Why is Keir Starmer trying to put so many voters off?

It’s true though Monica.. people are more likely to vote Conservative as they age, not only based on the YouGov and other polls, but on analysis of voting patterns. Here’s the summary from the last election.
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/ge2019-how-did-demographics-affect-the-result/

Greater ManchesterMayor Andy Burnham is leading where Keir Starmer is not.

"Nobody in my position should ever criticise people for trying to protect their incomes in a cost of living crisis"

Greater Manchester Mayor Andy Burnham says he supports rail workers and BA staff taking strike action#SundayMorning t.co/NbNlJWstUI pic.twitter.com/BdCojOtk1t

— BBC Politics (@BBCPolitics) July 3, 2022

Andy Burnham:

“Of course Mick Lynch has my support”.

7 words that show leadership where others have failed. pic.twitter.com/yORE8RGn7E

— Tory Fibs (@ToryFibs) June 30, 2022

I’ll never talk to the SNP, says Starmer. That’s morally dubious and tactically inept

hat is politics about if not about talking? Politics is about the formation of shifting alliances in the country, across different voter groups and sectors, between parties and within parties. At its best, politics is agile, inquiring, empathic, humble and bold.

But not according to Labour’s leadership, which is on Monday expected to confirm its strategy of never talking to the SNP, a move that is morally dubious and tactically inept.

It’s morally questionable because we still, just, live in something called a democracy. And in a democracy, if the SNP keeps winning majorities in Holyrood and returning the vast majority of Scotland’s MPs to Westminster, then it has a legitimate mandate for a second referendum – that at least has to be engaged with. To deny not just the mandate or the party but the people of Scotland, who voted for them, is to deny democracy as a process of negotiation. Instead, it to practise politics as coercion.

Saying to the SNP, and especially its voters, “We will stare you down and give you no option but to back us, or be portrayed as Tories,” is tantamount to a form of political abuse. It will turn people away from democracy just when it needs deepening.

And what goes for the SNP is likely to go for the Liberal Democrats, who will be similarly stared down over their demand for proportional representation (PR).

Casdon I am fed up with the canard that over 65s are deeply Conservative. Yes, figures show that over 65s are more likely to vote Conservative, but what is the majority'? 51%?, 64%?, 75%, 99%?

And even if people vote Conservative not all of them are extreme foaming at the mouth right wingers. Quite a few will vote Conservative, because they see anything being better than the shambles that is the Labour Party. Others will be at the other end of the spectrum.

I am fed up with all these sweeping generalisations about what 'over 65s' do or do not do. I think very few over 65 GN members vote Conservative. Very few of the over 65s I know vote Conservative, and those that do are very much on the left margin of support.

MerylStreep

Casdon
its the grans who judge him most harshly
If you read MN you would see that the younger generation on there are scathing about him.

I looked at the YouGov stats, rather than relying on anecdote.

Casdon
its the grans who judge him most harshly
If you read MN you would see that the younger generation on there are scathing about him.

I am disappointed in Keir, and I really did give him a chance.

The gender politics issues is huge, and that applies to all the opposition parties - it is only the Tories who are talking any sort of sense on this one. A more reasonable take on Brexit would garner a lot of support, but he's not taking that either.

I feel adrift - I will never vote Tory or Lib Dem, but I'm reluctant to vote for a party who is showing such misogynist tendencies either. I know a lot of women who feel the same, and it applies to SNP voters in Scotland, too. It's a real worry.

I fear that Kier Starmer has been very badly advised by pro-brexit politicos.

What a shame he has not got the guts to stick to what he believed and must still know to be true - that brexit is without doubt based on lies and is only ever going to inflict damage on our country

I believe it’s an age group issue. If you are over 65, on average you are deeply conservative, so if you look at the polls by age group, it’s the grans who judge him most harshly.

The Labour Party are being quite wise in not declaring their policies clearly at this stage in my opinion, because of the way the government is behaving - the less ammunition they are given the better. I think Sir Keir is trying to line up as many ducks as he can before the next election is called, and that the fence sitting is a deliberate tactic.

Casdon

Is he putting so many voters off because he’s an immoral, lying, cheating and dishonest idiot who doesn’t comb his hair? Oh no, that’s the other one.

I’m afraid that’s what we’re stuck with if people don’t have faith in Keir. I can’t believe the number of Labour voters that would rather not have a Labour government at all because it isn’t quite the Labour Party that they personally want. I really believe that they just want to be in permanent opposition so they can moan about everything. Imo we’re going to get a Labour/LibDem coalition and the LibDems will put pressure on Keir regarding eg the single market. Which he will happily go along with. As will I.

That's the trouble, Casdon. It would be good to think that Labour had a good chance in the next general election, but I do wonder if they are trying too hard to keep the Red Wall happy and ignore the rest of us who want a change of government.

Is he putting so many voters off because he’s an immoral, lying, cheating and dishonest idiot who doesn’t comb his hair? Oh no, that’s the other one.

Quite agree.

If you actually read my post, M0nica, you will see that I am not saying anything about getting back into the EU. We didn't have to have such a hard Brexit, and could have stayed in both the single market and the customs union. If we had, we might not be in the dreadful and deteriorating position we are in now.

Brexit is a done deal. It has happened and we are where we are and we need to go from there.

There was a referendum and the result was Brexit and to go back on it would be further to undermine the democratic process in this country. Essentially, politicians saying. Yoy can have a referendum but if we dislike the result we will ignore it.

You are also assuming that the EU will have us back and at the moment I think that is highly improbable.

Keir Starmer is doing what the Conservative government should have done from the day after the referendum result. Acknowledged that while Brexit won, it was a very narrow defeat and that EU and Uk should collaborate to make our withdrawal as simple and collaborative as possible.

The ideas Keir Starmer is currently airing are wise and sensible. If he keeps on at this rate, I might even consider voting for him. Trouble is that would involve voting Labour - hmm.