Tories lose both by-elections.

Oliver Dowden currently has an absolute majority in a safe Conservative seat, but even he must be a bit nervous after the by-election victory. To cover his own back, he needs to disassociate himself from the current leadership.

Win or loose he/she need to win the seat.

Absolutely brilliant news on the stunning results. The Tiverton one is a total game changer. The Tories have taken their eye off the ball in these southwest rural areas. I'm sure people do feel neglected as the focus has been more to the Midlands and North of England. Having said that I fail to see what the so-called levelling up agenda has achieved. We're in dire straits with fuel price increases, food costs and rampant inflation, combined with increased taxation. Our savings are now eroding at 10% or probably more per annum. Tories - good luck with sorting it all out - I've not seen any ideas from them so far.

Interesting that the media trying to suggest we're back to the 70's with trade unions on strike isn't working either. Mick Lynch of the RMT comes across as eminently reasonable and why shouldn't people have pay rises that at least in part match inflation? They can manage it for us pensioners - ha, ha. Obviously they think we're their core voters - not this pensioner!!!!!!

Katie59

With a new leader Tiverton will return to Tory at the next GE don’t doubt that, but a lot of marginal seats will be lost. It’s going to be tricky choosing a leader that will retain his/her seat next time. Theresa May would be a good choice but after last time wouldn’t want it again I’m sure, would any Gransnetters, like to propose their MP as a candidate, mine is tainted.

I’m not sure your supposition is right Katie59, I don’t think a new leader now will save the Tories by the next election because they are so divided. The loss may be less bloody without our current esteemed leader, but the election will still be lost. And who knows, the new LibDem MP may be wonderful.
My Tory MP is a 2019 yes woman mistake, my constituency was LibDem for many years until the last election, and we always had good constituency MPs, although I’m not a LibDem supporter. The current MP is as much use as a chocolate teapot.

Oldnproud

Reading between the lines of Dowden's resignation letter, I think it's easy to guess who he feels should take responsibility.

Personally, I would extend blame well beyond Johnson. All Tory MPs who have continued to support him no matter what, keeping him in power in spite of his blatantly obvious unsuitability, are responsible.

Hmmm ... it wouldn't surprise me to see Dowden on the list of candidates, if/when Johnson finally goes.

Katie59

With a new leader Tiverton will return to Tory at the next GE don’t doubt that, but a lot of marginal seats will be lost. It’s going to be tricky choosing a leader that will retain his/her seat next time. Theresa May would be a good choice but after last time wouldn’t want it again I’m sure, would any Gransnetters, like to propose their MP as a candidate, mine is tainted.

My MP has a slick troll army on Twitter, who regularly tout her as a future PM. Well, I think she's still our MP - she only ever turns up for photoshoots and doesn't appear to do anything except give outrageous lying "anti-woke" speeches. If she were ever to become PM, I think we would all do well to look for emigration possibilities.

The Wakefield man gave a very good, short speech.

With a new leader Tiverton will return to Tory at the next GE don’t doubt that, but a lot of marginal seats will be lost. It’s going to be tricky choosing a leader that will retain his/her seat next time. Theresa May would be a good choice but after last time wouldn’t want it again I’m sure, would any Gransnetters, like to propose their MP as a candidate, mine is tainted.

Reading between the lines of Dowden's resignation letter, I think it's easy to guess who he feels should take responsibility.

Personally, I would extend blame well beyond Johnson. All Tory MPs who have continued to support him no matter what, keeping him in power in spite of his blatantly obvious unsuitability, are responsible.

What is intriguing me is which way the tory rebels are going to jump now?

I think that after this loss Johnson will be trying to push through as much damaging legislation as he can before he is finally ousted. Will the rebels support it?

Will the 1922 committee change its rules to allow another confidence vote in a few month's time?

All the better that Raab is cross.
The icing on this particular cake.

Hooray!!? ?

Get well soon Whitewavemark and * Galaxy*

Each of the two seats was lost for a different reason imo. Put simply, many of the people of Tiverton, traditionally Conservative, not longer believe the party represents them. They see levelling up as focusing on the urban, industrial Midlands and the North while predominantly rural, agricultural and small business economies are ignored.

The voters in red wall seats on the other hand are not lifelong Conservatives. They are not ideological Conservative. The contrast between what happened in 2021 Hartlepool when there was a 16% swing to the Tories and Wakefield where there has just been a 12% swing to Labour is remarkable.

However, I’d also add that there were 15 candidates standing in Wakefield. I don’t recall ever seeing so many candidates in a by-election or a general election. The smaller parties took around 5000 votes from the main two parties. The margin between Labour 13166 and Conservative 8241. I’m not sure what that is telling us other than that many people are fed up and want change - anything other than what we have at the moment.

Great to see how many Gransnetters have welcomed the stunning LibDem victory.

If you've ever considered joining the party, now's the time.

www.libdems.org.uk/joining-us

I'm so grateful to the people who have campaigned, voted and worked so hard to give this glimmer of hope.

The first real sign that we have had enough of the self interested wrong 'uns ruining the country.

A long way to go, but just for today I'm walking on air.

What on earth does Johnson say that has any meaning?

Nothing he says actually comes to anything.

Correction: turn out at Wakefield was 39%

The Conservative Party are addressing the whole thing at their AGM tonight:

"By-election defeats to be discussed at Conservative AGM:

Sir Geoffrey Clifton-Brown has said he will discuss the by-election defeats at a Conservative AGM (Annual General Meeting) this evening and expects to make 'difficult decisions'.

The treasurer of the 1922 committee said the Conservatives will then have 'some difficult decisions to make, no doubt' on how to move forward.

The MP for The Cotswolds told the BBC's Today programme that MPs would in the coming days decide whether steps should be taken to oust Boris Johnson.

Speaking on a phone line, Mr Clifton-Brown said: 'I'm not going to come on out this morning and speculate on behalf of my colleagues as to whether we should or shouldn't change the rules.

Clearly what's going to happen over the next few days is the Prime Minister is going to set out to both his Cabinet and with us as Members of Parliament.'

The line then broke off momentarily before he added: 'We will then in the parliamentary party have to make a judgment as to whether we think that is a satisfactory explanation or whether we should actually take steps to have a new Prime Minister.'

The Tory grandee, who voted against Mr Johnson in the confidence vote over his leadership, added: 'I've got an AGM tonight, I will consider what my members say, I will then discuss this matter with my colleagues, we will hear what the Prime Minister says and then we will have to make some difficult decisions, no doubt.'"

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10948647/BY-ELECTIONS-LIVE-Conservatives-lose-two-seats-terrible-night-Boris-Johnson.html

What no one seems to comment on, is that while turnout at Wakefield was only 29%, in Honiton it was over 50%, 52.3%. I understand that that is a higher than average turnout at a by-election. It rather suggests that Conservative voters are VERY unhappy with Johnson and his mob.

Raab,trying to explain it all away: ?

"Deputy prime minister Dominic Raab has claimed the “distraction” of the partygate scandal was partly to blame for two devastating by-elections defeats for the Conservatives.

The Tory party chairman Oliver Dowden resigned within hours of the results, with a swipe at what he described as “recent events” and saying that “someone must take responsibility”.

But Mr Raab tried to brush aside the affair which has plunged his party into chaos, describing it as one of a series of “distractions” which lost the party votes.

On a visit to Rwanda, Boris Johnson also pledged he would "keep going" despite the blow to his authority just weeks after nearly 150 of his own MPs voted to oust him from Downing Street.

In remarks likely to infuriate Tory MPs demanding the prime minister resign, Mr Raab also accused his party of “ill-discipline” over that confidence vote."

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/dominic-raab-by-election-results-partygate-b2108455.html

I'm tickled pink at these results, especially the Tiverton one.
What a great success for the Lib Dems.

Raab will be cross. His majority in Esher is only 2743. He's toast in the next election. Can't come soon enough.

I watched the early morning BBC coverage as the results came in. Lewis Goodall in sparkling form barely concealing his glee and speculating that Raab, Gove, Kwarteng could all lose their seats if the LibDeb swing was seen in their constituencies.

Now the VONC looks to have been premature. Had it been next Monday, payroll or not, I think Johnson would have lost. Like Zonne, I'd also like to hear backbenchers discussing what to do next.

Yes, we have an Prime Minister who just lies his way from one crisis to the next. Runs away completely when he gets booed (his last flight to Ukraine - where he felt someone likes him), rather than go to Doncaster for his own party.

I have feared and detested him for many years - starting when he was Mayor of London. When people applauded when May stepped down, I was fear struck as I knew that Johnson would then take over.

However, the idea that just getting rid of him will in any way help the country at all is a false. His whole government is made up of lookalikes - and should he be forced to resign whoever took over as PM could be as bad or worse.

The slogan should not be 'Johnson 'must go', but 'Tory Government must go.'

Frost managed to tag Irish Labour on that tweet, so as incompetent as ever.

Susie Dent, whose tweets are always on point:

‘Word of the day (again) is ‘stiffrump’ (18th century): a highly obstinate individual who refuses to budge.’

I want to be a fly on the wall in the next 1922 Committee meeting.

Word of the day is ‘stiffrump’ (18th century): a highly obstinate individual who refuses to budge.