Transphobic Bullying

If people want to tell me who I am what i mean or what matters to me means, I think it's quite fortunate I have a sense of humour about it, otherwise it would probably be very upsetting

If people want to bring love and harmony and happy lives to absolutely everyone, of course they should campaign about it and have a movement for it.
It just isn't feminism.

Doodledog

I don't know where this idea that I am narrating your life comes from, VS Are you feeling quite well?

I wasn't explaining BLM - I was pointing out that All Lives Matter took the original movement, which had a particular purpose for a particular group, and appropriated it for their own ends, using the nomenclature to make it sound similar and inclusive but actually including the very people that BLM was formed to protect against.

This is exactly what so-called 'Intersectional feminism' does. It has hitched itself to the feminist cause, and included those who want to damage the rights of women, whilst using the original name to make it sound non-threatening.

I don't agree doodledog and neither do a very large number of women so im not sure i feel threatened by you trying to turn something positive into a negative.

Unfortunately gender critical groups, who clearly don't agree with intersectional feminsim due to its inclusion of transwomen, quite often lose their groups on public forums due to breaking guidelines and bully tactics. So I can't properly compare the popularity of different types of femism

Another very large number of women have stopped calling themselves feminists, to avoid the umpteen types of feminism there now seem to be, and have continued supporting women's rights, not men's demands.

That's personal choice

I would fight for women's rights to have a voice and an opinion unless ot goes against the equality act of course

It is bully tactics which remove women and men from public forums for stating biological truth .

The idea that transwomen are not women has been legally established as a protected belief in the UK.

That's not why they get removed FarNorth

Most social communities have guidelines

It is why some people get removed.

VioletSky

Unfortunately gender critical groups, who clearly don't agree with intersectional feminsim due to its inclusion of transwomen, quite often lose their groups on public forums due to breaking guidelines and bully tactics. So I can't properly compare the popularity of different types of femism

That's interesting, VS. Quite often?

Is this recorded anywhere? How do you know about breaking guidelines and bully tactics leading to groups being 'lost'? I have heard about GC women being silenced on more general discussion groups by being goaded until they snap and get banned, but I haven't seen enough evidence that to know if that is true. I am interested in group dynamics though - perhaps you could explain to me how it works?

The guideline that caused a gender critical group of 65,000 to be removed (as well as many others like groups for Donald Trump) was that the platform would not allow groups that "Incite violence or promote hate towards vulnerable groups"

So clearly if those guidelines were broken that's the personal responsibility of those using the group to stay within guidelines and those guidelines were broken too many times.

Which takes us back to the subject of this post rather nicely

Your post @ 15.57 put that very well Doodledog.

I don't differentiate between a feminist and an intersectional feminist as for me they are one in the same.

The term Feminist Movement came into the English language in the 1880's. The world was a very different place and as with any sociopolitical movement, in order to stand the test of time, it's had to evolve and encompass the vast array of social and political changes, that have occurred over the last 140 years or so.

I've been a feminist since the 70's and have never met a white feminist, someone who doesn't recognise intersectionality focusing only on 'issues' that affect white women. For me, anyone who declares themselves a feminist is an intersectional feminist. No true feminist would limit their loyalty to only white middle class women.

Personally I don't like the term as it always makes me wonder if there's a perceived hierarchy to feminism, that intersectional feminism is somehow superior. The term certainly suggests that unless it's intersectional, feminism isn't inclusive of all women which I strongly disagree with.

VioletSky

The guideline that caused a gender critical group of 65,000 to be removed (as well as many others like groups for Donald Trump) was that the platform would not allow groups that "Incite violence or promote hate towards vulnerable groups"

So clearly if those guidelines were broken that's the personal responsibility of those using the group to stay within guidelines and those guidelines were broken too many times.

Which takes us back to the subject of this post rather nicely

Ok, so by that reckoning, the people who threaten JKR et al would be banned if they set up a group?

What has Donald Trump got to do with it? He is far from being a feminist surely? Even the Intersectionalists wouldn't want him, would they?

Yes doodledog a group threatening JKR would be banned and I'd report it myself

Smileless2012

Your post @ 15.57 put that very well Doodledog.

I don't differentiate between a feminist and an intersectional feminist as for me they are one in the same.

The term Feminist Movement came into the English language in the 1880's. The world was a very different place and as with any sociopolitical movement, in order to stand the test of time, it's had to evolve and encompass the vast array of social and political changes, that have occurred over the last 140 years or so.

I've been a feminist since the 70's and have never met a white feminist, someone who doesn't recognise intersectionality focusing only on 'issues' that affect white women. For me, anyone who declares themselves a feminist is an intersectional feminist. No true feminist would limit their loyalty to only white middle class women.

Personally I don't like the term as it always makes me wonder if there's a perceived hierarchy to feminism, that intersectional feminism is somehow superior. The term certainly suggests that unless it's intersectional, feminism isn't inclusive of all women which I strongly disagree with.

I'm really glad to hear that you would consider yourself an intersectional feminist. Some don't and would exclude groups or place their needs above other groups while still calling themselves feminists.

As things like transphobia has roots in sexism, I cannot consider someone who is transphibic a feminist

Personally I don't like the term as it always makes me wonder if there's a perceived hierarchy to feminism, that intersectional feminism is somehow superior. The term certainly suggests that unless it's intersectional, feminism isn't inclusive of all women which I strongly disagree with.

I think it's fair to say that many who identify as IF see themselves as superior, but that's not the same thing, of course.

IMO feminism (as you say) crosses lines of race, class, education and nationality, but cannot, by definition, cross sex lines, as doing so would mean it was not feminism but something different (the 'something' being dependent on the objectives of the group). So white British feminists would be supportive of black american women's rights, but if they supported white British men (as well they may) it would not be driven by feminism, but by politics or something else.

Sorry - the first pp there was a quote from Smileless

What about my personality or demeaner makes you think I consider myself superior? doodledog?

DD said 'many' not 'you'

Ah, that's difficult to quantify because I agree with the "many" and count myself as one of them...

Exactly Doodledog it cannot and should not be seen as crossing sex lines as the meaning of feminism is lost.

I do not include TW vs because they are not women, that said I would never support any form of discrimination against them.

I posted earlier that I don't believe transphobia has its roots in sexism. A feminist who is transphobic toward trans men, I would agree is not representing the core values of feminism.

Interesting

Anyway I really must go focus on boiling the heads of my enemies before family games night.

So happy having all my children home for a bit

What makes you think my post was about you, VS. You seem to think that if I'm not narrating your life I am otherwise thinking about you - I'm not.

I know nothing of your personality or demeanour other than what I see on here, and for all I know you could be a 40 stone trucker from Wigan. I just respond to the words on the page.

Gender critical beliefs are protected in law. I am not sure how many legal actions it's going to take for people to understand that.

Galaxy

Gender critical beliefs are protected in law. I am not sure how many legal actions it's going to take for people to understand that.

Yes, I wonder how it would work if 65,000 people were banned from a group for expressing a legal opinion?

I suppose it depends on the group and their T&Cs, but it seems a bit drastic. VS said it happened 'quite often', too. I wonder why it's stayed under the radar.