Countries can ditch monarchy and become republics ‘calmly and without rancour’ says Prince of Wales

Or anybody else's, really.

I do understand how it works.
Perhaps not part of your argument.

OK, I have washing to put on, but before I go...

Yes Republicans are in a minority. Obviously we are, its said in every poll which is quoted here. Doesn't make us wrong though.

A desire for Scotland to become independent is a desire for us to have our own parliamentary system. That doesn't mean becoming a republic. The present Queen is Queen of Scots and would remain so if Scotland became independent. Independence would dissolve the Union of Parliaments (1707), not the Union of the Crowns (1603).

Personally I would like to see a republic, but that is not a necessary step to independence.

So I'm afraid you are just about as wrong as can be... republicanism is not part of my independence argument. Or anybody else's, really.

volver

I find Republic to be rather extreme.

Are you really saying we tried something in the 17th century so we can't do it again?

Rather like Brexit - if we don't like it is there any going back a second time?

volver

^I must say I don't know (m)any vociferous republicans^

You don't say.

Well, yes, I did say!
You saw it here first.

Which means imo they must be in a minority.

I'm amazed you claim (more than once) Scitland could still retain the Monarch as HofS if Scotland became a republic so why would you, in particular as a republican, say that? Surely it would be part of your independence argument?

I find Republic to be rather extreme.

Are you really saying we tried something in the 17th century so we can't do it again?

Oh, I did look at Republic which is often repeated on here anyway. Nothing much new since the days of Willie Hamilton.

We tried it once, didn't like it. It was far too repressive - as America is becoming.

I must say I don't know (m)any vociferous republicans

You don't say.

Only reading on here, same old stuff.

I must say I don't know (m)any vociferous republicans, even our lovely neighbours joined in the Jubilee party.
Some of my Australian relatives would be happy to have a Republic.

Callistemon21

^OK, I don't really believe that, but I'm a bit tired of the same old complaints with no grain of original thought attached^.

I haven't heard any original thoughts from republicans either

Really? Then you haven't been listening.

OK, I don't really believe that, but I'm a bit tired of the same old complaints with no grain of original thought attached.

I haven't heard any original thoughts from republicans either

a country some seem to hold in high regard,

DaisyAnne you don't seem to be aware that when you say things like that you are throwing shade on your fellow contributors.

As the young folk say.

GrannyGravy13

Any one running for President would have to be financially secure or funded by someone who was, that paves the way for bribes…

www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20243493

Don't judge everyone by the same standards.

Anything is possible if you can only imagine it.

(OK, I don't really believe that, but I'm a bit tired of the same old complaints with no grain of original thought attached.)

GrannyGravy13

Any one running for President would have to be financially secure or funded by someone who was, that paves the way for bribes…

And, as in America GG13, a country some seem to hold in high regard, despite recent events, this would mean that two or three families provide the President in some sort of rotation. How is that any better than our imperfect system, I wonder.

...and no one is ever bribed by the promise of a knighthood.

We are not Saudi Arabia. I would suggest there is less comparison between our constitutional monarchy to their absolute monarchy than between our constitutional monarchy and a president-led republic.

For now.

Any one running for President would have to be financially secure or funded by someone who was, that paves the way for bribes…

volver

I can think of countries with monarchies where the people are pretty badly off in terms of democracy. Saudi Arabia. Thailand. There are monarchies where things are not as good as they are here. We have had a good 70 years but had Edward VIII not abdicated, things might have been very different indeed.

Being a monarchy doesn't save you from dictatorship.

I don't think anyone has said that being a monarchy saves you from dictatorship. It patently doesn't in some countries.

We are not Saudi Arabia. I would suggest there is less comparison between our constitutional monarchy to their absolute monarchy than between our constitutional monarchy and a president-led republic.

Plenty of altruistic people to choose from who would want the job. Not just three old men from one family

volver

^It would be extremely difficult to find a completely apolitical president with altruistic motives imo.^

On not that excuse again.

On not that excuse again
?

Not an excuse - I doubt that anyone of that description would want the job.

It would be extremely difficult to find a completely apolitical president with altruistic motives imo.

On not that excuse again.

A president would be able to speak about social interests of the people but not political like the Irish President does
Oh, not the Irish President again ???

Monarchy is there to do as PM asks and to benefit the monarchy. The Queen and Charles lobbies for their interests uses queen's consent to vet laws for their personal interests that's monarchy

Does not defend our constitution.

Monarchy, on the other hand, precludes equality even as a pretense. There is nothing remotely egalitarian about a system that guarantees, by law, that one family will receive taxpayer-funded grants, literal palaces in which to live, special protections from criminal justice, barely disguised political influence, and the deference of elected politicians. The whole point is that some people are born different—and better—than others. This is a repugnant doctrine.

An Elected Head of State would have to be by law apolitical.

A president would be able to speak about social interests of the people but not political like the Irish President does. The queen says nothing.

volver

I can think of countries with monarchies where the people are pretty badly off in terms of democracy. Saudi Arabia. Thailand. There are monarchies where things are not as good as they are here. We have had a good 70 years but had Edward VIII not abdicated, things might have been very different indeed.

Being a monarchy doesn't save you from dictatorship.

Just change that last sentence to:

"Being a monarchy isn't saving you from a dictatorship"

I can think of countries with monarchies where the people are pretty badly off in terms of democracy. Saudi Arabia. Thailand. There are monarchies where things are not as good as they are here. We have had a good 70 years but had Edward VIII not abdicated, things might have been very different indeed.

Being a monarchy doesn't save you from dictatorship.

Now you are perfectly entitled to think we should stick with a monarchy. Perfectly entitled. And I am perfectly entitled to tell people that power based on who you dad was is a pre-medieval concept beloved of non-democratic countries and governments around the world

I think we should stick with a monarchy and would vote for that in favour in a referendum because I feel the monarchy gives us stability, especially in uncertain times. The monarch can disagree with his/her Prime Minister and I'm sure the present monarch and her heir let the present PM know that in no uncertain (but polite) terms. I'm sure most Prime Ministers would take heed but the present one has the skin of a rhino. I doubt that he's listened to anyone's advice in his life unless it suits him personally.
It would be extremely difficult to find a completely apolitical president with altruistic motives imo.

It’s rather silly to suggest that we might think having a republic would solve all our problems with everything at one fell swoop. But you can’t hold up examples of bad things happening in republics and use that as an example of why we shouldn’t have one. If you want to have examples of bad things happening in monarchies, Google the Thai monarchy. Or the Spanish one under Juan Carlos.

I can think of countries which had monarchies, got rid of them in various ways then found everything became far worse for the populations when they became dictatorships.