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Why is Johnson more popular than Starmer?

(331 Posts)
Glorianny Fri 20-May-22 12:02:34

It's a simple question and you could answer it purely on political lines but I think there is more to it than that. I think somehow Johnson appeals to those who like bad boys and the slight amorality which is present in so many lives now, whereas Starmer always comes across as the typical lawyer, and no one trusts a lawyer. Any other ideas?

Lupin Wed 25-May-22 19:10:48

I cannot stand Boris and would never vote him in. I say this as a person who is not loyal to any particular political party, but someone who will vote for whoever I think will do best for their country, It is often very hard to choose. I would not vote for Boris because he is disloyal and dishonest in his personal and political life. I simply do not trust him. Sir Kier Starmer does not come across like that.
However, perhaps Boris carefully plays to the gallery and is good at courting popularity. He knows how to brush off negative publicity and perhaps his fallibility is part of the appeal.

Sawsage2 Wed 25-May-22 19:09:50

OakDryad...... I wondered what the hell 'cognitive dissonance' meant so I Googled it - got the exact same answer as you did.

varian Wed 25-May-22 19:06:34

Of course they don't care about you growstuff

You're obviously not a tax dodging billionaire Tory donor. Why should they care about you?

growstuff Wed 25-May-22 19:05:52

I'm fairly sure that Starmer does think women exist. Johnson, on the other hand, seems to think they're disposable playthings.

growstuff Wed 25-May-22 19:03:49

ajswan

Galaxy

He isn't.
Also Johnson isnt a bad boy he is a very damaged man.

Oh are you a qualified medical practitioner, what an insulting ridiculous thing to say. I bet you benefited from all the good things he did. Have you had all your jabs and if you were a worker or had a small business did you benefit from the furlough scheme etc, I bet you know someone who did

I've had my three jabs because NHS workers and volunteers worked their socks off and (after a few hiccoughs) local people organised the roll out well.

No, I didn't benefit from furlough. I was one of the three million self-employed who weren't eligible for anything - not a single penny! Sunak and Johnson knew because there was lobbying and a petition presented to Downing Street, but they didn't care.

volver Wed 25-May-22 18:35:01

There you go Galaxy. How ungrateful of you. ?

Stephania1954 Wed 25-May-22 18:33:33

I have always liked Boris going back to his London Mayor days and the Olympics. I know it doesn’t mean anything in politics but he’s fun and charismatic.
Starmer always appears to me to be a sulky character, having no ideas of his own. He may be very intelligent but someone with a knighthood should they lead the Labour Party. I think the Labour Party has missed out recently on potential good leaders firstly David Milliband and secondly Andy Burnham.
I will never vote Labour I am female, a woman and mother. Apparently I don’t exist according to Starmer
I think the coalition with Conservatives and Liberals Cameron and Clegg. Cameron really was quite thick but Clegg had the brains

ajswan Wed 25-May-22 18:13:08

Galaxy

He isn't.
Also Johnson isnt a bad boy he is a very damaged man.

Oh are you a qualified medical practitioner, what an insulting ridiculous thing to say. I bet you benefited from all the good things he did. Have you had all your jabs and if you were a worker or had a small business did you benefit from the furlough scheme etc, I bet you know someone who did

Dinahmo Wed 25-May-22 18:07:12

Grandmakath

Johnson has got things done, whereas Starmer just whines and whinges constantly about the tories rather than tell us what he could get done.

How can KS tell us what he would do?

Do you mean now? He's not in a position to do anything.

Do you mean in future? How can he tell us anything, apart from what he would like to see happen? If he put forward specific plans he would be jumped on by the right wing press for not fully costing his plans. Which right now he can't do because he doesn't have a crystal ball to see the future finances of the country.

growstuff Wed 25-May-22 17:56:32

Lilyflower Goebbels was a brilliant writer of propaganda and Hitler was a spellbinding orator.

MayBee70 Wed 25-May-22 17:53:55

….and the books he’s written are supposed to be rubbish….

MayBee70 Wed 25-May-22 17:53:04

‘His bon mots are memorable and are characterised by an ability to create original and contemporary metaphors and similes and, of course, his classical training is evident in his use of rhetorical devices where he unites the demotic and the elevated to pithy and amusing effect’…..
..that’s obviously why I don’t get his popularity because I’m afraid that is gobbledegook to me. And he certainly can’t translate that verbally because all I hear is ooh’s aah’s Peppa Pig, Kermit the Frog with a bit of Latin thrown in to sound good….

DaisyAnne Wed 25-May-22 17:52:13

growstuff

sandelf

It's not really about 'popular' is it? Really which do you find less distasteful. BJ is no more a 'Tory' than Theresa was - they chose the party with the best chance. ATM labour is still unelectable stained by Corbyn. Starmer knows he'll never be PM - his is Kinnocks role - if he can manage it. Doubt it. He was not a good DPP. BJ will go when the pack have found another leader.

Why wasn't Starmer a good DPP?

I'd like to know the answer too. Is this a repeat of the previously shown to be fake news?

volver Wed 25-May-22 17:49:00

I realise these observations will infuriate many who focus on his actions as a man and as PM but they cannot be gainsaid and most people will not have read anything he's actually written.

I started his book about Churchill.

I gave up when I discovered he thought it was all about him.

varian Wed 25-May-22 17:44:29

There have been many good speech-makers and wordsmiths who became tyrannical political leaders.

Lilyflower Wed 25-May-22 17:38:22

I wouldn't comment on his character as a person or his performance as the PM but I have been reading his journalism and other writing for years and he is a brilliant writer. I taught English language and style at A level for many years and am well able to analyse literary style.

Boris is clever, witty and well informed and he has a grasp of the language and of how to write in a clear and entertaining manner, such as few others possess. This sometimes comes out in his off the cuff remarks albeit disguised by his blustering and stuttering delivery. His speeches are well crafted and he, unlike most leaders, writes his own material.

His bon mots are memorable and are characterised by an ability to create original and contemporary metaphors and similes and, of course, his classical training is evident in his use of rhetorical devices where he unites the demotic and the elevated to pithy and amusing effect.

I realise these observations will infuriate many who focus on his actions as a man and as PM but they cannot be gainsaid and most people will not have read anything he's actually written.

Boris Johnson used to make £800,000 a year by his writing and now has to 'manage' on £160,00 as Prime Minister.

I would suggest that many people respond to those who can wield language effectively without realising how they are being beguiled. I have no doubt that Boris' language skills are a large part of his popularity and other politicians who possessed a linguistic gift also succeeded in politics: Churchill, Blair, Kinnock to name a few. Starmer, in comparison, speaks and writes like a lawyer and is nowhere near as engaging.

As I say, I refer not to the man but the writer.

Mollygo Wed 25-May-22 17:34:33

Is it that BJ is more popular or just that KS appears lacklustre? I wish KS would come out more forcefully and say what he will
do (not what he would have done (hindsight) or what BJ has done wrongly / not done ( list is too long) or what he won’t be able to do (because of what the current government have done).
With the state of things at the moment it’s an ideal opportunity for a dynamic replacement to make a difference and explain how that’s going to happen.

Jzpap Wed 25-May-22 17:30:34

Growstuff
You’re right. I didn’t word my comment very well. He actually has the personality for PM it’s just the public don’t perceive his personality as PM material.
John Major was very underrated and seems almost forgotten about.

MaizieD Wed 25-May-22 17:29:27

What do you think Johnson has at the moment, GrannySquare? Is it not 'state power'?

Lucca Wed 25-May-22 17:24:36

Secretsquirrel1

If I were having a dinner party and could have either BJ or KS, I’d definitely invite Boris. Say what you will about his politics but he’s got so much charisma and I bet he’d be hilarious.

Absolutely cannot believe this.

Also. Cant believe so many people seem to think if someone is “dull” or they “don’t like him “ that is all that matters.

varian Wed 25-May-22 17:21:39

"Boris Johnson held goodbye drinks in Number 10, while families couldn't even say goodbye to their loved ones. For him to now claim it was "his duty" to attend these rule-breaking parties is a sickening new low."

LibDem leader Sir Ed Davety

twitter.com/EdwardJDavey/status/1529481198023606272?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Lucca Wed 25-May-22 17:18:32

Neilspurgeon0

Colourful populists are always ‘in demand’ and charisma is very hard to actually define, but we all know it, if it chimes with ‘our’ ideas, when we see it. Being a clown on the telly alongside Merton and Hiscock certainly didn’t harm Boris’ popularity.

Starmer on the other hand is everyone’s idea of ‘straight laced’ Jim, the perfect gent but no fun

Disagree . I thought he was a buffoon on HIGNY. I have not changed that opinion, only added “hypocritical dishonest and uncaring “ .

GrannySquare Wed 25-May-22 17:11:23

‘ Starmer is not colourless, charismatic or boring when seen in real life.’

In my experience he is.
I have been in a small audience where he was a key speaker, & I found him a poor dull speaker before I knew who he was.

My own ‘an empty taxi & Starmer got out’ moment

GrannySquare Wed 25-May-22 17:04:24

This stands out to me, a comment by Zarah Sultana MP.

‘ “I am a firm believer that to address the crises we face, we need to win state power. ’

Note that not win an election to have a majority Government & govern through Parliament, it is to have state power. Not to lead the country through democracy for the people by the people, through consensus & sound legislation. State power.

Maybe her words were not well chosen or badly reported, but this approach does not give me confidence in voting for the Labour Party (aka ‘vehicle of socialists’).

Whilst this Government has a 70-odd seat majority, a fixed term Parliament, no obvious successor to the PM - there is no immediate thrust to get Boris out. He’s too useful to too many people.

The Labour Party is barely credible as the Opposition & nowhere near ready to lead a Government.

This is why Boris keeps on going, there is not much alternative.

growstuff Wed 25-May-22 16:45:27

volver

MaizieD

Why wasn't Starmer a good DPP?

Oooooh, careful, growstuff.

I bet I can predict what the answer to your question will be (if it is answered...)

And we know what happened last time... wink

I didn't want to predict the answer by asking a leading question and/or saying that a certain name doesn't count. grin

I'm interested in justification for the opinion. Maybe there's something I don't know about Starmer which I should.