Latest Stop Oil protest targets a petrol station.

Solar panels on water rather than taking up precious land, and some are refined further.

www.bbc.com/future/article/20221116-the-floating-solar-panels-that-track-the-sun

Sorry about the misattribution, Volver, slip of the mind!

No, DD's research wasn't published, it was done for a client, so unpublished. I think it was gathered by a trawl and study of all available literature and double checked with work colleagues. At the time she worked for a big commercial research centre serving the engineering industry

M0nica I think you maybe meant me, not varian?

Regarding recyclability, I meant the actual fuel, not the car. I agree that huge parts of the car itself are recyclable.

Interesting research by your DD, thank you for posting that. Is it published somewhere?

varian huge quantities of a petrol car are recycled, all the metal, plastics, glass and many engine parts.

My DD was recently researching the environmental impact of batteries for electric cars. The conclusion she came to was that the making of an electric battery produced as much in emisssions as driving a petrol car for 100,000 miles.

The electricity used in electric cars, will include some generated by carbon neutral means, but much will come from power stations powered by gas.

Elctric cars are ideal for reducing pollution in inner cities and other places struggling with air pollution because the hydrocarbons consumed in providing their electricity are generated far from where the car is used.

Katek

This is a CAT994A.
It burns approximately 1,000 litres of fuel in 12
hours, moves approximately 250 tones of dirt
to extract the materials needed to make ONE
Tesla battery.
To make each battery, you need to treat:
- 12 tons of brine for lithium,
15 tons of ore for cobalt
- 3 tons of ore for nickel.
- 12 tons of ore for copper
And move 250 tons of the earth's crust.
For just - one - battery, which has about:
- 12 kg of lithium
- 30 kg of nickel
- 22 kg of manganese
- 15 kg of cobalt
- 100 kg of copper
- 200 kg of aluminum, steel and plastic
And people still believe in "zero emissions"
when they drive their electric cars.......

Just saying

Just wanted to make a point about this...

It is an erroneous set of exaggerated information from a tweet distributed by Australian senator Matt Canavan, to try to discredit the idea of electric cars. He also omits to mention that 90% of materials used in battery production are recyclable. Unlike 0% of the material used to power petrol powered cars.

Where I do agree is that electric cars are definitely not zero emissions, Very little is "zero emissions" in life. However electric cars have negligible emissions compared to those powered by the combustion engine. That's what we're aiming for. It might not be perfect, but we can make huge savings in end-to-end emissions by changing to electric cars. That's why we have to do it.

varian One of the problems with tidal power is that sea water is a corrosive substance and the technology to us tidal power was there, but because of the constant need to replace the equipment it was too expensive.

However, I understand these problems have now been overcome and that the first prototype commercial tidal power station is in operation maritime-executive.com/editorials/tidal-power-is-set-for-commercial-breakthrough-in-the-uk

The first tidal barrage was opened on the Rance estuary in Brittany in 1964 by General de Gaulle and is still operating.

There was a large scheeme in the UK to put tidal lagoons all along the Welsh coast www.walesonline.co.uk/business/business-news/tidal-lagoons-planned-coast-wales-12112608

However the scheme foundered in 2018 because the government refused to back it www.theguardian.com/business/2018/jun/25/government-rejects-plan-for-tidal-lagoon-in-swansea

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202211/medium-476885-3dd3787d-9ab1-465c-83c7-fc7b9e6469ae.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202211/medium-816045-d1a53e3e-2f97-4ae1-89ac-1d13058762ba.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202211/medium-754195-0c4c40cd-4bfa-46e2-801d-54cdad0fd040.jpeg

This is a CAT994A.
It burns approximately 1,000 litres of fuel in 12
hours, moves approximately 250 tones of dirt
to extract the materials needed to make ONE
Tesla battery.
To make each battery, you need to treat:
- 12 tons of brine for lithium,
15 tons of ore for cobalt
- 3 tons of ore for nickel.
- 12 tons of ore for copper
And move 250 tons of the earth's crust.
For just - one - battery, which has about:
- 12 kg of lithium
- 30 kg of nickel
- 22 kg of manganese
- 15 kg of cobalt
- 100 kg of copper
- 200 kg of aluminum, steel and plastic
And people still believe in "zero emissions"
when they drive their electric cars.......

Just saying

A friend of ours who was a research engineer in the 1970s worked on tidal power. His research did not get the funding it should have had then but why are we not funding it now?

Tidal power is totally predictable and could back up wind and solar just as well as nuclear or fossil fuel.

Ooh, don't know that one.

I was thinking more about solar (PV and thermal), wind, geothermal, hydrogen, hydro, tidal, biofuels, fusion (in the future)....

Alternative energy sources volver? Hot air perhaps.

We were telling them 40 years ago.

No-one listened then, either.

So simple isn’t it, telling the government of the day what should be done.
If the answer was simple it would be done already.

Oreo

You know the answer volver I suspect.

When it comes to alternative energy sources, you might be surprised about how many answers I know. 🤣🤣🤣

Sorry, undermining myself there....

In Clockwork Orange the violence became boring.

Just saying.

You know the answer volver I suspect.

Oh, this is my thing...

It certainly is enough.

If the government halted all future Oil and Gas exploration and devoted the money they put into supporting that, into the development of renewables, then there is more than enough capacity to replace the potential fossil fuels left in the ground.

We agree on the extreme methods alienating people though.

No I didn't miss that volver but it isn't enough on it's own is it certainly not at the moment. I do agree with you that the extreme measures they're using isn't helping their cause.

OK, I'll ask again.

Why?

M0nica

"Just Stop Oil is a coalition of groups working together to ensure that the government commits to ending all new licenses and consents for the exploration, development and production of fossil fuels in the UK."

Not simplistic? Of course it is.

Simplistic in the extreme.

I think that the extreme methods of Just Stop Oil are preventing people seeing what it is they are trying to achieve. That's the ending of all new licenses and consents for the exploration, development and production of fossil fuels in the UK.

No new licences. No more exploration or development. That's not the same as expecting you to buy a heat pump.

That's what we need. I don't think everybody is aware of the seriousness of our situation.

Renewables.

Did you miss that?

Why? Because unless I've missed something they haven't come up with an alternative.

Why?

"Just Stop Oil is a coalition of groups working together to ensure that the government commits to ending all new licenses and consents for the exploration, development and production of fossil fuels in the UK."

Not simplistic? Of course it is.

I thought that this might be interesting. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/nov/15/suffragette-grandmothers-heroes-climate-protesters-activists-traffic?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other