Nurses Strike -Do you support? What will it look like?

MaddyB

My apologies, MaddyB. I see you got in before me with the facts.

But GrannyRose what about the actual facts?

2020convert

ginnycomelately

Having nursed for 50 years I sadly cannot condone nurses striking , Since project 2000 nursing has become a degree only profession,What about all the other people who would make good nurses, but don’t want the degree route , Apprenticeship, actually learning under supervision on the wards would surely be really good alternative and supply some really good nurses:
Please do not condone the management structure sadly that takes a third of the NHS budget and even more sadly most are not fit for purpose

So agree with this. No, I’ve never been a nurse, but have thought the same re degree qualifications and the NHS missing out on “natural nurses” who are not academics. The NHS is far too too heavy and PFI hospitals and outsourcing cleaning and catering etc have not helped

I have worked with nursing students on a degree course and can tell you that the ones that were most compassionate and had a natural empathy were generally the ones who were struggling academically.

It is such a shame that we lose out on so many who would potentially make good nurses because we insist that there is only one way to train them.

My own, albeit limited, experience in hospital bears out my conviction that we are not getting the right people into nursing.

growstuff

But GrannyRose what about the actual facts?

I refer you to my previous post.

UK plc is bankrupt, we are still paying off the £70 billion cost of furloughing during the pandemic.
I do not agree with the strikes. Most people would like a better paid, better perk job (pension, leave etc). Just glad that I have a job in this difficult economic climate. Nursing can be difficult at times but so too can other jobs that do not attract such good pension and leave schemes, including massive amounts of paid sick leave that have to be covered by agency staff.

A country with its own sovereign currency, including the UK, can never be bankrupt.

If people want a better paid, "better perk" job, what's stopping them from training to be nurses, if you reckon it's such a cushy number?

GrannyRose15

growstuff

But GrannyRose what about the actual facts?

I refer you to my previous post.

I posted a link to ONS stats on private and public sector wage growth. Those are sourced facts.

GrannyRose15

2020convert

ginnycomelately

Having nursed for 50 years I sadly cannot condone nurses striking , Since project 2000 nursing has become a degree only profession,What about all the other people who would make good nurses, but don’t want the degree route , Apprenticeship, actually learning under supervision on the wards would surely be really good alternative and supply some really good nurses:
Please do not condone the management structure sadly that takes a third of the NHS budget and even more sadly most are not fit for purpose

So agree with this. No, I’ve never been a nurse, but have thought the same re degree qualifications and the NHS missing out on “natural nurses” who are not academics. The NHS is far too too heavy and PFI hospitals and outsourcing cleaning and catering etc have not helped

I have worked with nursing students on a degree course and can tell you that the ones that were most compassionate and had a natural empathy were generally the ones who were struggling academically.

It is such a shame that we lose out on so many who would potentially make good nurses because we insist that there is only one way to train them.

My own, albeit limited, experience in hospital bears out my conviction that we are not getting the right people into nursing.

I'm afraid my experience over the last few months doesn't support that. I have been blown away by the professionalism, knowledge and compassion of all the nurses I've come in contact with.

I’ve had considerable experiences of nurses in various roles over the past 7 months. Frequently, Three days a week of direct contact with nurses and doctors. The last 8 days of my husband’s life were made less horrific by the support he and his family received, particularly from nursing and ancillary staff. During end of life care, we spent 24 hours a day for 4 days in a side room on the ward. We had two specialist nurses responsible for his care , one throughout the day, her colleague took over at night.
Yes I support the nurses who have been driven to strike. 12 years if unnecessary austerity has devastated public service, including the nhs.
Nurses shouldn’t have to pay to train, shouldn’t have to pay to park,

National minimum wage is £9.50/hr
x 40 hr week x 52 weeks = £19760
I’m not saying nurses are getting enough, I’m saying that minimum wage is a tiny amount that no one should be taxed on.

I agree Grannyrose. I was taken,by ambulance,to A&E during the pandemic with a kidney stone. It was like a war zone with bed literally everywhere along the corridors and waiting areas,and with plastic sheeting strung between them.. but the quality of care I received from the ambulance staff, auxillaries, nurses and doctors was exceptional. They were literally running around and yet caring,compassionate and very skilled. I think we should cherish the NHS and do all in our power to ensure that it is not privatised... we walked into Brexit on a lie about the NHS and I think the government is deliberately running it down now... There are several action groups eg Save our NHS that people can join if they care enough...

My experience has been that various specialisms have worked together effectively. I had initial consultations with doctors (a surgeon and then an oncologist and radiologist), who decided which care pathways I should follow. Nurses were present at the consultations, took notes, entered details on the system and were responsible for referring me to the next stage. They've also been available via the online messaging service. After the initial consultations, nurses have held their own surgeries and been responsible for my care. In the past, doctors would have held the outpatient surgeries, but nurses are doing them at a fraction of the cost.

Portmeanne

I was a nurse for 38 years .
I was very aware that I could have earned more in other professions - however I think that given the good pension + job security I was prepared to earn less.
Yes other professions have better salaries but do not have the good pensions + security. You can not have everything !
I am now retired on a good pension and my job was never at risk.

I do not support the strike - they will only make things ( staffing levels + waiting lists ) worse - and no guarantee of a better pay rise.

Except there are no nhs great pensions anymore🙄....any pension taken before state pension age will be greatly penalised.....so that you're actually saying is....
Its OK for nurses today to pay for your great pension out of their taxes and NI ..
which you were able to take at 55.... but they shouldn't strike .....shame on you ....this is a disgusting comment

Considering we paid consultants £6000 per day and wasted £37 billion on track and trace, the government can find the money to pay their mates. Nurses are underpaid and should receive a significant pay increase. I fully support the strike.

ruthiek

I bet many people would do love that sort of pay along with the gold plated pension.
I think nurses should get a pay rise but why should they get more than others ?

Another ignoramus spouting rubbish 🙄

Nurses in Scotland have been offered a flat rate pay rise as (apparently) requested by the union who advised they accept ,
This offer meant a low of 5.4% and a high of 11% depending where on the payscale they sit .
Nurses in Scotland DONT pay for parking ..its free in Hospitals ,they get bursaries and dont have Uni fees to pay .
I hear from my neighbour who is a nurse practitioner that the RCN advised the offer was refused to keep the whole UK in line.
The Scottish government has funded 750 nurses from abroad to help with the shortage...not nearly enough as we all know
,but there is a shortage in a lot of countries.Maybe a nursing auxiliary system where no Uni education is needed would be the answer ? I remember auxiliaries from my stays in maternity when they did a lot of things nurses are doing now

HCA’s are the equivalent of Nursing Auxiliaries in England PaddyAnne54

they should be called nurses imo

Just to clarify, all student nurses (and other NHS professional students) get bursaries paddyann54, not exclusively Scottish nurses. Nobody pays for parking in Wales either, government policy.
I do agree with the RCN Strategy of holding the line between the different countries of the UK, as there’s a danger of a settlement being reached in one that is exceeded by a jointly negotiated agreement on behalf of all nurses, which will cause dissatisfaction and staff movement, as has happened with the separately negotiated medical pay awards.

Not all ballots have closed yet. My trust’s ballot closes on 25th November. I think the majority of trusts are likely to vote to strike. I’m really worried how this will impact on patient care. I work for an ambulance service and we are struggling to deliver care whilst working normal hours plus overtime so goodness knows how bad it will get if strikes happen. It’s not just nursing staff that have voted to strike paramedics and other health professionals are likely to take industrial action too. What worrying and challenging times these are.

A vocation yes but taken total advantage off yes! Soa y do extra hours because of staff shortage. Way behind on payrises compared to politicians and the rest at the top. Nurses using food banks shouldnt be a thing. Infact anyone using one. Lower paid staff get less than a shelf stacker in tescos but yet have so much responsibility. Claps don't pay bills. Nhs staff are not even protected anymore of they catch covid. Yet still have to work with active covid patients. Where is the fairness in that. They get penalized for working with high risk patients if they catch the illness. The world Haas gone mad. So yes the nhs staff will strike. Not just registered nurses but non registered staff also. The government needs to step up and make a decent payrise happen without us being penalized for the next three years because we dare to challenge a system that's gone so wrong.

Lower paid staff get less than a shelf stacker in tescos but yet have so much responsibility."

This is simply not true.

Starting salary for nurses is £27055

Shelf stackers in Tesco's get paid £10 per hour equating to a maximum of £20800. With far less generous benefits.

Pedalling mis-information doesn't help the argument.

growstuff

Private and public sector wage growth 2010-2017:

www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/articles/ispayhigherinthepublicorprivatesector/2017-11-16

Very interesting! But largely irrelevant to the current argument.

In what way irrelevant?

I stayed in a public service role despite earning less than colleagues who set up privately. Partly because I’m unhappy about profit making from safeguarding, partly because I knew the pension scheme was good.
Now that’s no longer the case, I understand why people leave public service