What's the point of a Prince of Wales?

We aren’t elevating anybody.

Do you understand what elevating means? Guess not.

"We" are the state, the country, the nations who allow this to happen. I'm learning that some just accept the status quo because we've always done it that way, and some think we have agency. You have a choice about going to see football matches or to the cinema, or even watching TV. You don't have a choice about our head of state. That's the point.

We aren’t elevating anybody. I have nothing to do with it and their position existed before I was born.
Elevating footballers, film stars, ‘celebrities’ who appear out of nowhere and get paid immense sums which directly affect me (cost of attending football matches with DGS, or paying vastly inflated prices to take family to the cinema, or seeing my licence fee going to fund ‘celebrities) worries me far more.

I don’t get the ‘rule over us all’ phrase, Normandy Girl. Exactly how does the RF rule over us all? Do explain that please.
Now if you’re talking about Vladimir Putin ruling over Russia or even our “wonderful government” ruling over us, that would make more sense.

It amazes me how easily many people fall for the relentless PR campaigns on behalf of the heirs to the throne. The last 5 years have been a never ending praise campaign for the Cambridge's, Charles and particularly Camilla in order to prime the country to accept without question ,their suitability to rule over us all.
Judging by the comments on GN, they seem to have achieved that aim.

Mollygo

But Paddyanne there are also lots of people overly invested in what goes on in the RF simply in order to disapprove of it or criticise those who want to be ‘invested in it’, a bit like admiring a film star or a footballer or raving over a TV series.
I wonder if those so invested in repeatedly expressing disapproval or criticism of the RF get as much enjoyment out of that as those who are invested in enjoying hearing about the RF?

I don't enjoy criticising the RF, or anybody else for that matter.

The fact that you think its as simple as that is the problem; we are elevating people to be HoS or hangers-on to the HoS based purely on who their grandpa was. The purpose of a HoS isn't to give us enjoyment, its to carry out the duties of the HoS.

I've been wondering why it is that people are so invested in our late Queen. I think its that she made people feel good. Whether you are President of the US or a 5 year old with a bunch of flowers for her, her very presence was enough to make you happy. I'm not criticising that, but I don't need somebody in a palace to make me feel good. I want somebody as HoS who can actually make the country a better place.

Now, having a happy populace is a contributor to that, but for me, its not enough. Supporters of the RF often seem to regard republicans as churlish money-obsessed oafs with no sense of gratitude for what the sainted RF do for us.

And as we keep saying, that's my opinion and I'm entitled to it

AGAA4

Crikey! That's dispiriting Farzanah. True though.

Yes, dispiriting and true.

paddyann it comes back to the same thing. You think ‘it’s a problem’, but you aren’t able to influence those who don’t. You can only get a message through to people who are receptive to listening.

But Paddyanne there are also lots of people overly invested in what goes on in the RF simply in order to disapprove of it or criticise those who want to be ‘invested in it’, a bit like admiring a film star or a footballer or raving over a TV series.
I wonder if those so invested in repeatedly expressing disapproval or criticism of the RF get as much enjoyment out of that as those who are invested in enjoying hearing about the RF?

Some may not like it but that is how it works

The question, of course, is should it?

Its a problem because so many folk are too invested in lives that they have no control over or involvement in.You just have to look at posts on here from supposedly mature intelligent? women foaming at the mouth because Meghan or Harry said something and Kate is an angel incarnate ...lot of nonsense .
Maybe they need to get lives of their own.These poeple dont know who you are and care even less
its all a PR fantasy ,an archaic institution that really should have gone a long time ago .
Now we have a "King" who has done dodgy dealings with middle eastern princes ,had a peadophile ..or 2 as friends and was an adulterer.
What a great example to young folk he is..but at least unlike his ancestors he didn't chop his wife's head off or start a new religion so he could dump her .So alls well with Charles 111 ?

I don't think William is going to take up residence in Cardiff and rule over us with an iron fist.

If he supports Welsh interests, charities and sport (already he is the patron of Welsh Rugby) it gives all these a higher profile, highlights the needs of charities and of social problems.
Some may not like it but that is how it works.

Incidentally if the Queen's cortege had gone by the end of my road, I would have turned out to see it. (It didn't) That doesn't make me invested in the monarchy, just interested in observing historical events.
And why not?
My staunch Methodist grandma who was staying with us for 6 months, asked to be taken to watch the Pope go past in his popemobile.

It is a part of a whole. What is the point of any of it, you may ask? But either you do, or you don't.

Were people in York asked if they wanted the Duke of York, of those in Sussex, etc? It's a historical package, and as Aveline says- 'just words' ... There is no picking and choosing.

volver

^It’s only ‘a problem’ if you see it as one though volver, isn’t it?^

People don't mind having someone imposed on them because he's a nice bloke? That's OK until it's not a nice bloke.

It's really not all about money, either.

And there we have it, unfortunately that is exactly the reality. The mistake is thinking that people all think as deeply about things as we do, and form their opinions based on facts, when they actually don’t, and won’t, however much information is provided.

Our esteemed ex PM is a case in point.

Franbern

Farzanah

Perhaps Owain Glyndwr will rise once more to defend Wales from the threat of the English Prince.

The last welsh Prince of Wales. A visit to his parliament building is well worth while. Amazing how many of his plans for Wales (before the English killed him), are now realised.

Amazing how many of his plans for Wales (before the English killed him), are now realised.

Well there we are then!

No need for his ghost to rise up and defend us after all.
????????

It’s only ‘a problem’ if you see it as one though volver, isn’t it?

People don't mind having someone imposed on them because he's a nice bloke? That's OK until it's not a nice bloke.

It's really not all about money, either.

No, it’s a problem because, as an American friend put it

… "this particular rich family can be trusted to run things because... well they just can, I mean look how clean and fancy they are" isn't a great basis for a system of government.

Farzanah

Perhaps Owain Glyndwr will rise once more to defend Wales from the threat of the English Prince.

The last welsh Prince of Wales. A visit to his parliament building is well worth while. Amazing how many of his plans for Wales (before the English killed him), are now realised.

volver

^most won’t care enough to look beyond if they like him or not^

And therein lies the problem.

Also, I don't categorise being interested in observing historical events as being nosey. But I do see how many people are turning out to lay flowers etc. In a country where there is at least 50% support for a monarchy, that shouldn't come as a surprise.

It’s only ‘a problem’ if you see it as one though volver, isn’t it? There’s no doubt that many millions of people felt great affection for the Queen herself, and whether the national mood turns against Charles and/or William only time will tell. I stick by the belief that most people in the UK are conservative (with a small c), and if C&W stick by what they are doing about slimming the Royal Family costs to the nation down, they will stay, whatever noises the republican lobby makes because familiarity is comfortable.
I do really think it’s nosey just to go and watch a historical event because you can rather than because you care about it - particularly if it’s a hearse or viewing a coffin. I don’t get the motivation behind people doing that, I definitely wouldn’t, just so I could say ‘I was there’ - but each to their own (I’m not suggesting you would either!)

Crikey! That's dispiriting Farzanah. True though.

I’m not a fan of a hereditary monarchy, but appreciate that the Queen’s death is a significant historical occasion and one that it is important to recognise, and of course many want to show their love and appreciation for this long lived Queen.

I don’t agree that all those who are turning out in their thousands are necessarily “invested” in the Monarchy, but they want to acknowledge and take part in this historical event.

I believe that this country is on the cusp of change, where we will have to accept that we are no longer a big player on the world stage, our hitherto prosperity will wane, and where the importance and influence of the monarchy will decline.

most won’t care enough to look beyond if they like him or not

And therein lies the problem.

Also, I don't categorise being interested in observing historical events as being nosey. But I do see how many people are turning out to lay flowers etc. In a country where there is at least 50% support for a monarchy, that shouldn't come as a surprise.

PS and the Welsh do like Prince William, which I think will make a difference to how they perceive the Prince of Wales title being given to him. It’s like with politics, most won’t care enough to look beyond if they like him or not,

volver

I started this thread to ask about the imposition of a Prince of Wales on the Welsh, and what the role entailed, so thank you to everyone who has answered my questions.

There is a difference between the Royal family giving themselves made-up titles like Duke of Sussex, or Cambridge, and actually naming a person Prince of Wales, which I understand was historically the ruler of Wales.

Incidentally if the Queen's cortege had gone by the end of my road, I would have turned out to see it. (It didn't) That doesn't make me invested in the monarchy, just interested in observing historical events.

You may be right that some people have been watching the coffin procession out of that motivation volver, but sending a tribute or flowers is beyond idle curiosity in my opinion, and I can’t believe that everybody who has attended is just nosey. I’ve been surprised at how many people have been leaving tributes and turning out for events in Wales, it’s made me realise just how loved she was by so many people. I’m ambivalent about the monarchy myself, but the national mood at present is very pro royalist.

I started this thread to ask about the imposition of a Prince of Wales on the Welsh, and what the role entailed, so thank you to everyone who has answered my questions.

There is a difference between the Royal family giving themselves made-up titles like Duke of Sussex, or Cambridge, and actually naming a person Prince of Wales, which I understand was historically the ruler of Wales.

Incidentally if the Queen's cortege had gone by the end of my road, I would have turned out to see it. (It didn't) That doesn't make me invested in the monarchy, just interested in observing historical events.

People all over the UK have cared enough about the Queen to turn out in their hundreds of thousands, including in Wales and Scotland. I can’t imagine why they would do that unless they were invested in the monarchy. It’s not just media hype that’s behind the response, people have been leaving flowers and tributes, and turning out because they cared. I don’t see the people being hysterical in any way, just sad. Your personal opinion doesn’t change the reality of the situation Rowantree.