Proportional Representation

www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jun/25/andy-burnham-says-labour-must-seize-moment-and-back-proportional-representation

Andy Burnham says Labour must ‘seize moment’ and back proportional representation

ed more argumentative.

I admit that I didn't know that so many other countries had PR.
Maybe they're morwPargumentative in Israel.
An example here of PR being unfair was the last GE when Farage's party should have had many more seatwith PR. And one of the Scottish parties. So then the Tory's number would be well down. Not that I support Farage.
I've given the link for this a few times but have lost it now.

Fennel

In principle PR seems to be the fairer electoral system. But in practice there are disadvantages.
eg Israel, which has PR. The current govt. coalition has had to resign as it can't get a sufficient majority to pass laws.
The 5th election in 3 years.

Some of the most stable and successful societies in the world, such as Denmark, Finland, Norway and Sweden, use PR so that seats match votes. So why can’t we?

Why do you believe we could only do it badly?

Gin

I expect there are many like me for whom it is quite pointless voting as my constituency as been through and through blue since time began. At least with pr I would feel I had some input.

Mine is the same. The Tories have a stranglehold here, with some very underhand goings-on to keep them in place.

However, I do still vote. Not least because people use the numbers of actual votes to show just how unacceptable FPTP is.

I don't yet know if it will be the Greens or the LDs who will have the best chance of getting the Tory out next time. We are moving into a newly formed constituency but I imagine it will be just as blue as our previous one. Someone with more knowledge than I have in these areas will no doubt work it out and I am happy to vote for either.

Whitewavemark2

I’m going to write to my MP

I recently wrote to my MP about a completely unrelated matter. She sent back a template, but unfortunately forgot to delete one sentence which didn't apply and one of the names was wrong.

I don't think I'll bother writing!

I'm all for it

Urmstongran

Not for me. Everyone ends up with a government they don’t want - the idea being that groups talk nicely to one another/persuade each other with cogent arguments/thrash out disagreements and come to a workable solution. The reality is there is constant bickering/jockeying for position/behind the scenes horse trading and little f importance gets done. ‘You scratch my back and I’ll scratch yours’. Politics is a dirty business. They’d all start out as chums but before long the deep splits would surface.

Germany hasn't done too badly since the end of WW2. Maybe the UK should look at what Germany has got right.

Gin

I expect there are many like me for whom it is quite pointless voting as my constituency as been through and through blue since time began. At least with pr I would feel I had some input.

Same here Gin. The current system makes a mockery of democracy.

I expect there are many like me for whom it is quite pointless voting as my constituency as been through and through blue since time began. At least with pr I would feel I had some input.

I’m always out of step on these threads! ?

There could be a chant. Instead of "We want our country back" it could be "I want my vote to count". At least this time it would mean something.

Currently, out of an electorate of tens of millions it comes down to about 300,000 to decide who forms the government. That is not making our vote count.

The phrase "elective dictatorship" (also called executive dominance in political science) describes the state in which a typical Westminster system state's parliament is dominated by the government of the day. It refers to the fact that the legislative programme of Parliament is determined by the government, and government bills virtually always pass the legislature because of the nature of the majoritarian first-past-the-post electoral system, which almost always produces strong government, in combination with the imposition of party discipline on the governing party's majority, which almost always ensures loyalty.

The phrase was popularised by the former Lord Chancellor of the United Kingdom, Lord Hailsham, in a Richard Dimbleby Lecture at the BBC in 1976.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elective_dictatorship

An elected dictatorship. Hmm. I think there’s the consideration of a manifesto to be taken into account too.

Missed out the ??????

Better stick to FPTP and be governed by a elected dictatorship, voted in by a minority, just like Belarus.

Not for me. Everyone ends up with a government they don’t want - the idea being that groups talk nicely to one another/persuade each other with cogent arguments/thrash out disagreements and come to a workable solution. The reality is there is constant bickering/jockeying for position/behind the scenes horse trading and little f importance gets done. ‘You scratch my back and I’ll scratch yours’. Politics is a dirty business. They’d all start out as chums but before long the deep splits would surface.

All but two European countries elect their governments by PR.

The only exceptions are the UK and Belarus.

In principle PR seems to be the fairer electoral system. But in practice there are disadvantages.
eg Israel, which has PR. The current govt. coalition has had to resign as it can't get a sufficient majority to pass laws.
The 5th election in 3 years.

It would be totally ironic though. The Tories chose him as leader knowing full well his fatal character flaws, but thought they could foist him on the British public to gain another term in parliament.

He may though be the reason for their demise.

I think that there are a number of choices. I did look at it in depth years ago but have forgotten.

How would PR work in the U.K. I wonder? Would there be much bigger constituencies with say 3 MPs voted in on PR or would each voter get preferential votes like we do in the mayoral election ? I’m all in favour just thinking about the practicalities.

I’m going to write to my MP

Andy Burnham urges the Labour Party to back PR after the two by-elections

www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jun/25/andy-burnham-says-labour-must-seize-moment-and-back-proportional-representation