Labour sacks shadow transport minister who backed strikes.

You Starmer supporters certainly know how to make left leaning people feel welcome and appreciated.

You may have it there MayBee.

I was working when Starmer was a young barrister, he represented so many bro pono cases, the head if his chambers feared he’d never earn enough to get a mortgage. His work at the CPS was excellent.

He’s a hard working, decent, law abiding man.

Keir spent a lot of time helping the unions legally before he entered politics. Why are they so opposed to him now? Is it because some people can’t stomach the thought of a Labour leader that a traditional Conservative voter might vote for?

Starmer is the LP’s best hope. He isn’t destroying it, he’s attempting the impossible, to get the ‘left’ to compromise, you know, that filthy word that might just mean we don’t have 12 more years of the tories.

I live in the north west. Houses worth 1million aren’t the norm here. I’m visiting good pals in south Manchester tomorrow, 12 mikes away, their house, bought the same tine as mine, is worth 850,000. They got Labour, worked in public service, should they be dismissed because the value of their house increased so much more than mine.
I’m waiting for someone to find a criticism of Starmer that means something

DaisyAnne

Glorianny

DaisyAnne

Can I ask why it matters to you so much Glorianny? As long as he pays his taxes, just what has he done wrong?

He has worked hard and earned his money. As I understand it, Johnson cannot hang on to his money. As we have seen, he expects others to pay for his extravagances. Generally, people see this as a fault in a PM.

Corbyn has a net worth of £3 million apparently, so hardly on the bread-line. He has earned a decent salary for over 30 years as an MP. Considerably better than many who voted for him. His family is what I see is described as reasonably wealthy so he may have inherited some - who knows. I imagine he pays his tax too.

Being able to educate yourself, learn and earn in what is a very low-paid job when you start and then earn well because few reach the level of knowledge and capability you have seems to me to be very creditable.

Do you believe all those who consider themselves on the left should go around in hair shirts? Do you do this - all your money to charity, for example?

FFS it doesn't matter to me. It was a reason why possibly he has lost touch with working people and an attempt to explain his shifting from Labour policies which have been popular to Tory-lite ones.
And I'm not the one who is resurrecting it. But I can see why it's being done because the other posts I've written about his lack of consistency, failure to keep promises, and shifting ideas absolutely undermine the idea that he is a man of principal who can be trusted. How about focussing on those for a change?

You don't need to swear. It doesn't add in any way to what you say. I seem to remember you have resorted to it before - when you couldn't make people agree with your opinions.

No wonder I had no idea why you were harping on about what he earned. What does the idea Starmer has "lost touch with working people" even mean? As he earned his money by working, it seems you have a very narrow classification of "working people". Nor do I think he shows any sign of being a Tory - that's just weird. I think he sees the world as it is, not as it was in 1945. Why should anyone constantly focus on your opinions?

Maybe it's too hard for some to accept the change. Apparently, it takes people about six weeks to accept that change is happening. I think six centuries would not be enough for some in the Labour Party, and they probably still wouldn't accept that even though principles haven't changed, how the Labour Party achieves them has to, or nothing will change for those relying on them.

However, I can see that you want what you want and will not accept a democratic vote for a leader if the person chosen doesn't act exactly as you expect them to. By the sound of things, you would prefer to destroy the Labour Party rather than not have what you want.

I don't "resort" to anything. I swear sometimes (quite often). You don't. I respect your right to decide not to, try respecting my right to swear if I want to.
Anyway the only person destroying the LP now is Starmer who has managed to half the membership, is threatened with the removal of more union funding and effectively is bankrupting the party. How they will manage to fight an election no one knows. But Yes of course it's my fault

Glorianny

DaisyAnne

Can I ask why it matters to you so much Glorianny? As long as he pays his taxes, just what has he done wrong?

He has worked hard and earned his money. As I understand it, Johnson cannot hang on to his money. As we have seen, he expects others to pay for his extravagances. Generally, people see this as a fault in a PM.

Corbyn has a net worth of £3 million apparently, so hardly on the bread-line. He has earned a decent salary for over 30 years as an MP. Considerably better than many who voted for him. His family is what I see is described as reasonably wealthy so he may have inherited some - who knows. I imagine he pays his tax too.

Being able to educate yourself, learn and earn in what is a very low-paid job when you start and then earn well because few reach the level of knowledge and capability you have seems to me to be very creditable.

Do you believe all those who consider themselves on the left should go around in hair shirts? Do you do this - all your money to charity, for example?

FFS it doesn't matter to me. It was a reason why possibly he has lost touch with working people and an attempt to explain his shifting from Labour policies which have been popular to Tory-lite ones.
And I'm not the one who is resurrecting it. But I can see why it's being done because the other posts I've written about his lack of consistency, failure to keep promises, and shifting ideas absolutely undermine the idea that he is a man of principal who can be trusted. How about focussing on those for a change?

You don't need to swear. It doesn't add in any way to what you say. I seem to remember you have resorted to it before - when you couldn't make people agree with your opinions.

No wonder I had no idea why you were harping on about what he earned. What does the idea Starmer has "lost touch with working people" even mean? As he earned his money by working, it seems you have a very narrow classification of "working people". Nor do I think he shows any sign of being a Tory - that's just weird. I think he sees the world as it is, not as it was in 1945. Why should anyone constantly focus on your opinions?

Maybe it's too hard for some to accept the change. Apparently, it takes people about six weeks to accept that change is happening. I think six centuries would not be enough for some in the Labour Party, and they probably still wouldn't accept that even though principles haven't changed, how the Labour Party achieves them has to, or nothing will change for those relying on them.

However, I can see that you want what you want and will not accept a democratic vote for a leader if the person chosen doesn't act exactly as you expect them to. By the sound of things, you would prefer to destroy the Labour Party rather than not have what you want.

DaisyAnne

Can I ask why it matters to you so much Glorianny? As long as he pays his taxes, just what has he done wrong?

He has worked hard and earned his money. As I understand it, Johnson cannot hang on to his money. As we have seen, he expects others to pay for his extravagances. Generally, people see this as a fault in a PM.

Corbyn has a net worth of £3 million apparently, so hardly on the bread-line. He has earned a decent salary for over 30 years as an MP. Considerably better than many who voted for him. His family is what I see is described as reasonably wealthy so he may have inherited some - who knows. I imagine he pays his tax too.

Being able to educate yourself, learn and earn in what is a very low-paid job when you start and then earn well because few reach the level of knowledge and capability you have seems to me to be very creditable.

Do you believe all those who consider themselves on the left should go around in hair shirts? Do you do this - all your money to charity, for example?

FFS it doesn't matter to me. It was a reason why possibly he has lost touch with working people and an attempt to explain his shifting from Labour policies which have been popular to Tory-lite ones.
And I'm not the one who is resurrecting it. But I can see why it's being done because the other posts I've written about his lack of consistency, failure to keep promises, and shifting ideas absolutely undermine the idea that he is a man of principal who can be trusted. How about focussing on those for a change?

I really cannot see that it matters what any politician from any political party has in the bank.
you could say that it may make them a better politician if they have no money worries at all.They can concentrate on their jobs.But either way, it simply does not matter.

Can I ask why it matters to you so much Glorianny? As long as he pays his taxes, just what has he done wrong?

He has worked hard and earned his money. As I understand it, Johnson cannot hang on to his money. As we have seen, he expects others to pay for his extravagances. Generally, people see this as a fault in a PM.

Corbyn has a net worth of £3 million apparently, so hardly on the bread-line. He has earned a decent salary for over 30 years as an MP. Considerably better than many who voted for him. His family is what I see is described as reasonably wealthy so he may have inherited some - who knows. I imagine he pays his tax too.

Being able to educate yourself, learn and earn in what is a very low-paid job when you start and then earn well because few reach the level of knowledge and capability you have seems to me to be very creditable.

Do you believe all those who consider themselves on the left should go around in hair shirts? Do you do this - all your money to charity, for example?

Well, I can add up too, and that doesn't come anywhere near the £7 million that you originally claimed, Glorianny.

Casdon

Glorianny I worked in the NHS in Wales, in senior roles for many years, I do understand exactly how it works. The NHS has always had an interdependency with private medicine, right from inception. That is not the same thing at all as privatising services. Not all services have ever been available on the NHS. Other healthcare providers in the context of the NHS Wales budget doesn’t mean private contractors working in the NHS either. Come the revolution perhaps the left will completely break the link. More people will die, more complex treatments won’t happen, GP services will leave the NHS but hey ho, I’m sure you know more about it than either Keir Starmer or Mark Drakeford do.

On Keir Starmer’s personal wealth, I just want you do show me the evidence from a reputable source. If you can’t, don’t post made up nonsense.

On Keir Starmer’s personal wealth, I just want you do show me the evidence from a reputable source. If you can’t, don’t post made up nonsense.
You mean like someone who owns a house worth over £1million being worth just £1.1million. When he has admitted having a share of his sisters £600,000 house (it's unclear if he received a return on this when the house was sold) and is selling land worth over £100,000? Well at least I can add up!
books.google.co.uk/books?id=tFUzEAAAQBAJ&pg=PT96&lpg=PT96&dq=Keir+Starmer+is+selling+land+worth+over+%C2%A3100,000&source=bl&ots=muqsWFBoS6&sig=ACfU3U1-D70Bagomw8suxcCr8fsvDHDJHw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjblIrhkbf5AhVIQ0EAHV9cClcQ6AF6BAgpEAM#v=onepage&q=Keir%20Starmer%20is%20selling%20land%20worth%20over%20%C2%A3100%2C000&f=false

Glorianny I worked in the NHS in Wales, in senior roles for many years, I do understand exactly how it works. The NHS has always had an interdependency with private medicine, right from inception. That is not the same thing at all as privatising services. Not all services have ever been available on the NHS. Other healthcare providers in the context of the NHS Wales budget doesn’t mean private contractors working in the NHS either. Come the revolution perhaps the left will completely break the link. More people will die, more complex treatments won’t happen, GP services will leave the NHS but hey ho, I’m sure you know more about it than either Keir Starmer or Mark Drakeford do.

On Keir Starmer’s personal wealth, I just want you do show me the evidence from a reputable source. If you can’t, don’t post made up nonsense.

Casdon

Just find any reputable article that supports your assertion about Starmer’s personal wealth Glorianny?

The article you posted from Wales Online was from 2018, Corbyn was in charge of UK Labour not Starmer. I point you back to the Welsh Government Strategy on Privatisation of the NHS which came out in 2019, and which I posted on this thread previously.

It’s like Groundhog Day.

If you don't understand that strategy isn't actual reality, no wonder you think Starmer is alright. He's exactly that all promises then no action.
In 2020 NHS Wales was still using private providers and spent £78 million on them not to mention £1.1 billion on other healthcare providers. archwilio.cymru/infographics/nhs-wales-summarised-account

As for the articles about Starmer they are many and numerous. If you want to believe someone who lives in a £1 million+ house is only worth £1.1 million that's up to you. It was in any case not really a complaint about him simply a reason as to why he might have lost sight of the realities for working people. It's the lies, indecision or lack of any real commitment that concern me. I simply don't understand how he can be trusted to deliver anything. And no one has come back with anything explaining the shifts or the broken promises, except to say that it might be expedient. Well sorry but I don't think expediency is a good thing in a leader, it needs some principles behind it. Starmer's seem to be non-existent.

Just find any reputable article that supports your assertion about Starmer’s personal wealth Glorianny?

The article you posted from Wales Online was from 2018, Corbyn was in charge of UK Labour not Starmer. I point you back to the Welsh Government Strategy on Privatisation of the NHS which came out in 2019, and which I posted on this thread previously.

It’s like Groundhog Day.

I think Keir would be even richer if he hadn’t done so much free legal work for good causes throughout his legal career.

Casdon

MaizieD

Casdon

Glorianny

Starmer is worth around £7 million. He has boosted his MPs salary by doing private advisory work. Presumably heas investments that will need dealing with.

*Glorianny you me earlier asked for examples of misrepresentations and slurs. This is from this thread. Most reputable sources state KS nett worth at around £1.1m, which is unremarkable. You quote £7m, can you reference your reputable source please?

She won't.

Statrmer stopped all private work once he became leader of the LP. I've even posted his entry from the register of member's interests, but it doesn't seem to go in...

I believe that it's generally held that there's nothing wrong about MPs having other jobs; particularly if it is to keep up with their professional skills...

I know, in much the same way as she didn’t respond to the proof about the NHS privatisation issue in Wales that I discussed. The anti Starmer lobby is like a dripping tap, it relentlessly continues in the hope that we will be worn down into agreement. It’s a good job the plug is out is all I can say.

Well "she" is back. As Starmer's London house is worth over £1million could you please explain how his net worth can only be £1.1 million? He also owns a substantial amount of land behind his parent's house and a share of his sister's house. He is currently in the process of selling land for over £100,000.

As for the Welsh NHS it is currently spending more on purchasing private services than ever before. In spite of the fact that it promised this would end by 2011 www.walesonline.co.uk/news/health/eye-watering-amounts-money-welsh-15473532

I really find this dismissal of any criticism of Starmer as odd. He isn't perfect. He isn't even particularly a good leader. Instead of digging up things you just think aren't true what about addressing the things he has promised but failed to deliver?

varian

Brexit was brought about by an unholy alliance of the extremes of left and right, who are much more like each other that the reasonable folk in the middle.

I have said it many times. Whichever view of the political landscape you use, far-right and far-left are close, with only dictators between them.

One of the problems is we have the right and so called left both spreading the same kind of negative untruths about a decent man
I can’t understand how anyone left of centre can support the Tories this way

MaizieD

Casdon

Glorianny

Starmer is worth around £7 million. He has boosted his MPs salary by doing private advisory work. Presumably heas investments that will need dealing with.

*Glorianny you me earlier asked for examples of misrepresentations and slurs. This is from this thread. Most reputable sources state KS nett worth at around £1.1m, which is unremarkable. You quote £7m, can you reference your reputable source please?

She won't.

Statrmer stopped all private work once he became leader of the LP. I've even posted his entry from the register of member's interests, but it doesn't seem to go in...

I believe that it's generally held that there's nothing wrong about MPs having other jobs; particularly if it is to keep up with their professional skills...

I know, in much the same way as she didn’t respond to the proof about the NHS privatisation issue in Wales that I discussed. The anti Starmer lobby is like a dripping tap, it relentlessly continues in the hope that we will be worn down into agreement. It’s a good job the plug is out is all I can say.

Casdon

Glorianny

Starmer is worth around £7 million. He has boosted his MPs salary by doing private advisory work. Presumably heas investments that will need dealing with.

*Glorianny you me earlier asked for examples of misrepresentations and slurs. This is from this thread. Most reputable sources state KS nett worth at around £1.1m, which is unremarkable. You quote £7m, can you reference your reputable source please?

She won't.

Statrmer stopped all private work once he became leader of the LP. I've even posted his entry from the register of member's interests, but it doesn't seem to go in...

I believe that it's generally held that there's nothing wrong about MPs having other jobs; particularly if it is to keep up with their professional skills...

Glorianny

Starmer is worth around £7 million. He has boosted his MPs salary by doing private advisory work. Presumably heas investments that will need dealing with.

*Glorianny you me earlier asked for examples of misrepresentations and slurs. This is from this thread. Most reputable sources state KS nett worth at around £1.1m, which is unremarkable. You quote £7m, can you reference your reputable source please?

varian

Brexit was brought about by an unholy alliance of the extremes of left and right, who are much more like each other that the reasonable folk in the middle.

This is sadly, so true.

Brexit was brought about by an unholy alliance of the extremes of left and right, who are much more like each other that the reasonable folk in the middle.

It’s just classic far left anti EU’ism isn’t it? Along with the lie that being in the EU would prevent any future plans to re nationalise.

MayBee70

I’ve been told on Facebook that Lynch was a leave supporter but wasn’t leader of the union at the time. But, given that the union supported leave and so did he I’m pretty sure, had he been leader the advice would have been the same. So I have to question his judgement. And, much as I understand why the feel the need to strike I don’t think they’re explaining the reasons behind it because it isn’t just about pay.

I don't think most people think it is "just about pay" and certainly Mick Lynch has never claimed that. It is as much about safety and security of passengers and jobs. ML likens it to what has happened in the ferries and the airlines. Permanent well trained, properly paid staff replaced by agency workers who are not qualified and are paid less , that's part of the fight