit during the pandemic crisis. Doing all you can, becoming a popular choice for future PM.
Then the press decide you’re too popular and decide to dig around, make something of your wife’s wealth and status, then they find the green card issue and can’t wait to bring you down. If I was this man I’d be hankering after a life in California too.

There is also the little matter of his political naivety, and economic blindness, which is what the senior Tories are concerned about. Johnson of course just sees him as a threat to his role as PM.

Doing all you can

Sunak voted -
23 times for a reduction in spending on welfare benefits
8 times against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
8 times against higher taxes on banks

Coastpath

*Doing all you can*

Sunak voted -
23 times for a reduction in spending on welfare benefits
8 times against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
8 times against higher taxes on banks

?

He is excited by the new Tory idea of spend big, level up, increase opportunity.

Who are you talking about, LauraNorder? No tory I've ever been governed by has ever done that. The current front bench is stuffed with tories who want to spend as little money as possible on public services, they've even written books about it or are devotees of people who have written books about it.

Sunak had to create a load of money to put into the economy during lock down otherwise the whole economy would have failed. He is now punishing the country for it by increasing taxes and refusing to do anything to mitigate astronomically rising fuel prices (because a forced loan of £200 doesn't go anywhere near compensating) despite the fact that we din't 'borrow' the money from anyone and we don't 'owe' it to anyone. He just can't bear the thought of voters expecting the state to look out for them...

Nightingale hospitals were a complete waste of money because there wasn't anyone to staff them. Because the last decade of tory rule has been stripping the NHS of staff by low pay, no strategy for training to replace natural wastage of staff (e.g retirement, long term illness etc) and the stupidity of Brexit which prompted many EU staff to return to Europe.

I'd be delighted to hear some examples of how this largesse contributed to 'levelling up' because it's my impression that much of it went to make a few people (mostly tory friends and donors) very rich, or was fraudulently claimed with no effort to make proper checks on the claimants and now no effort being made to get back the fraudulently claimed money.

Oh god. Universal credit! Grabbed back as soon as possible and absolutely no intention of an uplift now that people are absolutely struggling to cope..

Oh, and how about Eat out To Help Out and spread the C19 virus around?

Such a shame that people are criticising him for hypocrisy and possible illegalities..

The sooner he jets off to California the better.

And he can take the whole tory cabinet with him.

ALASTAIR CAMPBELL

Text from one of my few Tory MP friends …. ‘An Englishman, an Indian and an American walk into a bar … “usual, Mr Sunak?” says the barman.’

HA! Brilliant.