So it is going to be Sunak

Jack-the-lads are 10 a penny these days. Council estates as well as wealthy. When you see a single mum on tv being interviewed I often think ‘where’s the dad in all this?’. Sorry but although I understand occasionally these mums are widowed very young or were in an abusive relationship, for many it IS a lifestyle choice.

There is a great deal of politicking on this forum - by people who are not particularly good at it

What on earth does that mean?

Do you mean to sound offensive DaisyAnne or do you not realise that you're doing it?

"I did not say appointing Braverman was a move away from party politics."

And my reply didn't claim that you did. DaisyAnne

Appointing Braverman is not the way to move away from personality politics, it's the opposite of that. In fact Sunak seems to have appointed several "personalities" into the cabinet , none of them with a reputation for "integrity, accountability and responsibility" that he promised. Normandygirl

There is a great deal of politicking on this forum - by people who are not particularly good at it. I did not say appointing Braverman was a move away from party politics. I said that if he is working towards normalising government away from personality politics (it) may be a step along the way.

Not at all as you reported it.

Whitewavemark2

Braverman has done it for me. Unbelievable!

Dreadful, dreadful woman.

But you were never going to give them a chance. Saying someone has now "done it" for you cannot be the truth. It was already your opinion - often put forward on these boards. You hadn't, in any way, relaxed your view on the Tory government.

Urmstongran

^Johnson moralising about other men's behaviour with women is a bit hard to take seriously.^

Eh?
As far as I’m aware none of his women who have had babies to him have ever claimed ‘single parent’ benefit.

Some women actually do see the taxpayer as the ‘father’. I think that’s what Boris was getting at.

Yes Urms, I know what he was getting at - the article he wrote made it quite clear.

And growstuff has said exactly what I was going to say in reply.

You can be a jack-the-lad with women - provided you are wealthy.

What you're saying is that it's OK to behave like an irresponsible cad, provided you have money.

Strange definition of morality!

Urmstongran

^Johnson moralising about other men's behaviour with women is a bit hard to take seriously.^

Eh?
As far as I’m aware none of his women who have had babies to him have ever claimed ‘single parent’ benefit.

Some women actually do see the taxpayer as the ‘father’. I think that’s what Boris was getting at.

What percentage of the total?

Johnson moralising about other men's behaviour with women is a bit hard to take seriously.

Eh?
As far as I’m aware none of his women who have had babies to him have ever claimed ‘single parent’ benefit.

Some women actually do see the taxpayer as the ‘father’. I think that’s what Boris was getting at.

Whitewavemark2

?? love this

Terrific Whitewavemark yes I think she'll go sooner the better and no have no idea who could replace her but Sunak has a brain cell or three (tho don't like his politics) and he might well find an "outsider".

We can only hope ..... the problem is that available replacements have nothing whatever to recommend them. What a shambles.

Braverman will go. Not soon enough but she will go

I think so too.

?? love this

DaisyAnne

Normandygirl

I appreciate that there has been a feeling of hope and relief that Truss and Johnson are gone, but Sunak is not the answer to the problem, he is part of the problem. Sunak brought back Braverman as part of a "grubby deal" deal to get him the nomination. If you have the idea that Sunak has some sort of integrity, "good sense", etc then you haven't looked at his ACTUAL record in office, his professed ideology, the rhetoric used in his last leadership bid, his involvement in Partygate and his lack of transparency about his wealth and tax affairs. He's rotten, the Party he leads is rotten, the political and economic consensus he helps prop up is rotten. Austerity has failed, and this rot has been setting in since the 2008 crash. I suppose that illusions are by their nature sweet but we can't afford to be this naive - our communities, public services and some people's lives depend on getting rid of the Tories, as well as understanding what they are and what they are doing. That's not necessarily hate and bile, it's clarity and seeing our situation as how it is, not how we may like it to be

He may not be the ultimate answer Normandygirl, but working towards normalising government away from personality politics may be a step along the way. I hope so.

He believes in what he is doing, just as much as the Labour Party leadership believes in what they are doing. They all "play" the politics game.

Braverman will go. Not soon enough but she will go. And that will be a step towards better government which, from my perspective, would include ridding ourselves of a very far-right government. But others will see "better government" differently. I don't believe I can object to that as long as they are led by the facts and not by the fiction that can come from both sides at times.

Appointing Braverman is not the way to move away from personality politics, it's the opposite of that. In fact Sunak seems to have appointed several "personalities" into the cabinet , none of them with a reputation for "integrity, accountability and responsibility" that he promised.

Normandygirl

I appreciate that there has been a feeling of hope and relief that Truss and Johnson are gone, but Sunak is not the answer to the problem, he is part of the problem. Sunak brought back Braverman as part of a "grubby deal" deal to get him the nomination. If you have the idea that Sunak has some sort of integrity, "good sense", etc then you haven't looked at his ACTUAL record in office, his professed ideology, the rhetoric used in his last leadership bid, his involvement in Partygate and his lack of transparency about his wealth and tax affairs. He's rotten, the Party he leads is rotten, the political and economic consensus he helps prop up is rotten. Austerity has failed, and this rot has been setting in since the 2008 crash. I suppose that illusions are by their nature sweet but we can't afford to be this naive - our communities, public services and some people's lives depend on getting rid of the Tories, as well as understanding what they are and what they are doing. That's not necessarily hate and bile, it's clarity and seeing our situation as how it is, not how we may like it to be

He may not be the ultimate answer Normandygirl, but working towards normalising government away from personality politics may be a step along the way. I hope so.

He believes in what he is doing, just as much as the Labour Party leadership believes in what they are doing. They all "play" the politics game.

Braverman will go. Not soon enough but she will go. And that will be a step towards better government which, from my perspective, would include ridding ourselves of a very far-right government. But others will see "better government" differently. I don't believe I can object to that as long as they are led by the facts and not by the fiction that can come from both sides at times.

DaisyAnne

MayBee70

Did anyone hear the interview with someone in a red wall constituency who said he didn’t like Rishi because he was rich. The interviewer pointed out that Johnson was rich too but it seems he’s different. I can’t remember what his reasoning was

I think he said that Johnson was a man of the people MayBee. You have to wonder what people.

Those who think Johnson is a "man of the people" haven't read his comments on 'blue collar' workers - or their counterparts 'white collar' workers, although the comments were made about men in general in relation to the 'proliferation' of single mothers.

Johnson moralising about other men's behaviour with women is a bit hard to take seriously.

I appreciate that there has been a feeling of hope and relief that Truss and Johnson are gone, but Sunak is not the answer to the problem, he is part of the problem. Sunak brought back Braverman as part of a "grubby deal" deal to get him the nomination. If you have the idea that Sunak has some sort of integrity, "good sense", etc then you haven't looked at his ACTUAL record in office, his professed ideology, the rhetoric used in his last leadership bid, his involvement in Partygate and his lack of transparency about his wealth and tax affairs. He's rotten, the Party he leads is rotten, the political and economic consensus he helps prop up is rotten. Austerity has failed, and this rot has been setting in since the 2008 crash. I suppose that illusions are by their nature sweet but we can't afford to be this naive - our communities, public services and some people's lives depend on getting rid of the Tories, as well as understanding what they are and what they are doing. That's not necessarily hate and bile, it's clarity and seeing our situation as how it is, not how we may like it to be

Thanks for that Wyllow can’t do links on my iPad. I didn’t know they’d done another.

Yes, totally fab, here it is if you missed it. (I'm a big Marsh family fan!)but there are TWO

One when she went, one now she is back!

Just 11 hours old

do enjoy both.

1. www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDYj9TLq9Qg

2. www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqWeSZsVjKE

Did anyone see the brilliant Marsh family’s clever parody sea shanty adaptation on YouTube about Braverman when she left? Pity she’s back again. “Braverman Shanty”.

Urmstongran

Mr Sunak told a BBC documentary in 2007 that he had friends across all social classes, before awkwardly admitting “well, not working class”.

That remark was referring to friends he made at Winchester School, so perhaps not surprising if WC friends were lacking there.
(That is, if it’s the same interview I saw the other day.)

Yep, business as usual! Right wing Tory self-serving, elitist cabinet. Nothing new here!

This is a very right wing government, although I shouldn’t be surprised.m

Sunak said he was going to fulfil the Conservative manifesto from when they won the 2019 election, so why the surprise at his cabinet appointments?

Braverman has done it for me. Unbelievable!

Dreadful, dreadful woman.