So, who votes for a government that improves the lives of Bankers, and ensures the excessive profits of energy companies, but needs all the "levelling up" money to pay for the holes in Brexit?

It all depends on how the bonuses are paid. They do not have to be cash bonuses, they can include share options or investment opportunities, which would mean they would not be taxed at the same rate.
There is a strong case for a wealth tax. This is interesting check out ukwealth.tax The report of the Wealth Tax Commission. There's a short video showing how much a one-off wealth tax would bring in.

FYI - the employees' NIC rate above the upper earnings limit of £50270 is 3.25%.

Do you mean the salaries of paid carers or family carers?

Paid carers in the social care system are generally paid by a combination of local authority funding (through council tax) and care to contribution from their clients. There used to be funding from central government but I'm not sure if this has changed, I know it was heavily reduced

Family carers who earn less than £100 and something a week can claim carers allowance from dwp if their loved one is meets the threshold for medium/high rate dla/pip or AA afaik but it's less than £70 a week.

Thanks for explaining re tax.

Doodledog, a reduced rate of NI is paid over and above the upper earnings limit.

There’s now talk of lifting that tax on sugar that was imposed because of childhood obesity. Strange isn’t it that Tate and Lyle were pro leave and are obviously chums with the ERG….

Just as an aside.

Kwartang thinks bankers need more money, but thinks that doctors are overpaid..

Priorities!

They don’t, however, pay NI on anything over the cap, so nothing from the bonuses funds pensions or social care or benefits - the sorts of things that make such an enormous difference to those who live on them (or who have to work for so long before being able to claim them). Are the salaries of carers paid out of NI? I’m not sure (although it seems likely), but if so the fact that bonuses are not subject to NI does directly impact on the rank inequality between bankers and care workers (as an example of different groups in a supposedly meritocratic system).

Since the crash Investment banking is separated from Retail banking so any losses can’t affect consumer deposits.

Tax is of course payable on bonuses, what I’m not sure about is wether political donations are tax deductable, or to what extent.
I can’t believe that lifting the cap on a few dozen (several hundred?) bankers bonuses is going to make a big difference to the economy. It may however make a big difference to Tory Party donations for the next election.

Why can't people just go outside and clap for them, if they perform well?

There seems to be a perception that bankers don’t pay tax on their bonuses. They do, and they are subject to the PAYE system as they are employees, not self-employed.

I have already said, WWM, that regulations affecting the financial sector have been considerably tightened up since the crash.

GrannyGravy13

JaneJudge

I suppose lots of people who run small businesses are quite confused as to why these people manage to get such high bonuses tax free aswell

If the bonuses are performance related this SME owner has not got a problem.

But your employees will not take illegal risks resulting in a devastating crash, in order to achieve an even bigger bonus will they?

JaneJudge

or maybe they are not tax free...if not, how much are these bonuses taxed and where does that tax go

I think you will find that tax is payable on bonuses.

JaneJudge

I suppose lots of people who run small businesses are quite confused as to why these people manage to get such high bonuses tax free aswell

If the bonuses are performance related this SME owner has not got a problem.

It's not new is it? The Conservative Party has always supported those that make huge donations to it - bankers, large corporations, etc. While other countries are levying a windfall tax on the energy industry, our government borrows money so that they can continue paying large dividends to their shareholders at the expense of ordinary people and businesses. And then, by whom does that money have to be repaid? Take a wild guess.

Ditto the water companies. Truss is talking tough with them - a good vote catcher - but I wonder if the talk will be followed up with action.

The issue is that this bonus for bankers will not grow the economy.

We need to export, and we need to provide for ourselves, so we have fewer imports. We are doing neither. This is just making a small number of people even wealthier. They will then, no doubt, fund the "Conservative" party.

We will find the supply of home-grown foods becoming shorter next year as more farmers are affected by the lack of workers. Will there be enough Turkeys for Christmas after the mess of last year?

Exporting is a joke. One cheese company cannot export its Chedder because the health certificate they need costs more than they get for the cheese. All the trade agreements we made with countries the EU had agreements with have been worse than the ones we had through them.

Those in this newly formed government are no different from those who went before them. It is likely they will actually manage to be worse for most of us.

Urmstongran

Well, well ...

“The Bank of England has backed Kwasi Kwarteng's plan to scrap the cap on bankers’ bonuses in a rare public intervention, as ministers plot a bonfire of red tape dubbed “Big Bang 2.0”.

Threadneedle Street said it had never supported the cap, which was imposed before Brexit, and added that there are more effective measures to stop excessive risk-taking by bankers.

Kwasi Kwarteng, the Chancellor, is mulling a move to scrap the banker bonus cap introduced by EU legislation in 2014 despite the political difficulties of unchaining City pay at a time of soaring living costs.”

(Source: Telegraph just now).

- not just the nasty Tories & their mates then??

I've missed something, I think. UG. Who, in that article, is unlikely to agree with the new ERG government?

Probably not. But then again, Threadneedle Street ought to be separate from populist idealism one would think?

They are no longer tuned in to the zeitgeist.

From the same article:

“Andrew Bailey, Governor of the Bank of England, said last year that the cap is not “the best way to address remuneration” while his predecessor Mark Carney also criticised the policy.

Professor Len Shackleton, research fellow at the Institute of Economic Affairs, said the cap is “typical EU overstretch”

Well, well ...

“The Bank of England has backed Kwasi Kwarteng's plan to scrap the cap on bankers’ bonuses in a rare public intervention, as ministers plot a bonfire of red tape dubbed “Big Bang 2.0”.

Threadneedle Street said it had never supported the cap, which was imposed before Brexit, and added that there are more effective measures to stop excessive risk-taking by bankers.

Kwasi Kwarteng, the Chancellor, is mulling a move to scrap the banker bonus cap introduced by EU legislation in 2014 despite the political difficulties of unchaining City pay at a time of soaring living costs.”

(Source: Telegraph just now).

- not just the nasty Tories & their mates then??

or maybe they are not tax free...if not, how much are these bonuses taxed and where does that tax go

I suppose lots of people who run small businesses are quite confused as to why these people manage to get such high bonuses tax free aswell

I earned a lot as a City lawyer but didn’t find that unconscionable. I don’t use the word ‘earned’ lightly. I took nothing away from anyone but contributed, and continue to contribute, plenty in both taxes and charitable donations. Yes, workers in some, primarily public, sectors should be paid more but how is being an ‘unconscionably’ high earner in the private sector detrimental to them?
In itself, it isn't. But that wasn't my point, which was that bankers' bonuses are often not performance-related, and can be more than, say, a care worker can earn in years. Not only that, but as NI contributions are capped, bankers don't pay as much towards things like pensions, care homes and so on as a percentage of their incomes. It is access to things like this that are far more important than whether someone drives a Lamborghini or a Robin Reliant - they are literally life changing.

If bonuses were taxed fairly, NI contributions charged with no cap and everyone paid in (with employers funding those whose wages are too low, and the state funding those who are unable to work) then there would be more money to spend on pensions, sick pay etc, as well as general social spending, and everyone would benefit.

It is not the bonuses themselves that I find objectionable, although I don't agree that the system is meritocratic, but the fact that the tax system is heavily skewed against PAYE workers who have no-one to manage their taxation and who are more likely to rely exclusively on state provision of things like education, pensions and health and social care. IMO these should be funded from progressive taxation, which should be much higher for high earners and paid back at point of need to everyone who has contributed - from the lowest paid to the highest. After everyone is provided for, I think that high earners should keep what they earn with clear conscience.

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