So, who votes for a government that improves the lives of Bankers, and ensures the excessive profits of energy companies, but needs all the "levelling up" money to pay for the holes in Brexit?

Saetana

I have neither the time nor the inclination to read through ten pages of posts so... What is the problem with removing the cap on bankers bonuses? Its not coming out of public money - in fact said bankers will be paying hefty taxes on those bonuses and, let's face it, the treasury could do with all the money they can get at the moment. This was an EU rule that they themselves are in the process of relaxing - we need to remain competitive as the world's second largest financial centre. What on earth you are going on about regarding levelling up money going to pay for the holes in Brexit I have no idea? Care to elaborate and provide some proof of your allegation?

I have spent ten pages trying to get an answer to a very simple question. I have asked this question because some posters have asserted that the public, 'the taxpayer' or whatever you like to call them, is not affected by the removal of the cap on banker's bonuses.

The inability to answer this question, to trace the money received to its source is illuminating.

Whoever it is must have short memories. Unregulated bankers’ bonuses led to greedy risk takers causing the financial crisis, 10 years of austerity and tax payers baling out the banks. There again no surprise the Tory right claim this will promote growth whilst criticising working class pay claims will fuel inflation. Unfortunately recent events have allowed such policies to be announced without scrutiny which will further delayed/avoided with the onset of party conferences. By the time they are done we will have been without a functioning government for 6 months

Germanshepherdsmum

That’s a rather fatuous question isn’t it? Where do you think? From their profits - or perhaps they shouldn’t deal with banks but go to the wall?

Not a fatuous question at all. I know it comes from their profits.

Where does the money that comprises their profits come from?

Yes were indoctrinated about it as children “the rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate.” It is a left over from medieval times. Then as industry took over the Tories sold themselves as being good with the economy??, which propaganda has stood them in good stead, - not sure how they are going to explain away the past decade though as the voter gradually wakes up to the disaster awaiting the country.

silverlining48

It’s known as the working class Tory vote. A conundrum for all sociologists.

The author, John Steinbeck, possibly had an answer to this conundrum when he explained why he thought socialism never too root in America, because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat, but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.

Of course, he was talking about Americans, but I think the same could be applied to the UK, or England anyway.

Or maybe because we've been indoctrinated to believe that a Tory government is the 'natural order' of things?

I have neither the time nor the inclination to read through ten pages of posts so... What is the problem with removing the cap on bankers bonuses? Its not coming out of public money - in fact said bankers will be paying hefty taxes on those bonuses and, let's face it, the treasury could do with all the money they can get at the moment. This was an EU rule that they themselves are in the process of relaxing - we need to remain competitive as the world's second largest financial centre. What on earth you are going on about regarding levelling up money going to pay for the holes in Brexit I have no idea? Care to elaborate and provide some proof of your allegation?

But all this depends on an increasing population. For the bankers and the rich to get richer the economy needs more wretches at the bottom to struggle. The riches come from the struggle which produces energy. Heat rises. It does not trickle down.

Fleurpepper

Prentice

Germanshepherdsmum

You know which way I vote and will continue to vote. I trust that answers your question.

There should be no judgements made about the way that any of us vote, it is a personal thing.
We can judge governments for their policies of course, and that does go for all political parties.

Sorry, I am afraid that when someone makes choices that seriously affect others in a very negative way- not just in their pocket, but their education, their health, their life chances, their choices of eat or heat- then it is no longer ' a personal thing'. Same when someone votes to ruin the very country and plunges it into deep recession.

Well said Fleurpepper. The UK government appears to be taking us back not just decades but centuries, increasing the inequality and actually putting lives, not just life choices, at risk.

MaizieD

Germanshepherdsmum

Maizie how much of a bank’s profit goes into the pocket of the man in the street? According to your philosophy none because you insist that tax doesn’t fund government expenditure. However he might be paying into a pension scheme which invests in bank shares, How much comes out of his pocket? Does he have a mortgage, loan or overdraft (at historically low interest rates)? Maybe he still has a job because his employer has negotiated a loan facility?
Does that answer your question?

Nope.

I asked where does the money come from that the commercial enterprises pay to the bank by way of interest and bank fees.

It is indeed an excellent question and I'd love to hear the answer too.

Prentice

Germanshepherdsmum

You know which way I vote and will continue to vote. I trust that answers your question.

There should be no judgements made about the way that any of us vote, it is a personal thing.
We can judge governments for their policies of course, and that does go for all political parties.

Sorry, I am afraid that when someone makes choices that seriously affect others in a very negative way- not just in their pocket, but their education, their health, their life chances, their choices of eat or heat- then it is no longer ' a personal thing'. Same when someone votes to ruin the very country and plunges it into deep recession.

I think the rich are getting richer and the poor, poorer.
I will never vote Conservative, tho I have a great deal of respect for some who got chucked out in the Brexit period, and won't pre-judge until we see how politicians care for - ALL - with a strong moral compass and real integrity. And I seek for people in powerful positions in society - industry, financiers, who also have that strong moral compass, to try and make life better for all.

volver

Just wondering what kind of person would vote for a government that has ruined the country. But then I read this thread, and all is revealed.

I know it's awful but if I don't turn off the computer my husband may divorce me and things might be even worse

That’s a rather fatuous question isn’t it? Where do you think? From their profits - or perhaps they shouldn’t deal with banks but go to the wall?

Germanshepherdsmum

JaneJudge

I'm a skilled craftsperson/artist. I wish some money was brought my way. I'm exploited by people

You can only be exploited by people if you allow them to exploit you. Unfortunately the skills you mention don’t tend to be highly rewarded, so it’s a matter of choice isn’t it? Many of us (me included) don’t work at what we enjoy, rather at what best pays the bills.

You know I have cared for my daughter since she was born and you know she has a severe disability and you know I have had no family support. Do you get off on this?
I have had no choice
I am highly skilled though. Not many people can do what I do at all and I enjoy my skill, that's life
that's what all the people say

Germanshepherdsmum

Maizie how much of a bank’s profit goes into the pocket of the man in the street? According to your philosophy none because you insist that tax doesn’t fund government expenditure. However he might be paying into a pension scheme which invests in bank shares, How much comes out of his pocket? Does he have a mortgage, loan or overdraft (at historically low interest rates)? Maybe he still has a job because his employer has negotiated a loan facility?
Does that answer your question?

Nope.

I asked where does the money come from that the commercial enterprises pay to the bank by way of interest and bank fees.

Yes Cossy, I was a struggling single mother too, choosing between eating and feeding my child. I too remarried but didn’t have the good fortune of having more children, If you choose to believe I am devoid of compassion and empathy, fine. I don’t have to impress you. Those who matter know the truth.

I have no idea how many on GN vote Conservative GSM.
I do not and never have.

Germanshepherdsmum

You don’t know the half of it Cossy, but carry on assuming. You might believe I had choices - just carry on doing so. Please don’t make assumptions about my friends - you are so wrong.

Perhaps, my dear, we would both do well to stop making assumptions about each other. I don’t need to “admit” I vote Tory, because I no longer do so. I did in latter days because I was brought up in a very middle class very right wing family and to be perfectly honest I knew nothing about “real life” until later in life I had a complete career change and became a civil servant in a public facing role. I saw an entirely direct side of life and also was a single Mum for 9 years until I met my married my now husband and had 3 more children. My life experiences have made me a far more compassionate and empathic person that I was in my twenties and I’m now forever grateful of the good things and people in my life. I guess we all have a story and can all be judgemental and make assumptions.

Just wondering what kind of person would vote for a government that has ruined the country. But then I read this thread, and all is revealed.

Judge away. How anyone votes is their concern only. None of your business. Are you trying to control voting as well as posting?

If anyone votes Conservative next time around, I'll be doing quite a lot of judging.

I agree Prentice, but few on GN will admit to being Conservative voters.

Maizie how much of a bank’s profit goes into the pocket of the man in the street? According to your philosophy none because you insist that tax doesn’t fund government expenditure. However he might be paying into a pension scheme which invests in bank shares, How much comes out of his pocket? Does he have a mortgage, loan or overdraft (at historically low interest rates)? Maybe he still has a job because his employer has negotiated a loan facility?
Does that answer your question?

Germanshepherdsmum

You know which way I vote and will continue to vote. I trust that answers your question.

There should be no judgements made about the way that any of us vote, it is a personal thing.
We can judge governments for their policies of course, and that does go for all political parties.

You don’t know the half of it Cossy, but carry on assuming. You might believe I had choices - just carry on doing so. Please don’t make assumptions about my friends - you are so wrong.