Water should be nationalised

* nannypiano * I will ask them as I am meeting with Anglian Water this month.

Most water boards in Denmark are run locally, having a board of members that consists of any of the users of water in the area the board supplies who want to stand for election to the board and are voted onto the board at an AGM. The length of time members can sit on the board varies from place to place.

A water board is not necessarily run by the municipal authority of the area concerned. Householders and firms pay for the amount of water they use annually, plus service costs. The government subsidises these local water boards as well.

Heating plants are often run on the same basis.

You might want to consider this model, which is basically that of a co-operative society, before opting for nationalisation.

As far as I know the Dutch have a similar system of water boards, heating plants, and in addition elected boards to run their canals and nagivable rivers and yet another local board to manage sea dykes, pumping stations and polders.

One of the most outrageous things about the present building law, is the fact that the production of a Flood Risk Assessment is in the hands of the developers, not a independent company.

Plus the awarding Council, has no statuary ( statuary means it’s a law);obligation to visit a development once it is finished, to check that it complies with its original planning application.

The builder builds the drains and the water companies have to connect them to their system whatever the state of their current infrastructure or the state of the now buried drains, This has led to builders , ‘ well you can imagine ‘ They know that once they leave a site, they have bugger all responsibility for it or the drains,
They also all got involved with the ‘ leasehold scandal’ leaving many people in a ‘ horrible’ situation, while this government looked on. It took them years to do anything.

Guess which political party receives donations from the Water Companies and the building trade,

I would like to know why Anglian water think it's ok to advertise on tv. We have no choice of water suppliers where we live. Is this cost being added to our bills so they can claim tax relief. I wonder.

All utilities should be nationalised - one person should not have to pay more for a basic utility such as water, gas or electricity than another.

Water was privatised in 1989 by Thatcher. Since then the focus of the Water companies has been profit. Culminating in pouring sewerage into our waterways with impunity. OfWat and the Government has been useless in defending the consumers.
In 2018 Gove, the then Defra Minister called in all the English water companies to answer for their “ Devil may care “ leaks, shareholders before customers attitude, paying huge bonuses for senior staff, dangerous borrowing against assets, selling off reservoirs and land for building ( United Utilities who provide water to North West England sold off a reservoir in the Cheshire area, whilst almost simultaneously threatening the North West with a drought,)
Only Thames Water have built a de salination plant. The South East of England has water supplied by a company already heavily fined for their shenanigans. Google ‘ Windrush against Sewerage Pollution “
One of the policies that Corbyn put forward was to renationalise water. I approved of that idea, but not him.

The Government has allowed the NHS to be privatised. If I recall, 70+ GP surgeries have been sold off to an American company. ( started by Blair)
The state Veterinary Service laboratories have been reduced from 20 to six during the tenure if this government. So during the recent Zoonotic Viral outbreak the work had to be handled by private Labs. They saw the Government coming and made a absolute killing, We are seriously short of Vets, public Health personnel and Laboratories, GPs, doctors and nurses. Our government is recruiting from the third world, when their own Health Systems are in crisis. They have also relaxed the standards of spoken and written English.
Thousands of houses have been built on flood plains as the Government relaxed building regulations in favour of developers…….I could go on.

paddyanne54 keeping to the point ie water supply, you will be aware that Scotland is top of the league for the number of leaks in the supply to households. That's why the water charge is so high in comparison to England, Wales. A lot of utilities were sold off as governments didn't have funds to repair or maintain them. When utilities were government owned I can recall nothing but moans about how all those employed in them were skivvers getting paid to do nothing, much like how LA employees are viewed now! I lived in Scotland at that time and of course no one accepted the shares doled out to employees. What the UK needs is NS to redesign the geography of the UK to ensure everyone has enough rain to maintain a water supply. Sure that's within her many talents.After all she seems to think she was responsible for the gas, oil lying off shore and water in the clouds. Any new design could of course accommodate the removal of the need for ferries helping the island communities. Money saved again!

At least paddyann54....we in Wales don't have the biggest cretin of all....Ecoli STURGEON!! DIDNT you know All Governments have been greedy and corruption since time immormoria?

Paddyann54
Sorry this is so long. I’m so very cross:-
Love the comment about voting Tory marking you a better person.
I’m in the SE of England just now and yes there are still those who think Tory’s are fantastic. We tax payers spent a fortune educating this voting population and it was money wasted. From what I’ve seen, most have difficulty assessing the situation.
The SE is a privileged place with plenty of opportunities for those willing to work. Ok it’s an expensive place to live with the class system being very very strong.
Like other UK places there are those who can’t or refuse to work. There’s plenty of work here but it’s a discriminatory area. Class is a huge barrier.
Sadly it’s a Tory area.
Water and utilities should never have been sold off to foreign investors.
There should be a compulsory purchase of these, returning them to the people.
I’m also thinking the skills we had may have gone. We allowed Thatcher to deskilled the workforce.
A miracle is needed to return our country to an acceptable level and I can’t and don’t blame those Scots wanting independence. We in England are damaging Wales, N Ireland and of course it’s criminal what they do to Scotland.
The Scottish leader is vibrant, knowledgeable and fights for HER people. She demonstrates what’s lacking in Westminster. Here we get fumbling Tory unkempt, lacking in morals and one who treats the electorate like idiots.
I’m appalled the country is lead by these hopeless individuals.
Sorry it’s so long but I needed to get this off my chest. Our local MP is of course Tory and very active but as good as the old chocolate tea pot. She’s always there for photo opportunities of course.

I live in Northern England I didn't vote tory I never have but loads of people must do its a joke im so worried about price hikes we sit in the dark watching TV. Im so scared and im trapped in an awful.job. I really hope things get better for everyone

Nationalised industries don’t always do so well though! I remember years ago when ‘jobs for the boys’(remember Lord Robens and Aberfan?) etc, low productivity and investment and rampant unionisation were the norm with many ‘public owned’ companies! And where did the ‘profits’ go? Not back into the public purse to improve the lot of the working man I’ll wager. Because apart from the ‘you’ve never had it so good’ years which appear somewhat mythical now, historically the working persons lot is and hasn’t been all that great in this country.

it should never have been privatised in the 1st place. But from a Tory point of view nobody makes a profit, thats why they won't nationalise it again. we need a change of gov't

Grantanow

Of course water should be nationalized! We need a national strategy to ensure we have enough, that it can be piped across the country and that sewage is treated properly and not dumped untreated into rivers. The present companies are monopolies and cash cows for their directors and shareholders. They are not investing enough into stopping leaks and treating wastewater. Labour should plan to nationalize all the public utilities as soon as they are elected.

A "National Strategy" does not mean an industry has to be run by the government. Why would you think that it does?

The problem is we have no strategies and haven't for 12 years. That isn't going to be healthy for any country.

It's a very very short step from hard right to facist. My dad's family ( and he aged 3!) Learnt that in 1934 in Berlin.they were upper class spoke high German and high society types too! Didn't stop them having to flee in what they could grab to come here to relatives in Manchester!!! Nobody is "safe" and political parties look after ...themselves first!

I posted this before. When the water companies were privatised the senior managers received vastly increased salaries and the workers hardly any wage increases.

With the trend to hotter, drier Summers, maybe it's time to look at the feasibility of having Desalination Plants & National Grid style pipe network.

Paddyann well said and every grain absolutely true! I cannot understand the pseudo class system in England either!?!the pity is that there's loads of young pseudos coming through the ranks too that think being conservative makes you "a cut above" above what? I ask?!

Nationilastion is to place the dead hand of government on anything and into the hands of its box tickers. There is no incentive to work or think only to take sit down money and all the perks. Where I do agree with most of you is to have a national water grid in the same way as we have a national grid for electricity and gas. Remember the only reason one goes into business is to make money, nothing else

Of course water should be nationalized! We need a national strategy to ensure we have enough, that it can be piped across the country and that sewage is treated properly and not dumped untreated into rivers. The present companies are monopolies and cash cows for their directors and shareholders. They are not investing enough into stopping leaks and treating wastewater. Labour should plan to nationalize all the public utilities as soon as they are elected.

I don’t know Pantglas. according to the Water consumer Council, the two Welsh water companies rate second and third overall in England and Wales.
www.ccwater.org.uk/households/company-performance/
There are so many different comparators (and agencies monitoring their performance) that it’s hard to see the wood for the trees, but they are near the top on the vast majority of comparators I’ve found.

Has anybody found anything that includes Scotland too?

The table I spotted was on ofwat.gov.uk Casdon service and delivery 2020-2021 which are the most recent figures.

Anglian, Severn Trent and Portsmouth were sector leading with Dwr Cymru and Hafren Dyfrdwy topping the average group, although several companies below were top performers on some outcomes.

Pantglas2

While I await Casdon reply, I noted from 2020-2021 figures that Dwr Cymru were not the best performers but top of the average with 3 companies above us in the Best achieving categories.

So private wins on targets?

This was where the table was from *Pantglas. Dwr Cymru operates in western England as well as in Wales, and the report was about operations in England only, as so many of them are. I can’t find any performance reports which meaningfully compare Welsh and Scottish performance with the services in England, so I’d be interested to see where you found the data you mention. What seems to matter to the Environment Agency is current performance against the strategies to improve it, which seems to be where most of the really poor performers are failing - so eg no plans to repair broken pipes infrastructure results in more wasted water and very low performance scores.

Whitewavemark2

DaisyAnne

Not sure how you can separate the two?

Separate the two what, Whitewave?

Well when talking about communism, you are talking about a whole economic system, based on the state ownership of the means of production.

So what I meant was that if you talk about nationalising say E.g. a utility as communism, I sort of think that is using the wrong term. I think you may describe state ownership of say the water supply as at a stretch a mixed economy, but even that is pushing it a tad imo. I would rather see it as a widening of the state control over a vital and necessary resource.

As an aside - excellent podcast with James O’Brian and Professor Brian Cox. Uplifting.

Thank you for clarifying. Nationalisation is state ownership. I'm not sure why you think I am using the wrong term. It suits my thinking; I'm sorry it doesn't work for you. I will try and be more all-encompassing in future. Or do we simply disagree on state control?

I do like the idea of people control - I call it democracy. We seem to have lost it and gained more "state", as in government control, than we ever had. They do say political extremes meet at the bottom of the horse shoe.

Your comments about a mixed economy seem to be taking from the far-right and far-left and calling it mixed. I would much rather we started to allow local control of the production of energy, with people closer to the decisions about their fuel. I would like to see new ideas thrive. I don't believe these will come from doing what we did in the past. We need unconventional thinking and new perspectives.

We have dug up the body of the past with this "Conservative" government. I do hope we don't dig up the body of old Labour (or even old New Labour) to replace it.

Scotland has it’s own problems with discharges, etc.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-58040852

While I await Casdon reply, I noted from 2020-2021 figures that Dwr Cymru were not the best performers but top of the average with 3 companies above us in the Best achieving categories.

So private wins on targets?